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So the US government starts shutting down tomorrow... (pg. 14)
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| The17sss |
| quote: | Originally posted by Lews
I know a lot of democrats who agree social security needs to be reformed.
Also also, how much of the population is under the poverty line? How many people are unemployed? How many people are underwater on their houses? They pay plenty of taxes on other things, but clearly a number of people aren't going to be paying income taxes when they're struggling to get by. Now clearly we need to have some tax reform in this country, but throwing out the 50% number is just disingenuous. |
I also know a lot of Democrats who SAY entitlements need to be reformed, but they never do about it. Ever.
You're frame of reference is so warped you don't know what "poor" is. "Poor" people here have cell phones, flat screens, and $100 Nike kicks. People considered "under the poverty line", primarily single parent families, get so many handouts, "tax credits" (welfare checks), and so on that they end up having more disposable income that a family of 4 making 60K paying their taxes. Sound crazy? I had this discussion with Ben a few weeks ago and he didn't beleive it either, till I showed him the analysis done by Wyatt Emmerch.
Clickity click--> http://i.imgur.com/e5AQk.jpg
| quote: | | Also also also, we're nowhere near a ing Greece scenario so shut the up. |
Do your research before making uninformed stupid statements, . Ever heard of Bill Gross? He runs Pimco, the world's largest mutual fund. I guess you missed his appearance on CNBC last month where he explained how we are actually in worse financial shape than Greece, and who the will be buying our Treasury bonds now? (hint- it won't be Pimco):
| quote: | US Is In Worse Shape Financially Than Greece: Gross
When adding in all of the money owed to cover future liabilities in entitlement programs the US is actually in worse financial shape than Greece and other debt-laden European countries, Pimco’s Bill Gross told CNBC Monday.
Much of the public focus is on the nation’s public debt, which is $14.3 trillion. But that doesn’t include money guaranteed for Medicare, Medicaid and Social Security, which comes to close to $50 trillion, according to government figures.
The government also is on the hook for other debts such as the programs related to the bailout of the financial system following the crisis of 2008 and 2009, government figures show.
Taken together, Gross puts the total at “nearly $100 trillion,” that while perhaps a bit on the high side, places the country in a highly unenviable fiscal position that he said won’t find a solution overnight.
“To think that we can reduce that within the space of a year or two is not a realistic assumption,” Gross said in a live interview. “That’s much more than Greece, that’s much more than almost any other developed country. We’ve got a problem and we have to get after it quickly.”
"Canada or Austria is a much better bet these days. If Greece ends up melting down, investors won’t seek shelter in the dollar, but in German debt instead. With our ugly balance sheet, the US is no longer a safe bet." |
http://www.cnbc.com/id/43378973 |
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| enydo |
Kevin link me to more articles.
I'm so ing FASCINATED with what you have to say. |
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| Joss Weatherby |
The thing that Kevin doesn't realize is that the national debt isn't HURTING US AT ALL.
No one is going to call in our debt. The Chinese are tied to the value of our dollar, the EU/Eurozone is incredibly weak right now, and most of the other Asian economies are down in the doldrums and do not have the clout to do anything otherwise.
So why do we have to cut social programs? Why did your party invent this crisis?
We could run up another 14 trillion in debt and it wouldn't harm anyone because we are so tied up in this mess together, the whole world I mean.
So, again, why did you invent this crisis? |
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| Joss Weatherby |
| Also Kevin, it, seriously. Your party is clearly on the wrong side of history and your antics will be the end of us, so keep going man, keep going. |
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| pkcRAISTLIN |
I feel like stealing an icy-pole to get the taste of bull out of my mouth.
Kev, I don’t dispute the fact that the US has a spending problem. Tautologically, all and every deficit ever has been caused by spending. This fact isn’t being debated. However, when economists rather than journos crunch the numbers it is quite clear that without the wars, GFC, and tax cuts, the budget would be much closer to balanced. Sure, we could pull anything out of the spending pie and point to it as being a contributor, but the allegation that obama’s policies and spending have tripled the deficit = pure fantasy.
The point is that without a corresponding cut in spending, bush’s tax cuts were ill-advised and irresponsible (and that’s not even covering the prescription drugs act, have fun paying for that too.) |
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| pkcRAISTLIN |
| quote: | Originally posted by Joss Weatherby
No one is going to call in our debt. |
There is no such thing as “calling in debt”. Bond holders can no more call in their debt for immediate payment than my bank can. |
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| pkcRAISTLIN |
| quote: | Originally posted by The17sss
I also know a lot of Democrats who SAY entitlements need to be reformed, but they never do about it. Ever. |
4 words: republican prescription drugs act. |
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| Joss Weatherby |
| quote: | Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN
There is no such thing as “calling in debt”. Bond holders can no more call in their debt for immediate payment than my bank can. |
EXACTLY. I meant to convey that as it is impossible. As long as we can pay off the bare minimum interest payments we are fine.
If we use the money we borrow to improve our economy by spending on infrastructure and increasing the spending power of our citizenry we can continue to grow our economy enough to cover the bare minimum of our debt and be much better off for it.
Thats how the system works, its so incredibly stupid, but people apparently believe in it (Marx be damned on his ideas of capital :p).
Look at Japan, huge amounts of national debt, yet they are not in any sort of crisis about it because they know the system is meant to support this sort of behavior. |
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| knowhope |
| Joss, do you actually believe that will happen anytime soon? We keep wishing for the best and creating theories to make a country better, but so far no results like that has yet to be lived. |
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| Joss Weatherby |
| quote: | Originally posted by knowhope
Joss, do you actually believe that will happen anytime soon? We keep wishing for the best and creating theories to make a country better, but so far no results like that has yet to be lived. |
No, Americans are too stupid. They have no common cultural identity or bond. We essentially formed this country because the rest of Europe rejected the groups that moved here. We are the social, religious, and ethnic outcasts of the rest of the world with no trace of coherence. Our only saving grace was being in the right place at the right time during a number of external events. The US has always been a reactor to world change, not a creator of it. |
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| jupiterone |
U.S Government:
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