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Mac OSX mavericks is out, free. (pg. 2)
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| cryophonik |
| quote: | Originally posted by Juan Paulino
Only problem is that the Virus TI output device is not working with mavericks. |
Yeah, I saw that email from Access. Apparently, Avid is suggesting that PT users refrain from upgrading as well. Fortunately for me, I only use my Virus (and PT) with my Windows desktop. My MacBook Air is pretty much a hardware-free and dongle-free super-minimal musical sketchpad. ;) |
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| DJ RANN |
| quote: | Originally posted by Looney4Clooney
its sort of the tipping point right now. OSX has just flat lined. Logic X is a joke. Eveyrone is on the fence and as more people switch, so will others. Studios will use what works but anyone that isn't doing simple tracking or using a very expensive avid rig will be making the change. I wish it wasn't so, but there is no reason to use mac if you want a workstation except if you like to pay a lot for a little.
There use to be no choice but mac. As time goes on , it seems they are killing their pro clientele.
it sucks but until they do something better or microsoft does another major gaff which is very possible, there really is no reason not to get a pc. Windows 7 is as stable as osx 10.8.
And those mac pros are going to be a complete disaster and even tho they never made money , i mean nobody is going to be getting one. |
I just don't see whwre you're getting your info from.
Windows 8 is a ing disaster. Sure, no ME or Vista levels but I have two computers in front of me and unless you're using a fake ipad, er I mean windows surface, windows 8 is abhorrent. It's a badly conceived rip off of IOS but without the logical interface. It's like taking the backwards of windows, then trying to make it for a touchscreen, then adding the minimal design of IOS.
As for logic x - I don't know a single pro that says it's a joke. Most people have welcomed it. I personally don't think it;s a massive step forward (like 8 was to 7 but that's because they made massive interface changes that were long overdue) but there are plenty of things that people absolutely love - the new plugins, especially the midi ones are being very well received and if anything it's further shored up Logic's rep as an all in one solution and the competition is going to be playing catch up for a long time.
OK, so they dropped node distributive processing. You of all people know first hand how ing annoyingly finicky it could be. Identical versions of logic, identical plugins down to the .x.x etc. If one this was even slightly out of place it wouldn't work.
Apple also relaised it;s not worth the hassle for the same reason PTHD went native; processing power on host computers is getting to the point you can run as many tracks/plugs as you need without resorting to processor offload.
I think you're off the mark with the general consensus on Logic and OSX and even their pro support. Yeah, a year ago, I would have maybe agreed with you that it was looking like apple abandoned their pro market, but as soon as it was confirmed they are launching a new Mac Pro, that was put to rest.
Most studios I have spoken to, welcome the modular approach - the ability to plug and play components over time is happy news. I know first hand what it's like trying to find the exact ing video card for your exact generation of 2007 Mac pro which would be 4 years behind current technology.
There are certain things you don't want to swap out; the processor, the motherboard etc - but all the other stuff? Hell yes.
Mavericks is IMO, a step back to pro. Seandroid is right - this isn't a tweak. It's what Lion should have been in the first place and all those performance issues that stopped many people from "upgrading" to lion (myself included) have now been dealt with.
you keep forgetting that PC need constant maintenance to keep performance. I realized last week I hadn't done anything to my mac in over six months, yet the brand new touchscreen W8 PC next to me has needed 30+ software updates in the last two months (and that included a week of BSOD's due to the wring drivers being automatically installed).
What is a joke is that yesterday, W8 gives me a message stating that a critical update is needed and I can either postpone it or do it now but it must be done. it, I do it. It takes 30 mins to download all the , another 10 to install, right as it's finishing up, it states the update has failed as it's not compatible with this computer. 45 minutes of not being able to use the computer gone.
There's your tipping point.
As for PTHD, no studio or real pro in their right mind is going to upgrade to the latest OSX for 6 months (not that PT even supports that version out the gate anyway). At every studio I've ever worked at, both OSX and PT version was a full generation behind. |
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| Looney4Clooney |
well,
the fact that it still can't route midi like every single other daw requiring awkward work arounds is one reason. I mean that is just ridiculous considering the actual AU platform allowed it. Too busy making it look like garageband to fix the important stuff.
macs require maintenance.
Logic X offers nothing new and is years behind the rest.
Windows 7 is rock solid.
Like i said, never before had people ever had to consider a pc. It is now on everyones mind. For those that are upgrading, this is now an issue. Never was before.
In terms of their pro users ? i mean every single graphics designer was forced to pc. So i would hardly call that catering to their pro users. Those that haven't are doing recording. They aren't really using the computer for fx so they have a few more years. |
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| DJ RANN |
Can't route midi?
I hate the environment with a passion but it does exactly that if you need it and if anything, Smart controls has been a game changer for many of those who have grumbled about logic's midi routing for years.
Or do you mean something else, like routing external midi devices through Logic?
Compared to PC's mac do not require maintenance.Sure you need to repair disk permissions twice a year. Maybe an update every couple of months.
I am not joking when I say this: the ASUS win 7 laptop I am writing this is less than two years old.
Keyboard replacement, screen replacement, I had to fix the mouse button myself and I'v had to do a fresh install of win7 4 months ago as it was getting too laggy. In those 4 months, I've had to do over 100 microsoft updates, most taking at least 10 mins. That 17 hours of downtime in just the last 4 months, and that doesn't included the 8+ hours it takes to install everything, nor all the other regular maintentnace things like the SSD toolbox and clearing the cache and defragmenting etc.
At least once a week, I will have stepped away from my PC, come back and get a "windows has recovered from a serious issue".
My imac is 5 years old. One fresh install of OSX 2 years ago. I abuse that computer like I'm Gary Glitter and it's a Cambodian child, yet it just keeps going.
Anyone trying to say windows and OSX are the same thing now is deluded. Win7 saved their bacon, as if they'd had another vista M$ would have been dead in the water. Win8 is a mis-step but mavericks seems to be what they should have done with Lion.
People who use logic to compose, simply aren't jumping ship to cubase etc when logic X is an improvement over 9.
Sure a few project studios might go over to PC for PTHD becuase $ for $ you can build a powerful host for less than a mac, but if I go in to a studio as an engineer, I know my job is going to be a load harder with PC's being the workhorses.
Graphics? yes, FCPX was a disaster, but they learnt from that (hence why you can open LP9 and LPx at the same time, and any new adopters (not used FCPX before) had no problem using it. I think apple got bored with supporting people and an old product. They said: you, here's a new platform, and after you quit bitching you'll like it. They were somewhat right. Sales of FCPX have been steadily rising.
I have a feeling, as long as the units work like they are supposed to, Apple with sell a boatload of Mac Pros. |
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| junkproject |
| The fanboyism... |
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| DJ RANN |
| quote: | Originally posted by junkproject
The fanboyism... |
If you knew anything about me, it's that I'm no blind fanboy of Apple.
I like some products and loathe others. I built Audio PC's for a living and used to be a die hard cubase user. Nothing about this discussion has anything to do with personal bias.
I viewing things on their merit as pro engineer and someone that owns three PC's (desktop, laptop and touchscreen deskptop - all for very different uses) and one Imac and ipad (ipad was given to me). I probably own less apple products than most people my age.
I get the feeling that think apple is making mistakes, which they may well be but no other company is making anything that would have a chance of overtaking them (with exception to samsung but let's not get in to phones right now).
So someone saying OSX has flatlined is like saying cars have flatlined just because no one has invented a better form of transport. Until someone makes those floating skateboards from back to the future, care will still be around.
People aren't going to switch from OSX or Logic because there hasn't been a quantum leap in function or performance, especially when windows, the only real competition, latest incantation is such a up and Steinberg have done nothing really groundbreaking for a decade now. |
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| Looney4Clooney |
Rann
I wish I had the time and energy to elaborate but consider the fact logic is the only daw that requires developers to include both an instrument nada midi instrument of the same plugin. This alone should give you a sense of how logic the most awkward daw and I'm including FL studio when dealing with midi,
Eg, cable guys midi shaper requires you to send the midi to a virtual bus then sending that back into logic.it is a workflow killer mad only logic seems to implement. MIDI this way.
Sonar and cubase and if it were not for a few things even fl studio have far surpassed logic as a production took.
The people you know are doing very simple things that are linear and don't require what I consider essential for a daw that excels at production.
Anyone doing anything cool has to use bidule to compensate for logics complete lack of innovation.
Every producer that is know for their production techniques, they generally shy away from logic because resampling and triggering midi events from sources within the app is just a mess in logic.
I will defend things that actually are cool. The current trend of developers making fx plugins for the iPad essentially making it a fx unit for external synths is brilliant.
The. iPad model needs ,any more years to do everything, and the result is a whole in terms of workstation. There was a time when I would never question the future of Apple and Audio but like many others that are currently upgrading , Mac had lost that reputation.
Their laptops.still are a no brainier bitingly because the competition does not care at all about audio. But anyone thatis upgrading their workstation is forced to look at PC as a better longer, solution. |
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| DJ RANN |
I hear what you're saying Richie and logic certainly has it's flaws - it always has, but I don't see the sudden urgency for all these people to switch platforms.
You know my old boss only uses the other platform and we've been through the debate a million times as that has it's own set of shortcomings.
All these platforms as relative to each other's performance. Granted, there is less difference now in terms of perfromance between to big DAW's but when Logic 8 came out and they actually let you edit audio in the arrange window Cubase et al took a big hit. Then when logic 9 came out with a massive price drop, they all took another hit.
Now you've got LPX at $299 or Cubase for $499 and there's basically not much difference between the two apart from the native plugs are vastly better and you get a ton of content in LPX.
Sure for those doing quite advanced stuff with midi routing, to the point they need bidule to get around the "limitations" of logic routing the other platforms might be a little easier but the other platforms have their midi shortcomings elsewhere. It's a tradeoff.
Even if those advanced users switch, it's what, maybe 5% of logic users?
The funny thing is, this isn't even a mac vs PC debate. When he's not beta testing for the other platform (about 50% of the time) my old boss runs Cubase on a mac (even though he doesn't like them) as they told him flat that Cubase is more stable on a Mac than it is on PC. |
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| Looney4Clooney |
the update is much better. This is why i ing hate mac. Number one feature listed is ibooks.
I just bought my first pc in years. It actually wasn't that difficult. Took about 10 hours to do the research in terms of components that work together.
I also wanted something for GFX and mac is out of that business.
I honestly just can't invest in a company which i think doesn't really get were things should go as far as pro audio. I will always use their laptops , the iPads are great and will eventually become the new DAW but until then, PC seems like a better choice for workstation.
Asked in in 2010-. I would of said mac all the way. The issue isn't money. I think the fact money isn't an issue makes that bias you have when you have money invested something that doesn't influence my opinion. |
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| Seandroid |
| quote: | Originally posted by Looney4Clooney
the update is much better. This is why i ing hate mac. Number one feature listed is ibooks.
I just bought my first pc in years. It actually wasn't that difficult. Took about 10 hours to do the research in terms of components that work together.
I also wanted something for GFX and mac is out of that business.
I honestly just can't invest in a company which i think doesn't really get were things should go as far as pro audio. I will always use their laptops , the iPads are great and will eventually become the new DAW but until then, PC seems like a better choice for workstation.
Asked in in 2010-. I would of said mac all the way. The issue isn't money. I think the fact money isn't an issue makes that bias you have when you have money invested something that doesn't influence my opinion. |
Lmfao, the number one feature of Windows 8 is its awful redesign that leaves you with this ridiculous, fragmented "2 operating systems in one OS" user experience. They also seriously managed to market that you can run 2 apps SIDE BY SIDE!!1111
It's so bad they had to rush Windows 8.1 to attempt to appease the immense number of furious users, and an awful lot of them were power users.
You keep complaining about them "not thinking about power users" and then ignoring what they have done. Power user features don't market well, they never have, they never will, but they are there.
You seem to be insistent on some sort of change yet all you seem to want is for your Mac to run Snow Leopard. Apple has literally NEVER marketed their pro products.
But it's also clear that you're apparently totally stuck with your opinion and have no intention of changing it so I don't know why I'm bothering 😛
And also: "Windows 7 is rock solid."
Difference: Mavericks is rock solid now. Windows 7 is rock solid because it came out 4 years ago. Snow Leopard came out *around the same time.* I don't even understand your argument at all. In that time Apple has released:
Lion
Mountain Lion
Mavericks
With Lion being a major feature release, Mountain Lion being refinement (which is what, as a pro user, you should be asking for) and Mavericks being an even further improvement. |
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| Looney4Clooney |
never praised Windows 8
Never made an argument except defending the overall unease most people that need a workstation computer , do not own a mega studio and seem to not be sure of apple's future. I think i have been rather candid praising apple were they don't up. The new audio chained for IOS is great. But when something falls short, i do not suffer from buyer bias. I have no loyalty to any of these companies. Only the bund.
And people in audio have only recently been updating to anything later than 10.6. Guess what ? 4 years for the final build.
Given the snail pace apple is taking with audio related stuff, I have never had to consider a pc. But considering i could of purchased the new mac pro , the issue is not money. There are features i want that seem to only exist with apps PC seems to have.
I have also been getting into GFX. That is an area that was owned by apple. Nobody that does very heavy processing uses a mac. I wish it was possible.
I think you A , need to use that energy you used laughing your ass off and reduce the suck of your music, and b |
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| Seandroid |
| quote: | Originally posted by Looney4Clooney
I think you A , need to use that energy you used laughing your ass off and reduce the suck of your music, and b |
Wow. Way to be pointlessly insulting. I haven't uploaded pretty much anything I've made in like a year. You don't even know what my stuff sounds like anymore.
That was just being a ing for the sake of it.
Normally I wouldn't care, but seriously. you. |
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