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World Cup signatures.... (pg. 9)
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| pkcRAISTLIN |
| quote: | Originally posted by SYSTEM-J
The World Cup means nothing if you aren't supporting your own country. What meaning can victory have if you can pick up and drop the team you're following on a whim? |
But how is it any different to choosing any other sporting team? OK, I was born in Canberra (hence my fanship of the raiders), but I’ve never lived in hawthorn, greenbay or Liverpool. I might not “get” the parochial experience, but that’s not what im after. I just want a team to follow in a sport I love. i also disagree that “choosing a side from another country” can necessarily equate to “picking a team on a whim”. I could no more stop following England than I could stop stu from flirting with me. |
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| SYSTEM-J |
| quote: | Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN
But how is it any different to choosing any other sporting team? I might not “get” the parochial experience, but that’s not what im after. |
A club is just a business, it can cease to exist, it can change its name, its location, everything. A team like Arsenal can switch from being a renowned defensive side to an attacking side at the switch of a manager. The players can come from anywhere. Some clubs represent the distinctive culture of their region, which is why Barcelona are "More Than A Club" and why any Barca fan who is not a Catalan is not "getting" the full experience.
It's a matter of identity. England are part of my identity. They're a team you cheer for entertainment. |
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| EddieZilker |
Very interesting debate, from an anthropological perspective.
Are your sentiments widely held in England, System_J, or is your axiom/fan ethos more your own individual preference? |
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| Ted Promo |
, if the England team was on a plane with the Polish government...
...
I digress. |
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| pkcRAISTLIN |
| quote: | Originally posted by SYSTEM-J
A club is just a business, it can cease to exist, it can change its name, its location, everything. A team like Arsenal can switch from being a renowned defensive side to an attacking side at the switch of a manager. The players can come from anywhere. Some clubs represent the distinctive culture of their region, which is why Barcelona are "More Than A Club" and why any Barca fan who is not a Catalan is not "getting" the full experience.
It's a matter of identity. England are part of my identity. They're a team you cheer for entertainment. |
All fair points, however you should specify that its ‘cultural identity’. Because teams you cheer for are certainly part of your identity, just like the music you like or the chicks that you dig. Im not sure I’d ever “get it”, regardless of where I was born. Sport to me is just another form of entertainment. |
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| Simon_N |
| I'm looking forward to England smashing up the U.S.A in our group. :D |
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| djhaziel |
| quote: | Originally posted by Simon_N
I'm looking forward to England smashing up the U.S.A in our group. :D |
England will turn usa into cake ingredients. |
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| Lira |
| quote: | Originally posted by SYSTEM-J
There is a British tradition of the glorious failure, which has been represented in our culture for centuries, from The Charge Of The Light Brigade to A Bridge Too Far. It's similar with the Spanish - there's a good reason their national team is nicknamed "The Armada". The glorious failure of the England team is part of our national identity, our stiff-upper-lip, our ability to persist in the face of disaster. It's the reason our TV commentators are always restrained when American ones scream wildly. It's about way, way more than just "taking pride" in whatever success we can accrue. |
Cool, that's how you feel it, and it's nice to see you can trace your support for your team to something bigger and that has an impact on your identity (as you pointed out a few posts above, England is part of your identity). But that, ultimately, your choice.
But to claim your choice is inherently superior than that of someone else's simply because it means something to you... that's an entirely different matter altogether.
I consider my nationality to be as important to my sense of self as the colour of the socks I'm wearing right now.
| quote: | Originally posted by SYSTEM-J
You've made a lot of posts recently stressing how our mindsets, attitudes and assumptions depend a great deal on our native cultures, whether it's wearing trainers to a wedding or putting your ty toilet paper in a bin rather than flushing it. As such, you should be more aware than most that our identities are inextricable from the cultural surroundings that shaped us. The England team is a cultural product - only my country could have produced that team - and as a football fan it is part of me. |
Actually, I don't think for a single minute that it is as deterministic as this quote makes it. The reason why I wear trainers to a wedding is because I've chosen to do it and no friend has ever been bothered by that - I wouldn't call it at all cultural. What may be "cultural" is the fact that no one was (visibly) bothered by my wearing of trainers to weddings, and I saw a groom or two wearing them with a tuxedo in the party that followed the ceremony. It was my choice (and the choice of that particular groom) to wear trainers, not something culturally imposed.
The fact is that no one goes around defying the rules all the time: I've never been bothered by the used toilet paper in a bit, I've always taken this for granted. The moment I learned I could throw it in the toilet, I made a choice - from that moment on, I chose not flush it because it's not a habit I'd rather pick up. Not because it has anything to do with my identity, but because I can't know for certain whether all plumbing here where I live supports this.
By the way, lest you forget, England itself is a cultural product. |
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| Lira |
| quote: | Originally posted by digitalbreach
btw I request...Ireland
too early..? |
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| apple country |
epic.
I want to cheer for IRE now. |
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| Moongoose |
| Oh do one for France, im cheering for them as soon as we get kicke out :D |
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