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Jesus etc (pg. 10)
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| Subey |
| quote: | Originally posted by Moral Hazard
The fact that many don't listen doesn't mean the message is flawed.
The point is in the line "today this scripture passage is fulfilled in your hearing"... all the lessons of the bible are only as good as the people receiving the message. Stone sales remain high because people choose not to hear. |
The most overtly "divine" person to walk the earth most obvious message has no impact after being repeated incessantly for 2000 years.
Jesus couldn't have been so naive as to not envisage that outcome. Rather the purpose of that statement could not have been to modify behaviour, but rather to add to Jesus' historical clout.
P.S. I hope the preceeding adds to my clout :clown: |
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| netroM |
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| Moral Hazard |
| quote: | Originally posted by Subey
The most overtly "divine" person to walk the earth most obvious message has no impact after being repeated incessantly for 2000 years.
Jesus couldn't have been so naive as to not envisage that outcome. Rather the purpose of that statement could not have been to modify behaviour, but rather to add to Jesus' historical clout.
P.S. I hope the preceeding adds to my clout :clown: |
Incorrect. The story is about Jesus returning to his home town after word about his prowless as a mirical worker had spread. The people were busy watching him, waiting to see what great act he would preform. He read the passage from Isaiah's prophesy to illustrate that his great acts are not the path to the "year acceptable to the lord" but "proclaim[ing] liberty to captives and recovery of sight to the blind, to let[ing] the oppressed go free" is. Jesus is telling the people that he cannot do these things, they must. Once they do they will see the year acceptable to the lord (original interpretation from greek is better... "a year in God's favor"). That is the mirical, living with true love for one another... not turning water into wine (as he had done shortly before returning to Nazereth).
With regard to naivity, you must remember that Jesus was a man. He could not know with any certainty what the ultimate outcome of his ministry would be unless that knowledge was given to him by God, which is certainly not elluded to in the gospels. He considered himself a teacher, trying to bring people back to the teachings of the prophets by focusing their attention on real meaning of their prophesies. In the case of Isaiah's prophesy Jesus is trying to tell us that we must all proclaim liberty to the captives and let the oppressed free, by doing this we will collectively be the long awaited messiah. |
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| Orbax |
| quote: | Originally posted by netroM
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You haven't watched South Park enough lately |
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| netroM |
I saw it the day it was on.
And they only mentioned the great FSM because Richard Dawkins use it in his works.
I'm a pastafarian btw.
But hey, you clearly haven't been touched by His Noodlyness. Would you like me to convert you into a pastafarian?
No? Then you won't experience heaven, which includes:
A stripper-factory and beer volcanoes as far as the eye can see, yarr, RAmen.
Oh, Pastafarianism doesn't have a "hell", which means if you don't believe in it you won't suffer for... the rest of your... undead life?
This, in turn, means that it won't enslave all the idiots in the world and force them to think alike and blatently believe the fairy-tales in their book which has been changed numerous times.
btw: I have a bigger pen0r than yuo, gg |
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| Subey |
| quote: | Originally posted by Moral Hazard
In the case of Isaiah's prophesy Jesus is trying to tell us that we must all proclaim liberty to the captives and let the oppressed free, by doing this we will collectively be the long awaited messiah. |
Could you elaborate on this one for me, not sure what is meant by it |
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| Moral Hazard |
| quote: | Originally posted by Subey
Could you elaborate on this one for me, not sure what is meant by it |
Isaiah fortold of a massiah that would arrive to free God's people from servitude and oppression. Whether this meant the Jews being freed from foriegn occupation or all people is a matter of debate. Generally the Jews believe it is a prophesy exclusive to them while Christians believe "God's people" includes anyone that chooses to love and serve God... I have no idea what muslims believe in this regard but I would suspect since they generally believe Jesus is the second most important prophet I'd suspect they lie on the same side of this question as Christians do. At any rate, he is trying to tell the people that they, collectively, have the ability to create the world "acceptable to the lord" (perhaps meaning a just society, perhaps meaning the world as God wants us to have) if they would just do the things that Isaiah perscribed. If they would live rightiously and justly then they would free themselves (and all people) from their lives of servitude and (self imposed) oppression. What he is saying is that his role is not to unilaterally free them but to teach them how to free themsleves.
***edit - I'm really sounding a lot more evangelistic then I actually am. Please note; I'm not trying to convice anyone to "accept Jesus as their lord and saviour", I'm just trying to explain and answer questions to the best of my ability. |
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| Subey |
| quote: | Originally posted by Moral Hazard
I have no idea what muslims believe in this regard but I would suspect since they generally believe Jesus is the second most important prophet I'd suspect they lie on the same side of this question as Christians do.
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I think that Isa (Jesus) comes back and fights a false prophet before the end, but perhaps a muslim could clarify
| quote: | Originally posted by Moral Hazard
***edit - I'm really sounding a lot more evangelistic then I actually am. Please note; I'm not trying to convice anyone to "accept Jesus as their lord and saviour", I'm just trying to explain and answer questions to the best of my ability. |
Your answer is acceptable, and your timing is perfect. |
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| Moral Hazard |
| quote: | Originally posted by Subey
I think that Isa (Jesus) comes back and fights a false prophet before the end, but perhaps a muslim could clarify |
Indeed, they do believe he is not actually dead but was brought to heaven as a human and will be sent back in the end times to save the faithful, following which he will finally die and be intombed next to Mohammed. I am not sure, however, what their stance is on whether "God's people" includes all-people.
| quote: | | Your answer is acceptable, and your timing is perfect. |
Thank you. |
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| superglo |
| quote: | Originally posted by Moral Hazard
I have no idea what muslims believe in this regard but I would suspect since they generally believe Jesus is the second most important prophet
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this is correct. |
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| _Ocean_Drive_ |
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| Dj O'Callaghan |
| quote: | Originally posted by _Ocean_Drive_
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The good old classic.... :stongue:
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