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BT, as seen by Ishkur (pg. 8)
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| Ishkur |
| quote: | Originally posted by Clovis
Unfortunately you're no where near as imaginative a writer as Cusik. |
Well, most writers recognize that there is a trade-off, of sacrificing imaginative, sophomoric, freeform expositional thought exercises for coherency. |
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| distant |
| quote: | Originally posted by SMC
If there's anyone who's obsessed with the production techniques it's people like you. If you're aim is to judge the music you should be able to pretend you don't know anything about his production techniques or who he is. Then you could simply say you don't like his music, but that's not satisfiying, is it? You gotta convince everybody else there's something wrong it, and with BT you have all the perfect things to whine about. And seriously, why shouldn't someone be allowed to admire an artist for his technique (especially since you bash the artist because of it)? You tell others to judge the music while you rant about everything else that isn't the music. That's hypocritical to say the least. |
1st: TBU was marketed as math music. If BT thought nobody should care, then the details about its execution wouldn't even be known. So I'd say he's quite obsessed with over-production.
2nd: I'm actually not quite sure what you mean by "artist". Do you use it as a synonym for musician? If so, we're right back to judging the wrong person for the wrong things. If not, and it means something in addition to (in this case) musician, then I guess it's fine to judge him by his technique, as long as you don't let that taint your opinion of the music itself (which is often the case, I've noticed. It's a bit of a halo effect).
3rd: I am judging the music. I think it sucks, but then I go a bit further: I add "here's why" and go into why his pretentiousness/geekiness inhibits his artistic side (if he possesses one). That's just me, I like finding reasons why things are the way I perceive. By the way, if I were judging his programming and production skills, I'd say he's excellent. |
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| SMC |
| quote: | Originally posted by distant
1st: TBU was marketed as math music. If BT thought nobody should care, then the details about its execution wouldn't even be known. So I'd say he's quite obsessed with over-production.
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I don't know about "math music". But what BT has been talking about is all there. It's not like he lied and said there are multiple overlapping time signatures and whatnot and there isn't. It's all there. And apparently people find it interesting. I find it interesting, the interviews with BT etc, it's not that often a music lover can get a little bit of "behind the scenes".
And what part of TBU exactly constitutes "over-production"?
| quote: |
2nd: I'm actually not quite sure what you mean by "artist". Do you use it as a synonym for musician? If so, we're right back to judging the wrong person for the wrong things. If not, and it means something in addition to (in this case) musician, then I guess it's fine to judge him by his technique, as long as you don't let that taint your opinion of the music itself (which is often the case, I've noticed. It's a bit of a halo effect).
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An artist is a person who creates art, in this case music. |
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| Clovis |
| quote: | Originally posted by Ishkur
Well, most writers recognize that there is a trade-off, of sacrificing imaginative, sophomoric, freeform expositional thought exercises for coherency. |
Its funny how well Cusik's point ties right into this. You can have the skills but if you dont have the creativity, they are pretty much useless... |
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| movingincircles |
Ferry Corsten, anthem of the year? Are you kidding me?
Has this guy even heard the "Bring the Noise" remix yet? |
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| jvs |
Ishkur's work (including edmguide) is completely biased; it's non-sense. He has nothing other to do other than showing us his inability to describe why he don't like some musical advents. He's so poor, he always blames it on others. It is always because of music and its author... He likes to generalize, and mostly he likes to generalize the stuff he likes and he does...
On the other hand, many people like to talk about music on general level, as it was something that does not depend on one's musical experience. That's quite non-sense, and it does not lead anywhere. Waste of time.
At the end, some are obsessed with technical point of view in order to help people make much better music (whatever that means), while others are obsessed with ability/inability to describe WHY they like or don't like some musical advents, or in other words - obsessed with judging the music and its authors. Review geek? |
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| Dj EntycE |
| quote: | Originally posted by movingincircles
Ferry Corsten, anthem of the year? Are you kidding me?
Has this guy even heard the "Bring the Noise" remix yet? |
It didn't require much to know that he was speaking about his "classic" remixes... Gouryella tracks, Universal Nation remix, Madagascar remix, Force of Gravity bootleg, Synaesthesia, Barber's Adagio for Strings, etc...
Even though his sound right now is ty, the man still managed to bring up massive club hits back in the days... |
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| sean5 |
I am thoroughly convinced that this thread is born out of two things: sasha & digweed fans intimidated by someone with real talent and people who have never actually listened to BT.
http://www.discogs.com/artist/BT
Maybe this will refresh the memory of those who keep throwing around this 'lack of creativity' nonsense. |
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| Alex |
| quote: | Originally posted by sean5
I am thoroughly convinced that this thread is born out of two things: sasha & digweed fans intimidated by someone with real talent and people who have never actually listened to BT.
http://www.discogs.com/artist/BT
Maybe this will refresh the memory of those who keep throwing around this 'lack of creativity' nonsense. |
Sasha & Digweed are better than BT in every sense of ever, discuss. |
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| Gauss |
| quote: | Originally posted by Ishkur
Well, most writers recognize that there is a trade-off, of sacrificing imaginative, sophomoric, freeform expositional thought exercises for coherency. |
Be quiet. |
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| SYSTEM-J |
| quote: | Originally posted by distant
1st: TBU was marketed as math music. If BT thought nobody should care, then the details about its execution wouldn't even be known. So I'd say he's quite obsessed with over-production.
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Bull. The details of execution are always known in BT's albums. Somnambulist from Emotional Technology is in the Guiness Book of Records for its amount of vocal edits, but if you're going to tell me that Emotional Technology was an album marketed as maths music you're a ing idiot.
| quote: | | I am judging the music. I think it sucks, but then I go a bit further: I add "here's why" and go into why his pretentiousness/geekiness inhibits his artistic side (if he possesses one). That's just me, I like finding reasons why things are the way I perceive. |
BT's production skills are simply an easy stick to beat him with. As far as I'm concerned you're using it as a tool to lend weight to a purely subjective opinion. Since "creativity" or "artistry" are completely ambiguous, unmeasurable qualities, there's nothing to say what effect BT's production has on "his artistic side". The production techniques on TBU are hardly noticable: without reading an article on the album, I'd love for you to show me which bits are circuit bending, or composed in the Golden Ratio or written in code. It is the first BT album in a long time where the production doesn't sound detrimentally noticable. Therefore it's irrelevant to judging the record musically. And quite frankly, what it comes down to is whether you like it or not. If a melody or a rhythm or whatever doesn't work for you, it doesn't. There's absolutely no argument to say that This Binary Universe lacks artistry or creativity in any definable sense: all you can do is attach an arbitrary "artistic" value to a melody to try and make your opinion of it sound objective. |
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