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Philosophy Thread: Socratic Virtue Theory! (pg. 3)
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| So, is rob no longer a dj? |
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| Psy-T |
| quote: | Originally posted by Slylee
| quote: | Originally posted by RJT
- Are knowledgeable people always what we would consider virtuous? |
no |
in other words, you don't agree with the main hypothesis whatsoever. |
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| Slylee |
| quote: | Originally posted by Psy-T
in other words, you don't agree with the main hypothesis whatsoever. |
'
exacatickaly |
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| prolikewhoa |
if you take a biblical example, ignorance was bliss, literally. when adam and eve didn't have knowledge they lived in paradise...how ironic that knowledge led to their expulsion from eden...
augustine would argue that knowledge (or rationaliy) leads to good ends. but the person has to have a good will in conjunction to the knowledge...
so basically, knowledge w/ ill will is bad, knowledge with good will yields good things.
hitler, obviously had ill will but vast knowledge...
in any case, knowledge is a powerful tool that can put you a place above your peers in some efforts. whether the virtue of knowledge is good or bad depends on the will of the person...
(i'm taking into to ethics lol) |
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| Moral Hazard |
| quote: | Originally posted by Omega_M
what does Object Truth mean ?
I don't get the difference between understanding and Perception. Isn't understanding actually perceiving something mentally ? Or do you make a distinction between mental perception and perception through senses. |
object truth means absolute truth - something that is always true regardless of context, interpretation, perception, etc. An object truth cannot ever be even the slightest bit inaccurate or incorrect.
Plato makes a difference between knowledge and perception. For Plato it is all about ideals which are objectly true or perfect if you will. What we perceive is what our senses can detect, however, perception does not equal truth. If you look at a chair you perceive it to be a chair, however, you do not know what a chair actually is because what you see is not the perfect/ideal chair but mearly a facsimile of what the perfect/ideal chair is. Until you find the perfect chair you only know the illusion of a chair rather then the true chair. |
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| Cuervo79 |
| quote: | Originally posted by RJT
- Was someone like Hitler simply ignorant, and this ignorance led to his perceived evil?
- Are knowledgeable people always what we would consider virtuous?
- What is knowledge, how do we define it? What about ignorance? - And can we ever have complete knowledge? Can we remove all ignorance?
And more broadly...
- Can we describe all events lacking in virtue as lacking in knowledge?
- Does knowledge always = good?
These may seem like incredibly stupid questions to some of you, but they've been pondered by philosophers for almost 3000 years, and I assure you that this morning I heard some of the most absurd responses you could imagine.
In any event, my interest was piqued this morning and I'd like to hear what some ofyou have to say about it. I don't really expect this thread will go very far as this is c0r, but meh - Perhaps some of your thoughts will entertain me :) |
1. Evil as with beauty is in the eye of the beholder
2. For me virtue (virtud in spanish) is something you come naturaly with, an ease to do something or understand things, so no not always knowlegeable people are not allways virtuous since sometimes they don't have the virtue in the area they have knowledge of.
3. the first part where knowledge is one, when it comes to absolute terms they allways backfire, I would go as to your question, for things to be understood you need the opposite, you can't have all the knowledge (absolute term) because you would negate ignorance (the term you use to compare in ordter to know what knowledge is) also in my opinion knowledge has no end therefore as you said "can we remove all ignorance?" no
4. no not really, as I said virtue as I understand it is something you have ease with you're a "natural" in. Not everyone is a natural at everything.
5. knowledge isn't good or bad, is the actions you do with it and the eye someone is looking through it that make it good or bad |
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| Omega_M |
do people really understand what others say in philosophy threads ?
Or do they want to appear philosophically minded by merely giving replies which make no sense whatsoever or has little relevance to the points made by others ? |
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| Psy-T |
| quote: | Originally posted by prolikewhoa
if you take a biblical example, ignorance was bliss, literally. when adam and eve didn't have knowledge they lived in paradise...how ironic that knowledge led to their expulsion from eden...
augustine would argue that knowledge (or rationaliy) leads to good ends. but the person has to have a good will in conjunction to the knowledge...
so basically, knowledge w/ ill will is bad, knowledge with good will yields good things.
hitler, obviously had ill will but vast knowledge...
in any case, knowledge is a powerful tool that can put you a place above your peers in some efforts. whether the virtue of knowledge is good or bad depends on the will of the person...
(i'm taking into to ethics lol) |
...
and who's to define what will is ill and what will is good? |
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| prolikewhoa |
| quote: | Originally posted by Omega_M
do people really understand what others say in philosophy threads ?
Or do they want to appear philosophically minded by merely giving replies which make no sense whatsoever or has little relevance to the points made by others ? |
maybe it's just over your head...it's okay :clown: |
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| Psy-T |
| quote: | Originally posted by Moral Hazard
object truth means absolute truth - something that is always true regardless of context, interpretation, perception, etc. An object truth cannot ever be even the slightest bit inaccurate or incorrect. |
and an example of which would be?
| quote: | Originally posted by Moral Hazard
Plato makes a difference between knowledge and perception. For Plato it is all about ideals which are objectly true or perfect if you will. What we perceive is what our senses can detect, however, perception does not equal truth. If you look at a chair you perceive it to be a chair, however, you do not know what a chair actually is because what you see is not the perfect/ideal chair but mearly a facsimile of what the perfect/ideal chair is. Until you find the perfect chair you only know the illusion of a chair rather then the true chair. |
i know the perfect chair of a model 'ABCDEFG12345' at points in time and space XYZ.
i know the perfect song by Depeche Mode named Enjoy The Silence playing on a pair of Sonab speakers of a model ABC, powered by a Sansui R-5 amplifier at this particular point in time and space. |
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| Moral Hazard |
| quote: | Originally posted by Omega_M
do people really understand what others say in philosophy threads ?
Or do they want to appear philosophically minded by merely giving replies which make no sense whatsoever or has little relevance to the points made by others ? |
If you've read any Plato this is basic stuff, if not then you probably don't belong in a thread discussing Plato. |
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| Psy-T |
| quote: | Originally posted by Omega_M
do people really understand what others say in philosophy threads ?
Or do they want to appear philosophically minded by merely giving replies which make no sense whatsoever or has little relevance to the points made by others ? |
just pretend we're all under 18 and all the confusion will go away. :rolleyes: |
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