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A question for the socialists (pg. 8)
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| StereoPrincess |
| quote: | Originally posted by malek
have you even thought about how those low income people got there in the first place? Obviously not. It's their right to skip school and/or having kids at 16 and/or doing drugs. |
lol. stupidest thing i have ever read. |
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| English Rachel |
MARGARET FOR PRESIDENT!!!!!!
My Polish sister, you speak the truth :) <3<3<3 |
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| StereoPrincess |
| quote: | Originally posted by Elendil
Fact is, with a flat tax, everyone has more money to dump into our economy, which means that more jobs will be higher paying, thereby meaning less lower income families all around. You seem to be equating tax money with direct personal benefit - however, as is INCREDIBLY apparent, money going to the government is basically money going into a giant financial black-hole. Your extra money is FAR better off going to charity than the government.
It's simpler and more prudent in so many ways. |
so you really think that if everyone paid a flat tax that it would just be the lowest bracket? pretty dumb thing to assume. the tax rate would go up for most since most are not in highest bracket and to make up the tax loss everyone else would have to pay more so that poor person would have to pay more than they pay now. and frankly it's those people that buy all the goods. the rich already have all the stuff they need and they just save their money if they are smart or even worse go and spend it in the states or some other country. |
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| ChemEnhanced |
| quote: | Originally posted by StereoPrincess
Yes, I do. You pay a percentage of your earnings to live in a country; you shouldn't pay more or less based on the size of those earnings.
10 percent of 30,000, versus 15% of 300,000 - the rich end up paying far more taxes. If that leaves some services short, well guess what? Cut back government salaries and government spending to keep it in line with the requirements of a society. Encourage charity spending. But I have to say, I'm more for getting rid of income tax and taxing consumption at a much higher rate. Consumption, after all, is what drives our economies. |
so everyone should be taxed so that we all live closer to the poverty line?
I see no problem with a flat tax if you also include a luxury tax on items that are considered luxury items. For example....vehicles over $25,000.00 should have a luxury tax for every dollar over that amount. A luxury tax isn't going to stop high income individuals from buying those items as they are not paying as much tax from their pay. It may also make those who can't really afford these luxury items think twice about buying them. |
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| StereoPrincess |
| quote: | Originally posted by ChemEnhanced
| quote: | 10% of 30 000 = 3000 leaves you with 27 000
15% of 300 000 = 45000 leaves you with 255 000
so who is better off. you really are going to complain? |
so everyone whould be tax so that we all live closer to the poverty line?
I see no problem with a flat tax if you also include a luxury tax on items that are considered luxury items. For example....vehicles over $25,000.00 should have a luxury tax for every dollar over that amount. A luxury tax isn't going to stop high income individuals from buying those items as they are not paying as much tax from their pay. It may also make those who can't really afford these luxury items think twice about buying them. |
or they buy them on the blackmarket.
lol and how is 255 000 even close to the poverty line? |
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| English Rachel |
Before I leave tonight, I have to say that I am NOT in the top tax bracket, I thought the cut off was a bit lower than what Mark T posted (I didn't see that before now). Malek, enjoy!
Also, I would like it to be known that I, too, don't think that our tax dollars are spent efficiently but that's the same the world over. Either that or you pay 2k a month just in case you get knocked over....
At the end of the day, I WANT to assist those less fortunate than me. Just like I would like to be assisted if my fortunes change.
Put as much as you can into the society in which you live, both socially and monetarily, and the world will be a much nicer place, I promise. |
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| ChemEnhanced |
| quote: | Originally posted by StereoPrincess
or they buy them on the blackmarket. |
I think you are stretching. Its not just cars but on everything that is considered luxury items. I see no reason why they should pay a higher percentage of their income then someone who makes less then them.
Typically, people who are making these high incomes have worked long and hard to make this money or have spent a lot of money on education to get these types of high income jobs. I don't feel that it should be their responsibility to support low income workers. |
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| Skipper |
| quote: | Originally posted by English Rachel
But the rich people DON'T give more to charity. Refer to Ted Rogers thread....
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Somebody is giving to charity, and it a'int the poor people. |
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| malek |
| quote: | Originally posted by StereoPrincess
lol. stupidest thing i have ever read. |
Students like yourself get genereous tax deducations and returns because they are trying to better themselves, I'm perefectly fine with that, it's a great public investment.
But those who skipped high school and were just ing around, I have a serious reserves assisting them thru different programs like social security, higher health costs, social housing, higher public security costs, etc.
And I'M NOT TALKING ABOUT people with physical or mental disabilities of any kind. Please don't mix those issues.
I just think it's unfair that my tax are higher because I have to support those morons who just screwed their lives by choice. |
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| Skipper |
| quote: | Originally posted by StereoPrincess
a person making 12 000 a year has to stretch their money way farther than a person making 300 000 thousand. that's why it's staggered.
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Sure, but what about the person making 70 and the person making 120, and the person making 70 is young, single and mooching off of life with mom and Dad and the other is a young professional trying to pay a mortgage in Toronto and/or raise a family? The difference isn't so big there. The person making 120 probably is not buying luxury items - and they shouldn't necessarily be treated like they are super wealthy.
Maybe the answer is to expand the tax brackets - how often are they adjusted? Does anything in the progressive tax system account for increases in the cost of living on an annual basis? |
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| StereoPrincess |
| quote: | Originally posted by Skipper
Sure, but what about the person making 70 and the person making 120, and the person making 70 is young, single and mooching off of life with mom and Dad and the other is a young professional trying to pay a mortgage in Toronto and/or raise a family? The difference isn't so big there. The person making 120 probably is not buying luxury items - and they shouldn't necessarily be treated like they are super wealthy.
Maybe the answer is to expand the tax brackets - how often are they adjusted? Does anything in the progressive tax system account for increases in the cost of living on an annual basis? |
if you got a family you have a lot more write offs. same with owning a home means more write offs. makes it a little better at least. also write off anything that is needed for your job. the schlep in the basement won't be doing any of that. and it will be that single person that goes and spends their extra money out in the community to feed the economy so i think it probably evens out.
i believe the brackets have changed every couple of years. |
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| StereoPrincess |
| quote: | Originally posted by malek
Students like yourself get genereous tax deducations and returns because they are trying to better themselves, I'm perefectly fine with that, it's a great public investment.
But those who skipped high school and were just ing around, I have a serious reserves assisting them thru different programs like social security, higher health costs, social housing, higher public security costs, etc.
And I'M NOT TALKING ABOUT people with physical or mental disabilities of any kind. Please don't mix those issues.
I just think it's unfair that my tax are higher because I have to support those morons who just screwed their lives by choice. |
but you said this:
"have you even thought about how those low income people got there in the first place? Obviously not."
the reason they are poor is because their parents are poor and their parents parents were poor and so on and so on. a person born and raised in the projects has it a thousand times harder to make anything of themselves. even if they get the best grades in school, they still have to be able to go to university and so on and so on. also, it's not easy to do homework when there are gunshots outside your window or you are scared for your life or haven't had enough to eat that day. it's a cycle of poverty and that's why all those programs have to have a lot of funding to help those people.
the percentage of people that "screw up their lives by choice" is very small i would think. a lot of people now are going to be joining the poor since there are no jobs and people are getting fired all over the place. |
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