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WTF is up with Africa? (pg. 7)
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| Lebezniatnikov |
| quote: | Originally posted by Krypton
Hey, I'd tell them, welcome to club. There isn't one country in the world that has everything they need. That's why they trade with other countries something they have for something they want/need. If they don't have food, then they can go on the international market and trade for it. |
Trade what, exactly? There are only about 6 resource-rich countries in Africa. DRC, Angola, Zambia, Nigeria, South Africa, and Equatorial Guinea. That's about it. The other 48 could trade what for food? |
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| Krypton |
| quote: | Originally posted by Lebezniatnikov
Moyo is very bright, and I haven't read her book yet, but it strikes me that she is trying to be provocative on purpose. She's obviously worked at the IMF and with Jeffrey Sachs, so she has an insider's perspective, but she's guilty of treating aid uniformly as well. She highlights cases (mostly from the 80's and 90's) of bad aid allocation that fostered instability, but ignores the entire array of literature that suggests aid projects do a tremendous amount of good (even in terms of sustainability). Furthermore, it seems to me that she goes out of her way to ignore the ways in which development institutions and organizations have changed their structure and objectives in order to increase sustainability in their programs. She has a conclusion in mind, and she cherry-picks the empirical examples to support it.
I'd have to read the book to respond in more detail, but her media campaign of editorials and interviews strikes me as calculated to attract attention for promoting a radical idea. Sachs (her former mentor) has said she goes too far, and I'm inclined to agree.
It doesn't do much good to treat "aid" as a monolithic device - much like it doesn't do much good to talk about the state of "Africa" as a single entity. It seems to me that she is guilty of both.
That said, her book is on my summer reading list, so I may yet amend my judgment on that. |
The aid agencies have been adjusting their aid haven't they? Like the Mozambique example you gave. I just don't know much about that in any detail. From my current understanding, aid has done more harm than good. |
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| pkcRAISTLIN |
| quote: | Originally posted by Lebezniatnikov
The other 48 could trade what for food? |
slaves? child sex partners? nuclear waste storage? |
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| Krypton |
| quote: | Originally posted by Lebezniatnikov
Trade what, exactly? There are only about 6 resource-rich countries in Africa. DRC, Angola, Zambia, Nigeria, South Africa, and Equatorial Guinea. That's about it. The other 48 could trade what for food? |
Well, what does Singapore, UAE, or Qatar trade for to get food? They don't have much in the way of natural resources. |
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| Lebezniatnikov |
| quote: | Originally posted by Krypton
From my current understanding, aid has done more harm than good. |
I'm still not entirely sure what you mean. It's incredibly difficult to measure any "harm" done by aid, but the positive effects are usually self-evident. In cases where aid has been ineffective, corruption is usually a factor, which isn't a fault of the aid institution so much as a government not beholden to its people. The way aid is disbursed has varied over time, and has certainly gotten better (though still not perfect), but the biggest difficulty is transferring money donated to money spent. In other words, a lot of aid that is given to project managers and state governments in Africa simply disappears. Some of it is legit - salaries, capital investments, etc. But a lot of it is simple corruption, which can indeed lead to distortions in local economies, and can sometimes sustain systems of rent-seeking and patrimonialism. But who's at fault for that? Moyo argues that aid agencies are, because accountability isn't built into the system. But how can it be? The goal should be to increase accountability within governments so that aid can be effectively distributed, should it not?
I'm of the opinion that there is blame to go around, but that the majority of it is being thrown at the wrong side. |
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| Lebezniatnikov |
| quote: | Originally posted by Krypton
Well, what does Singapore, UAE, or Qatar trade for to get food? They don't have much in the way of natural resources. |
They have extremely advanced methods of production though, and huge capital investments. Furthermore, they have strong state planning, the absence of which in Africa you noted in your very first post. |
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| pkcRAISTLIN |
| quote: | Originally posted by Lebezniatnikov
The other 48 could trade what for food? |
oooh, gang-rape safaris! |
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| daft_max |
| quote: | Originally posted by Krypton
Well, what does Singapore, UAE, or Qatar trade for to get food? They don't have much in the way of natural resources. |
Singapore is lucky in the sense that they are placed in the most lucrative spot a country could ask for. That trading port is the gateway between China and the rest of the world. And its insanely minute as a country and its not that hard to govern a small country.
UAE and Qatar has something they call "oil" |
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| Krypton |
| quote: | Originally posted by daft_max
Singapore is lucky in the sense that they are placed in the most lucrative spot a country could ask for. That trading port is the gateway between China and the rest of the world. And its insanely minute as a country and its not that hard to govern a small country.
UAE and Qatar has something they call "oil" |
All very true. I still believe every country has something someone else wants and can trade on the international market just like everyone else...instead of begging for everything they need. |
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| pkcRAISTLIN |
| quote: | Originally posted by Krypton
I still believe every country has something someone else wants and can trade on the international market just like everyone else. |
how much is starvation and famine worth on the market atm? |
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| Zild |
| I already told you. And this is coming straight from military doctrine. We're saving Africa for the next major conflict after we do what we're doing in the mid east |
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| Krypton |
| quote: | Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN
how much is starvation and famine worth on the market atm? |
name the country. |
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