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How do you tune a kick or find out it's key?
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| cammaxwell |
I'm trying to make sure my drums are in the same key as the rest of my track, how do I do this?
I'm aware of analyzing the frequencies for the peak and then converting to a note, but I find it very difficult with kicks. Is the right way to do this, unfortunately my ears are not trained enough yet to do this by sound alone.
Thanks! |
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| RichieV |
| you are finding it difficult because percussion tend to have aperiodic harmonic structure. There is really no point to tune drums because they essentially are noise based. The only time i've seen people tune kicks is when they have a rather pure sine based tail that might clash with a different pitched bass. |
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| DJ RANN |
| quote: | Originally posted by cammaxwell
I'm trying to make sure my drums are in the same key as the rest of my track, how do I do this?
I'm aware of analyzing the frequencies for the peak and then converting to a note, but I find it very difficult with kicks. Is the right way to do this, unfortunately my ears are not trained enough yet to do this by sound alone.
Thanks! |
This has been debated many times but often the fastest way (and my opinion) is to just try different kicks/perc until it sounds right.
You can spend ages tuning percussion and it only takes seconds to try a new sample.
Also, kicks, unless they have a lot of tonal content are in some cases pretty universal but obviously this also depends on the rest of the perc.
One of the reasons why the 808 sound was so popular is that they are non-descript in tonal content and fit in so many different cases.
My advice is just to try other kicks and only get in to tuning if you really love that sample and want to make it work. |
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| cryophonik |
Yes, it has been debated to death and IMO it's not necessary, nor is it very feasible (depending on the noise content vs. harmonic content as stated above) to tune your kicks to the key of the track. That said, there is no reason not to tune your drums until they sound good in the context of your track. This is very easy to do with almost any drum sampler.
| quote: | Originally posted by cammaxwell
..unfortunately my ears are not trained enough yet to do this by sound alone.
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Then work at it. Load your kick drum into a sampler (most DAWs have one, or use Battery, Guru, RMV, or whatever you have) and use the tune/pitch parameter. Raise or lower it a few cents at a time until it sounds good in the context of your track - it doesn't have to be in the same key and, in fact, much of the time you will want it to clash so that it stands out. |
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| Beatflux |
| quote: | Originally posted by cryophonik
Yes, it has been debated to death |
Where? On gearslutz?
Don't drummer tune their drum kits? I don't know anything about real drumming. |
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| RichieV |
| they "tune it" but not to have a defined pitch unless it is a pitched percussion instrument like tympani. Tuning a drum set just means adjusting the lugs to improve the overall tone of the drum. |
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| cryophonik |
| Have you ever seen a live drummer re-pitch his drums every time a song is played in a new key? ;) |
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| cammaxwell |
Ok great, thanks guys. It wasn't even that my kicks weren't sound right in the mix, it was more that I thought maybe I wasn't doing something right. I'll definitely tune them in a sampler now to see if I can get them sounding better.
Cheers! |
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| cryophonik |
| quote: | Originally posted by Beatflux
Don't drummer tune their drum kits? I don't know anything about real drumming. |
Just to follow up on this question/comment, I've played with literally hundreds of drummers in my lifetime and one thing I've noticed is that most of them are completely pitch-deaf. Most of the time, they are tuning their drums (particularly their toms and kick) to control response (i.e., the amount of "give" and rebound) and the amount of ringing, much more so than their pitch. |
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| aNYthing |
| ^^^ side question, maybe you can ask your drummer friends: I was watching PF Live a Pompeii - and drummer had what appeared to be wine corks duck taped to the drums. I'm curious WTF? The only logical explanation I could thnk of was - some dampening properties to reduce the buzz? would be interesting to find out. |
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| cryophonik |
| quote: | Originally posted by aNYthing
^^^ side question, maybe you can ask your drummer friends: I was watching PF Live a Pompeii - and drummer had what appeared to be wine corks duck taped to the drums. I'm curious WTF? The only logical explanation I could thnk of was - some dampening properties to reduce the buzz? would be interesting to find out. |
Yeah, that would be for dampening. But, I don't think that it was duct tape holding them on - I think Nick Mason just puked them up and they hardened on to the drum heads. :p |
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| Existo22 |
Ok peep this. I will now explain how to key drums. Open logic. Drop A kick on a channel.
What you got there?
Well click on it to open the logic sampler.
Make sure you are on that track. Then Click Audio to score. Drag the midi file created to a instrument channel. You will see that the sample is is D. You need it to be in c were the rest of the track is. Go back to the audio channel. Open it time and pitch machine and pitch the down 200 cents. If you got serato algorithm its better.
100 cents is one semitone. In case you are a no music fag-boy opportunist a semitone is the distance between a black key and and a white one on the piano.
Well now you need to pitch it down 200 cents. 100 cents will get you to D Flat.
Another 100 will get you to c were the rest of your track is. (Supposively.)
Hit process and save the on your Desktop.
Now open battery or whatever else you use to with your drums.
Put the sample you keyed on to the track. You know that it is in C.
What does that tell you? Well you are at 32.7 cycles.
Pull out the sony oxford coz the eq you got on your board is fixed :whip: and run a high pass right there. Dont with the warmth yet.
How many octaves do you want you kick to occupy?
The bottom 3? Wanna drop it low and bring the snare right on to of it at the fourth or fith octave like for ex 261.6 cycles?
You can do that. You can make a record like the big boys do...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQeCDb99wNU
And Dj Rawn The 808 kick is in g#. So Get it right ;) |
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