No, he's a Libertarian but doesn't realize it. Let go if the GOP 17ss...Just let go. Come join us. :)
Clovis
quote:
Originally posted by The17sss
I think the self reliance of conservatism is rooted in the idea of individual liberty... and the belief that freedom includes a person's freedom to make good and bad choices for themselves, not have Big Brother holding their hand and deciding what's best for them. I have plenty of faith in people- when they are left alone by government and allowed to succeed or fail on their own merit. You gotta agree that a growing population of this country are not properly educated and informed (look at the return on our public school investment)... and when people are not adequately informed/educated then yes, it constrains the mind from understanding that they are the masters of their own destiny, not the State. It gets easier and easier to take entitlements and government handouts than work hard for success. And with the ever expanding nanny state perpetuated by liberal policies and a supportive agenda driven media, the American entrepreneurial spirit is diminshed little by little each day.
Great speech but if you think about REALITY, (I know it's difficult for you) what diminishes the entrepreneurial spirit in this country is something far different.
Just think about the greatest threat to entrepreneurs and small businesses in this country today.
Think real hard.
The17sss
quote:
Originally posted by Clovis
Great speech but if you think about REALITY, (I know it's difficult for you) what diminishes the entrepreneurial spirit in this country is something far different.
Just think about the greatest threat to entrepreneurs and small businesses in this country today.
Think real hard.
I'm surprisingly (to you all) liberal about a few issues that may shock you.
Anyway the greatest thread to entrepreneurs and small businesses? Well since I actually have experience running 2 of them for 6-7 years now, I can tell you that constant increasing taxes are the most difficult obsticle to overcome. It makes the service more expensive to the consumer, and it makes it incresingly more difficult to hire people. What you may not understand is that to pay someone a $60,000 salary, it may actually cost me, the employer, about $75,000 per year with no guarantee for a couple of years that based on that person's work, I'll see a return on that investment. Haha... don't talk to me about living in reality, youngster. You're an idealistic DJ living at home in a state that's about to go bankrupt from years of liberal entitlement policies..... and I run 2 businesses and am responsible for peoples' livlihoods. When you start signing the front of checks, I'll listen to your crap about what it's like to live in the real world.
The17sss
By the way, Clovis... what diminishes the entrepreneurial spirit from a theoretical standpoint is more and more people being convinced by the State that they are entitled to this, and to that... being made to believe the deck is stacked against them. Rather than seeing other peoples' success as motivation, they start to say, "How the hell did that person get all that? It isn't fair," and become succeptible to liberal policies of a redistributive nature. EMpty promises by the State for decades that if elected, you can rely on them... you can rely on government and they'll take care of it; they'll fix your problems. That's how the spirit is diminished; when the individual shifts personal responsibility and motivation over to the State for them to "handle". It's just creating an ever expanding role of people dependant on government.
jerZ07002
quote:
Originally posted by The17sss
Anyway the greatest thread to entrepreneurs and small businesses? Well since I actually have experience running 2 of them for 6-7 years now, I can tell you that constant increasing taxes are the most difficult obsticle to overcome.
when have taxes increased? i love the claim, but there is no truth to it!
Lebezniatnikov
quote:
Originally posted by jerZ07002
when have taxes increased? i love the claim, but there is no truth to it!
You know, when Bush raised them in... oh wait, this doesn't further my rant against liberals? Never mind!
jerZ07002
quote:
Originally posted by The17sss
I think the self reliance of conservatism is rooted in the idea of individual liberty... and the belief that freedom includes a person's freedom to make good and bad choices for themselves, not have Big Brother holding their hand and deciding what's best for them. I have plenty of faith in people- when they are left alone by government and allowed to succeed or fail on their own merit. You gotta agree that a growing population of this country are not properly educated and informed (look at the return on our public school investment)... and when people are not adequately informed/educated then yes, it constrains the mind from understanding that they are the masters of their own destiny, not the State. It gets easier and easier to take entitlements and government handouts than work hard for success. And with the ever expanding nanny state perpetuated by liberal policies and a supportive agenda driven media, the American entrepreneurial spirit is diminshed little by little each day.
to an extent, i agree with most of this. I disagree, however, that the entrepreneurial spirit is being diminished at all. If you look at the history of this country there has always been a percentage of the population seeking entitlements (social security and unemployment were enacted after the great depression); this is nothing new. People who really have the entrepreneurial spirit aren't dissuaded by the chance to get minimal government benefits if they don't break out on their own. the people that are attracted to receiving entitlements likely weren't going to take the big risk to make that kind of profit.
The17sss
quote:
Originally posted by jerZ07002
when have taxes increased? i love the claim, but there is no truth to it!
I'm not talking about just federal corporate taxes, which are about to become the highest in the world. State and local taxes vary, "combined reporting" which is when govt. collects taxes from a business on income derived in other states (we have branch offices in 3 states), the soon-to-be health benefit tax which will really hurt, the Bush tax cuts expiring soon has to be taken into consideration as a tax increase from a business perspective as well. I can't just react, I have to prepare for the stuff that is coming such as payroll tax increases, capital gains tax increases, income tax increases, etc.
When something is taxed, you depress the activity. When incentive to thrive (which I guess is a whopping $250K per year... hardly enough to employ 1 person and deal with overhead) is depressed, the entrepreneurial spirit dies a little more each day. Jerz you're a tax lawyer. You know it's a lot more complicated than to discuss 1 percentage number and apply it across the board.
Lebez... tell me about your experience running a business and being responsible for employees in a horrible economy. How do you navigate the rough waters? Please provide me with concrete advice on how to deal with business taxes that are apparantly not a big deal. Oh... I forgot... you just do a lot of reading and writing so you're an expert on real life business operations too.
Edit: Jerz- you're right to an extent on your last post... there are those who will go down with the ship and never submit to the pressures that weigh against the entrepreneurial spirit. I'm one of them, and I know a lot of others who are also- the key is to have the vision to adapt to changing times rather than wait for others to take care of things for you. But there's a tipping point for a lot of people and from what I gather, discouragement to press on is at an all time high. Welfare/food stamp/entitlement program roles are higher than they have ever been.
Capitalizt
If the lefties really cared about the "little guy", they'd be pushing with all their might for a 0.00% corporate tax rate and lower income taxes all around. But despite the jobs and wage growth this would bring, it conflicts with their "government can and must solve everything" religion..so they just can't do it.
Shakka
quote:
Originally posted by Shakka
I'm more concerned that PETA is going to go after Obama given the brutal nature with which he killed that innocent fly in his interview with John Harwood today. I mean did you see the ferocity and velocity with which Obama ruthlessly ended that poor insect's life? Harsh man...harsh.
BWAHAHAHAH!!
quote:
PETA wishes Obama hadn't swatted that fly
WASHINGTON — The group People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals wants the flyswatter in chief to try taking a more humane attitude the next time he's bedeviled by a fly in the White House.
PETA is sending President Barack Obama a Katcha Bug Humane Bug Catcher, a device that allows users to trap a house fly and then release it outside.
"We support compassion even for the most curious, smallest and least sympathetic animals," PETA spokesman Bruce Friedrich said Wednesday. "We believe that people, where they can be compassionate, should be, for all animals."
During an interview for CNBC at the White House on Tuesday, a fly intruded on Obama's conversation with correspondent John Harwood.
"Get out of here," the president told the pesky insect. When it didn't, he waited for the fly to settle, put his hand up and then smacked it dead.
"Now, where were we?" Obama asked Harwood. Then he added: "That was pretty impressive, wasn't it? I got the sucker."
Friedrich said that PETA was pleased with Obama's voting record in the Senate on behalf of animal rights and noted that he has been outspoken against animal abuses.
Still, "swatting a fly on TV indicates he's not perfect," Friedrich said, "and we're happy to say that we wish he hadn't."
Deputy press secretary Josh Earnest said the White House has no comment on the matter.
you PETA.
Capitalizt
lol, Obama is da man..
pkcRAISTLIN
quote:
Originally posted by Capitalizt
If the lefties really cared about the "little guy", they'd be pushing with all their might for a 0.00% corporate tax rate and lower income taxes all around. But despite the jobs and wage growth this would bring,
