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Predictions for the future of EDM? (pg. 4)
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| pozz |
| i always had this idea beats would be transmitted through the building itself rather than through speakers. it has been done in museums and such, where the foundation of the buildings are hooked up to oscillators, but the music is just drones at very low frequencies. not very interesting. it could be done for sure, but this project will cost much moola. |
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| Light The Fuse |
| quote: | Originally posted by pozz
i always had this idea beats would be transmitted through the building itself rather than through speakers. it has been done in museums and such, where the foundation of the buildings are hooked up to oscillators, but the music is just drones at very low frequencies. not very interesting. it could be done for sure, but this project will cost much moola. |
yeah in melbourne there are massive noise restrictions and the old style warehouse/docks parties are really a thing of the past. they tried the silent rave thing (where you have a couple of thousand punters with headphones on) - it kind of worked - but the only way i could see it totally working is if they were to do just what you have spoken of - a subsonic pulse that you feel rather than hear.
surely this is possible |
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| pozz |
| quote: | Originally posted by Light The Fuse
yeah in melbourne there are massive noise restrictions and the old style warehouse/docks parties are really a thing of the past. they tried the silent rave thing (where you have a couple of thousand punters with headphones on) - it kind of worked - but the only way i could see it totally working is if they were to do just what you have spoken of - a subsonic pulse that you feel rather than hear.
surely this is possible |
for sure, but for a party to happen the building would have be constructed such that the reverberations dont reach the outside. the difficulty is that the structure itself is the source of the sound. i have no idea about the effects on people though -- who knows, everyone inside could have their brain pour out of their ears as soon as the music is turned on.:stongue:
i keep thinking of audio installations that use some advanced surround sound, too. not too many of these around at the moment. INA-GRM in France will probably do something crazy like this soon. |
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| stevö |
| quote: | Originally posted by SYSTEM-J
Why do you think I mentioned those particular albums when listing "talked about" music? As in: they're at the height of trendiness at the moment. Those LPs probably sold a lot more copies than any 12" this year. When people look back at 2010 in electronic music, those records will come up in discussion.
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oh i thought you mentioned them also because they're examples of innovative dance music that cant be categorized, well i just put it in a category. a sucky name but whatever. theres a lot of music like that - someone puts on some whiny complex emotion pretty music at a party and no one really breaks a sweat on the living room floor to it, but hey its the newest cutting edge in dance music dont you know? and people that are prevalent in your local "underground dance" scene that are at your party will be like "yea props man excellent music taste, i heard about those guys ... on the internet", or "yea their live pa was great ... been trying to book those guys down here so we can have some of the real ish in our crappy little scene for once - god i cant wait till i move to new york next semester ugh".
yeah you're probably right, a live pa of that music probably adds a human energy element to it and would motivate a crowd, with each artist doing it in their own unique expressive way. but it sucks that so many djs have their head shoved so far up ra's ass that they continually try to incorporate this personal expressive live pa type music into their tech house or dubstep sets. and they dont give up! each guest spot at whatever local scene party they try it again and again even though last time it didnt work so well. their identity of being "underground" or the false idea that they are expressing themselves artistically as a dj is more important than making people happy at a party.
| quote: | Originally posted by SYSTEM-J
You're making a completely false opposition. Something can elude generic categorisation and still have a massive beat underneath it. An older example would be Orbital - most of Orbital's work does not fit any genre, but nobody who's ever seen Orbital live would say they aren't danceable.
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i never made a blanket or matter of fact statement about that (i didn't say "all" or "always"). i was still referring to the 3 example albums you gave. i sure as hell wasnt talking about orbital, i said theres a flip side to being experimental that's all. works great as a live pa and as dj tracks - that's orbital. works great as a live pa but not so easy to use in dj sets - that's caribou and the hordes of other magazine darlings. annnnnd orbital's musical message was understood and appreciated by a wider audience compared to the more abstract message from artists of the past few years lately. so no, was not talking about orbital. why do you and other career internet debaters do that? split hairs and try to portray someones words into something different to discredit them? |
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| SYSTEM-J |
| quote: | Originally posted by stevö
oh i thought you mentioned them also because they're examples of innovative dance music that cant be categorized, well i just put it in a category. |
I mentioned them for both reasons - because they are effectively genreless and they are very popular and talked about. If a record has a repetitive beat on it, there's probably people who will dance to it. Again, you claim to play footwork, and I couldn't imagine anyone finding that remotely danceable in a club. Apparently it happens.
| quote: | | i never made a blanket or matter of fact statement about that (i didn't say "all" or "always"). i was still referring to the 3 example albums you gave. i sure as hell wasnt talking about orbital, i said theres a flip side to being experimental that's all. works great as a live pa and as dj tracks - that's orbital. works great as a live pa but not so easy to use in dj sets - that's caribou and the hordes of other magazine darlings. annnnnd orbital's musical message was understood and appreciated by a wider audience compared to the more abstract message from artists of the past few years lately. so no, was not talking about orbital. why do you and other career internet debaters do that? split hairs and try to portray someones words into something different to discredit them? |
Because there was no indication you were still talking about those specific albums? You stopped mentioning them and started talking generally about concepts like genre and dancefloor-friendly. And what's your point about Orbital's "message"? Aren't you basically claiming Orbital were more popular than these acts, and therefore their music is somehow more valid?
Basically, it seems like you're arguing that dance music should not be remotely challenging or artistic and it should be essentially an entertainment industry transaction - you pay your entrance fee and expect a certain amount of unchallenging entertainment in return, like going to Pizza Hut or something. Why? |
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| stevö |
| quote: | Originally posted by SYSTEM-J
Because there was no indication you were still talking about those specific albums? You stopped mentioning them and started talking generally about concepts like genre and dancefloor-friendly. And what's your point about Orbital's "message"? Aren't you basically claiming Orbital were more popular than these acts, and therefore their music is somehow more valid?
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hmm, well, whatever, i thought it was clear enough. i could be wrong but it *seems* like you chose to take it as me making hard and fast rules because you are in attack debate mode (because i made fun of the music you like?) aren't you the same one usually telling people not to act butt hurt when their music tastes are attacked? (go ahead and make fun of footwork, i wont defend it even though i love that ). this is why debating on the internet sucks, because you almost need to make a long list of disclaimers at the end of every post "no i dont mean xxx, and no i dont mean xxx either" to avoid people finding ways to paint your words into a bad picture. the point about orbital being more accessible is just pointing out another attribute that the new stuff doesnt have. and im not saying one artist is more valid than the other, especially not because of popularity, i just consider orbital not to be part of this category i made up because it doesnt lose functionality or lose its meaning on as many people while still being "genreless", or for the sake of being genreless.
| quote: | Originally posted by SYSTEM-J
Basically, it seems like you're arguing that dance music should not be remotely challenging or artistic and it should be essentially an entertainment industry transaction - you pay your entrance fee and expect a certain amount of unchallenging entertainment in return, like going to Pizza Hut or something. Why? |
no im just expressing my dislike for what journalists champion, and trying to explain what those qualities seem to be the past couple years leading up to 2010. to sum it up - its artistic or challenging but not dancefloor friendly enough. you said it yourself:
| quote: | Originally posted by SYSTEM-J
All the most talked-about electronic music of 2010 I can only see filed vaguely under "electronic" in my local record store.
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see? you said electronic music, not electronic DANCE music, so yea i could also see it filed vaguely under "electronic". "electronic" doesnt pack people back in the club again, losing focus of the dancefloor doesnt do us any favors.
its too easy to make artistic or challenging music. but to make artistic or challenging music catchy on the dancefloor? now thats hard and not many people can pull that off. unfortunately the direction dance music is going has less priority on that. |
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| SYSTEM-J |
You've got it all wrong. Firstly, those records were just examples of a larger point about genreless music. This discussion isn't about those albums or even that "type" of music, such as it is. I would have used Orbital as an example, if they'd released a talked-about album in 2010. You're focusing on the specific examples, I'm talking about something much larger, which is why to me it sounds like you're conflating "undanceable" with "genreless".
I'm not getting defensive about those records because I only really like the FlyLo album. I think the Actress album is e, and Caribou's is an interesting record spoiled by poor production. Go find the thread from last week where we were listing our favourite albums of the year. Compare my list to RA's list and see how much trendy Internet-journalist music I rated in 2010. Again, I was using those albums because they're very well known examples. You're focalising this discussion far too much around your dislike of Resident Advisor, which isn't relevant to what I was saying.
Finally, I'm not "attacking" footwork in any real sense. I don't like footwork, but that wasn't the point I was making. I would merely expect someone who likes footwork to have a more open mind about unconventional electronic dance music. |
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| stevö |
| quote: | Originally posted by SYSTEM-J
You've got it all wrong. Firstly, those records were just examples of a larger point about genreless music. This discussion isn't about those albums or even that "type" of music, such as it is. I would have used Orbital as an example, if they'd released a talked-about album in 2010. You're focusing on the specific examples, I'm talking about something much larger, which is why to me it sounds like you're conflating "undanceable" with "genreless".
I'm not getting defensive about those records because I only really like the FlyLo album. I think the Actress album is e, and Caribou's is an interesting record spoiled by poor production. Go find the thread from last week where we were listing our favourite albums of the year. Compare my list to RA's list and see how much trendy Internet-journalist music I rated in 2010. Again, I was using those albums because they're very well known examples. You're focalising this discussion far too much around your dislike of Resident Advisor, which isn't relevant to what I was saying.
Finally, I'm not "attacking" footwork in any real sense. I don't like footwork, but that wasn't the point I was making. I would merely expect someone who likes footwork to have a more open mind about unconventional electronic dance music. |
ok my bad. well, anyhoo ... its more of a dislike of the "resident advisor factor" and how that collection of opinions have so much influence. when you said "ing footwork" it sounded like you were cricizing my taste for it while also asking how i could like it but not those 3 albums. so ill explain: because imo the beats are way better, its more creative and rule breaking, the producers have better taste in their sounds they sample, and it feels more genuine because it didn't follow the same evolution pattern that other unconventional dance music followed. |
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| Guest |
what we need are looser restrictions on the ingredients to make high purity MDMA. I heard you can still get it in europe but along with that are total pills aka piperazines which a lot of people are allergic to. It feels like your skin is on fire if you have a reaction to it.
Or we need the invention of another club drug that produces energy and euphoria. Otherwise club culture it will continue to flatline into the abyss as people ingest pharmaceuticals and ketamine. Everytime I go out now everyone's sober or moped out and its obvious this has had a detrimental impact on the vibe at parties and also attendance in general.
10 years ago all you had to do to score at a party was find the skinny kid with the backpack and the bright colored hair dye and you were money. Now its like BYOD.
If/When the euro crashes, and the dollar follows, you'll suddenly see less policing and a much more "free" environment for partying in general |
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| djnitride |
| quote: | Originally posted by Guest
what we need are looser restrictions on the ingredients to make high purity MDMA. I heard you can still get it in europe but along with that are total pills aka piperazines which a lot of people are allergic to. It feels like your skin is on fire if you have a reaction to it.
Or we need the invention of another club drug that produces energy and euphoria. Otherwise club culture it will continue to flatline into the abyss as people ingest pharmaceuticals and ketamine. Everytime I go out now everyone's sober or moped out and its obvious this has had a detrimental impact on the vibe at parties and also attendance in general.
10 years ago all you had to do to score at a party was find the skinny kid with the backpack and the bright colored hair dye and you were money. Now its like BYOD.
If/When the euro crashes, and the dollar follows, you'll suddenly see less policing and a much more "free" environment for partying in general |
Yep, you get all these kids popping piperazines left and right getting all cracked up thinking they are rolling balls when they are having hot/cold flashes, a blistering headache, and a fake synthetic feeling euphoria, giving parties that bottom of the barrel feel. WHAT HAPPENED TO THE LOVE???
Without much pure MDMA going around especially in the USA, alot less people are attracted to EDM in the first place. The ones that are content to drink a ton or get piped out, get in fights, and dance to dubstep, deadmau5 or sweedish house mafia.
Im not saying I am promoting drug use, but I think you are right in the fact that lack of pure MDMA is a major contributing factor to killing the good vibe of alot of parties. That vibe is absent at all the events I have been to in the past few years. |
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| PivotTechno |
| A select few individuals will produce utterly, mindbendingly brilliant music. |
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