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How bad is Tiesto's Mixing... really??? (live) (pg. 2)
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| RJT |
| You know, Tiesto and Nick Warren have quite a bit in common with regard to the legitimate technical problems in their DJ'ing. Neither really phrase well live, and the technical problems in both Warren and Tiesto's sets are very similar. |
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| ClearVision |
| just to clarify... when you guys say he doesn't phrase well... do you mean he cues new tracks in way to early or too late... or do you mean he's not counting bars very well and the musical events of the songs aren't matching up??? |
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| RJT |
| quote: | Originally posted by ClearVision
just to clarify... when you guys say he doesn't phrase well... do you mean he cues new tracks in way to early or too late... or do you mean he's not counting bars very well and the musical events of the songs aren't matching up??? |
Perhaps a bit of all of that. There's a tendency to either end up clashing melodies or having mixes run on for far too long (something I'm well guilty of myself on occasion). Often times he cues records at odd times or during odd bars that really don't seem to make sense and can cause you to feel somewhat musically "jerked around."
I don't know if that helps - Again, your best bet is just to try and find a recent live set and have a listen. |
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| Spirit5 |
| quote: | Originally posted by ClearVision
just to clarify... when you guys say he doesn't phrase well... do you mean he cues new tracks in way to early or too late... or do you mean he's not counting bars very well and the musical events of the songs aren't matching up??? |
Both actually. He sometimes brings the new track in in odd points, not exactly phrased to match the outgoing track. He might bring in the track too early, and it will clash as far as hamonics goes, will sound out of tune essentially.. chord or key clashes galore. And like RJT said, he sometimes plays a tune out too long and then brings in the next track and it sounds off. I am guilty of this, but I am no pro so it doesn't matter (I just mix in my bedroom). And with the phrasing, he doesn't always count bars, but you don't need to do that as much if you just know your tunes well, which he either doesn't know all of the tunes that well that he plays, or isn't counting bars. |
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| ClearVision |
| he must be tonedeaf... it seems fairly easy to me to tell wether or not two tracks are dissonant while beatmatching the next track. |
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| julien2 |
| quote: | | I'm not sure what you mean by melody constructed within the track... I've spun house and have found it much easier than trance. |
Maybey i wrote that too quickly.
What I mean is that trance and house dont involve the same mixing and set construction techniques.
Mainly because of the track structures.
In trance, you mix tracks following a build up breakdown technique.
In house, the progression is made throughout the set, rather than in the track itself.
Trance and house djing skills are NOT THE SAME, i am not saying one is easier that the other, all I'm saying is that its easier to be lazy with trance. |
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| Spirit5 |
| quote: | Originally posted by ClearVision
he must be tonedeaf... it seems fairly easy to me to tell wether or not two tracks are dissonant while beatmatching the next track. |
Yeah he might be. I am slightly tone deaf as well so it's hard for me to do that, but I study my tunes like crazy so that helps. Tone deaf DJs just need to beatmatch and not try to attempt the more musical stuff like harmonic mixing, unless they've keyed all of their tracks (probably via a program or someone helping them if they can't make out keys) and have studied up a bit on it. |
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| hadi burpee |
| quote: | Originally posted by Zild
Phasing probably has something to do with superimposed harmonic motion. But not really anything to do with being a DJ. |
i just thought phrasing was called phasing. i know what is it is, its like matching the last 64 beats of with the first 64 beats of another song instead of the last 72 with the first 64, it might sound off or like the bass wont hit in at the right time. |
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| ClearVision |
| quote: | Originally posted by julien2
Maybey i wrote that too quickly.
What I mean is that trance and house dont involve the same mixing and set construction techniques.
Mainly because of the track structures.
In trance, you mix tracks following a build up breakdown technique.
In house, the progression is made throughout the set, rather than in the track itself.
Trance and house djing skills are NOT THE SAME, i am not saying one is easier that the other, all I'm saying is that its easier to be lazy with trance. |
hm ok. well structurally I have definately found differences, and I cue up my next track accordingly. As far as set progression, I kinda do the same thing for trance and house... I think you can mix trance progressively as well.
You got any house sets I could listen to?? |
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| ClearVision |
| quote: | Originally posted by Spirit5
Yeah he might be. I am slightly tone deaf as well so it's hard for me to do that, but I study my tunes like crazy so that helps. Tone deaf DJs just need to beatmatch and not try to attempt the more musical stuff like harmonic mixing, unless they've keyed all of their tracks (probably via a program or someone helping them if they can't make out keys) and have studied up a bit on it. |
Tiesto must be the Ashley Simpson of trance DJ's :p |
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| montana |
| quote: | Originally posted by RJT
You know, Tiesto and Nick Warren have quite a bit in common with regard to the legitimate technical problems in their DJ'ing. Neither really phrase well live, and the technical problems in both Warren and Tiesto's sets are very similar. |
warren has never been that good when it comes to mixing, he made it up with having a great trackselection instead.
and i think i've said it in the djsubforum but a dj can pull of a great set with shoddy mixing if the trackselection & placement is stellar. but all the cleanest, smoothest mixing in the world is not going to save you if your trackselection & placement is bad. |
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| RJT |
| quote: | Originally posted by montana
warren has never been that good when it comes to mixing, he made it up with having a great trackselection instead.
and i think i've said it in the djsubforum but a dj can pull of a great set with shoddy mixing if the trackselection & placement is stellar. but all the cleanest, smoothest mixing in the world is not going to save you if your trackselection & placement is bad. |
Indeed. I'll agree to all of that. |
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