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Another shooting in club district (pg. 7)
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| b4k-oz |
| quote: | Originally posted by ChemEnhanced
Well if you want any assistance with the insurance claim....just let Moral or I know |
Hey thanks..I may take you up on dat when it comes to renewal time. Dunno yet what I'm gonna do now.
I can't believe I got quoted $1000 to repair side door glass. WTF is this world coming to. |
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| Moral Hazard |
| ^^^ :wtf: is it just the glass that's damaged? If so that seems pretty high. |
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| nacarter |
Just to add something to this discussion, I think there are many people in here (myself included) that can attest to shady goings-on at several clubs in Toronto. As a sex trade researcher, I had several girls tell me of a number of prostitutes and pimps working out of The Guv targetting tourists. I dismissed this as 'word on the street' until I was propositioned at the Marco V show in February. The girl wanted $300 for an hour (definitely targetting high-rolling gino tourists). As I researched a little further, I found out that management is well aware of this situation and tolerates it. Hearsay and rumour? Hardly. The reputation of The Guv was good enough to make the World Sex Guide, a largely reliable source on the international sex trade.
The point of this little story. If there is pretty strong indications of one type of shady activity being allowed at a club, it is not libelous to suggest that a similar activity is also occuring (in this case, waving dealers or armed patrons into the club).
Does this damage the club's reputation? Considering that some European and American clubs are famous for their shady reputations and have suffered no loss in patronage, arguing harm is very difficult.
The reality for Joe Clubber is to understand that ANY club can be potentially dangerous and that nobody should be getting so drunk/high that they are no longer aware of their surroundings. |
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| Carney |
| quote: | Originally posted by Moral Hazard
I disagree with you completely. Stiffer penalties do not act as a deterant. The reason for this is quite simple.... people who commit illegal acts do not think they will get caught. Just like all of us who speed, we do so because we are pretty confident that we will not get caught. Besides that, for the young wanna be's the whole reason to pack heat is because it is illegal.... 'cause if you gots a piece you must be str8 gangsta!
The answer isn't less guns it's more guns. Let's arm everyone over the age of 18. Believe me everyone will think twice about pulling a gun if they know everyone in the room/bar/street/mall/gay bath house has one too. |
i also disagree with you completely. are u serious cause thats messed.
sounds like your from the south or something:toothless :toothless :toothless
anyways about the example with speeders if they knew they faced stiffer penalties like having there car impounded or face jail time youll def. see less speeders. for example WAY LESS people speed in increased fine zone areas. |
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| ChemEnhanced |
| quote: | Originally posted by Carney
i also disagree with you completely. are u serious cause thats messed.
sounds like your from the south or something:toothless :toothless :toothless
anyways about the example with speeders if they knew they faced stiffer penalties like having there car impounded or face jail time youll def. see less speeders. for example WAY LESS people speed in increased fine zone areas. |
Even with stiffer penalties...the truth is these guns are still going to be there....you are not going to get rid of them.....these people don't typically get caught with the gun on them. |
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| Carney |
| quote: | Originally posted by ChemEnhanced
Even with stiffer penalties...the truth is these guns are still going to be there....you are not going to get rid of them.....these people don't typically get caught with the gun on them. |
i know theyll always be there but the point is theyll be alot less of them which is a good thing on our streets. also the guys with illegal guns will be locked up for ten years so they wont be back out on the streets doing it again, which tend to happen alot here with people out on parole or bail. |
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| tonybologna |
| quote: | Originally posted by nacarter
Just to add something to this discussion, I think there are many people in here (myself included) that can attest to shady goings-on at several clubs in Toronto. As a sex trade researcher, I had several girls tell me of a number of prostitutes and pimps working out of The Guv targetting tourists. I dismissed this as 'word on the street' until I was propositioned at the Marco V show in February. The girl wanted $300 for an hour (definitely targetting high-rolling gino tourists). As I researched a little further, I found out that management is well aware of this situation and tolerates it. Hearsay and rumour? Hardly. The reputation of The Guv was good enough to make the World Sex Guide, a largely reliable source on the international sex trade.
The point of this little story. If there is pretty strong indications of one type of shady activity being allowed at a club, it is not libelous to suggest that a similar activity is also occuring (in this case, waving dealers or armed patrons into the club).
Does this damage the club's reputation? Considering that some European and American clubs are famous for their shady reputations and have suffered no loss in patronage, arguing harm is very difficult.
The reality for Joe Clubber is to understand that ANY club can be potentially dangerous and that nobody should be getting so drunk/high that they are no longer aware of their surroundings. |
Ahh thought i was the only one that was aware of www.worldsexguide.info (formerly www.wsgforum.com). I am also aware of the exact post in this forum that points out some guy picking up some chinese girls for money in a certain Toronto club.
However, I must disagree with you on the danger aspect. I think the Guvernment, given the large number of people, as well as the other EDM clubs in Toronto have a stellar safety record. Check records for police calls from the Guvernment or Boa's and compare that to the record for police calls to various hip hop nights. I do not see a correlation between sex trade activity and violence inside clubs. Outside clubs, I cannot speak for.
While communicating in the public domain for the purpose of prostitution is illegal in Canada, outcalls themselves are not illegal. In this sense, I do not believe clubs have a legal basis for refusing entry of such patrons into the club because a) the club itself can argue that the club grounds are in the private domain and not in the public domain and b) the club is not acting as an incall, that is clients do not come there to have sexual relation with patrons in that location. They leave the club for such activity thus the prostitute goes to the client not the other way around- more like an outcall than an incall.
If I were a club owner, I think I'd save myself the trouble and legal hastle and let these people in. This in no way, however, relieves me from obligations to search for weapons and drugs.
I also must disagree about your comment regarding clubs in America not suffering in the number of patrons due to a clubs reputation for being shady. If you take a look at NYC or Chicago in 2000 compared to now, things have changed dramatically. Clubs have been shut down by authorities, thus it has affected the number of patrons. Some have reopened and cleaned up their act to some degree, but its nothing like the pre-Gulianni era. |
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| ChemEnhanced |
| quote: | Originally posted by Carney
i know theyll always be there but the point is theyll be alot less of them which is a good thing on our streets. also the guys with illegal guns will be locked up for ten years so they wont be back out on the streets doing it again, which tend to happen alot here with people out on parole or bail. |
I wouldn't count on there being any less or at least substantially less guns on the street because of a higher jail time. You have to remember that the people who are carrying the illegal weapons are typically younger adults who don't think or even care about what happens to them. These people typically belong to some sort of gang and if they are not packing heat they will be pressured into it. If your gang members tell you to pack heat you're gonna pack heat.
If you really want to lower the number of gun shootings then you have to make it harder to buy ammo first off. I can walk into Walmart and by all the ammo I want.....if the person behind the counter is doing their job right then they will ask for my Fire Arms licence.....however, the people who sell the ammo to the gang members are typically around the same age and probably know the person. In order to buy ammo you should only be able to purchase it at an actual hunting/outdoorsman store. Any hand gun ammo should have to be order and picked up through a government office.
With the guns themselves....you have to find away that makes it impossible to get them into the country. Most illegal hand guns are coming from the United States. A stronger effort has to be made with both governments to stop weapons from getting across the boarder. Unfortunately you can't search every vehicle. It would be interesting if police could find a way to get homing devices on weapons and get them distributed into the black market. If the police could track these weapons it may give them a better idea of who, how, and when these weapons are crossing the boarders.
I strongly believe there is no need for hand guns....guns are only required for hunting and sport.....neither of those require hand guns. If the governments banned the selling of handguns it would eventually lower the number of guns on the street. This would take several years but as police recover hand guns they would dispose of them. I don't think you are gonna find many people carrying their 12 guage shot gun down the street. |
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| Mag1k |
| prostitutes in guv .......... nooooooooooo:eyes: :D |
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| mikester69 |
You guys are freaking out too much about this. Stop reading into all this media hype, they focus on this to divert attention from other issues. There are way more important things to worry about in this city than gun violence.
I say gun control is working great here, just look at the statistics:
Murder rates (per 100,000 population)
(1) Washington, DC 45.8
(2) Detroit 42.0
(3) Baltimore 38.3
Toronto 1.75
And to think that most stolen guns come from the states, it makes me really pissed
edit: source - http://www.benbest.com/lifeext/murder.html |
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| tonybologna |
| I lived in Washington DC. It sucked so bad that we went to Baltimore just to have some fun. But it wasn't that much better, aka heroin capital of the world. |
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