|
new subway system! (wishful thinking for the TTC, lol) (pg. 10)
|
View this Thread in Original format
| DigiNut |
Oh for 's sake, the TTC wants to take the focus OFF of subways and put it ONTO streetcars/buses, and screw up every single street in the city?
Originally I was saying that the TTC was doing the best it could with the money it had, but after hearing that, I say the TTC, they don't understand a god damn thing, and we need private enterprise to take over transit here. |
|
|
| smuncky |
| quote: | Originally posted by dEsidEL
i agree with the red tape.. the stupid environmental assessment for the York University line was slated to take years and pre-planning won't even start till sometime in 2006.. rediculous
|
bah
screw the environment lol
build the subway!!!! |
|
|
| amb_ |
What ever happened to politicians like Bill Davis (1971 - 1985, a Tory), instrumental in altering transportation plans throughout Ontario by redirecting major financial support to expansion of public transit from expressways in a bid to influence citizens to abandon use of their cars in favour of public transportation vehicles. It was his vision that there would no longer be a need for road expansion.
He also championed the Fair Share Deal. This legislation saw the province provide up to 75% of capital costs for the TTC, which included vehicle replacement and infrastructure maintenance or upgrades. In addition, Toronto and Queen's Park split the operating subsidy of one third of operating costs, with ridership accounting two thirds through fares.
The TTC hasn't seen ridership increases since Bill Davis
Or what about people who got things done while they were in office, such as former Prime Minister Arthur Meighen (1920 - 1921, 1926, also a Conservative), who united the government-owned and floundering privately-owned railways to form the Canadian National Railway in the midst of the railroad boom at the turn of the century...
Canadian National Railway track, circa 1937
We need people like this in power again... |
|
|
| malek |
Building a subway line is extremly expensive, no wonder the grid isn't well developped in major canadian cities.
In Montreal, they're building a new 5.2KM, 3 station extention which will cost in excess of 800 million $$! which is around 154.5 M$ per KM! Its taking around 5 years to build that!!!
The new extention is in orange in the top of the map! |
|
|
| discojoe |
| quote: | Originally posted by dEsidEL
update:
source:
http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/Co...ol=968793972154
doesn't look like there's gonna be any new subways any time soon..
i just can't believe that it costs $1.5 billion dollars to build a subway line to York University ?? wtf ?! :eyes:
kinda makes you wonder how other major cities were able to afford just an extensive subway system ..
|
I think one of the problems is that, in europe especially, other cities have a more dense population. So a new expensive subway line would reach far more people for the same distance. Its not the only problem but it might be an explanation. |
|
|
| amb_ |
| quote: | Originally posted by malek
In Montreal, they're building a new 5.2KM, 3 station extention which will cost in excess of 800 million $$! which is around 154.5 M$ per KM! Its taking around 5 years to build that!!!
|
That's a pretty good deal, compared to former Toronto Mayor Mel Lastman's "Subway to Nowhere" Sheppard Line. Ringing in at nearly 1 billion dollars (not including the new subway vehicles necessary to put this line into service), and covering just under 6.4km.
Add to this that it took us over 8 years to put this line into operation (we didn't have to deal with Riviere Des Prairies being in the way), and it makes Montréal's expansion look very attractive. |
|
|
| ShadoWolf |
Rule of thumb: you only build a subway when there's something above ground that's worth saving.
Suburban TO has NOTHING above ground worth saving! Subways are therefore a total waste of money.
What we need are above-ground trains and trams.
Has anyone here been to Berlin? I have, and I can tell you that they have the best transportation system I've ever seen.
http://www.bvg.de/e_index.html
Check out their train map, which includes mixed above- and underground trains. They also have trams for more suburban areas.
pwned!!! |
|
|
| Endlesswave |
I was in Berlin this past summer with a few TAs. *sigh* if only we had something like the S-Bahn or U-Bahn......http://www.bvg.de/images/sunetz_aktuell.pdf
OWNAGE. Plus drinking a German Pilsner while on it brings back fond memories...:toothless |
|
|
| amb_ |
| quote: | Originally posted by discojoe
I think one of the problems is that, in europe especially, other cities have a more dense population. So a new expensive subway line would reach far more people for the same distance. Its not the only problem but it might be an explanation. |
You're forgetting that Toronto has an area with one of the highest population densities in the world. The population of St. James Town is the same as the town of Lindsay, Ontario and the same as the entire territory of Nunavut (approximately 25,000 people).
In the broader scope, the Golden Horseshoe's part in the nation's economic prosperity cannot be ignored. We can only hope that this issue doesn't fall by the wayside of political complacency. |
|
|
| amb_ |
| quote: | Originally posted by ShadoWolf Has anyone here been to Berlin? I have, and I can tell you that they have the best transportation system I've ever seen.
http://www.bvg.de/e_index.html
Check out their train map, which includes mixed above- and underground trains. They also have trams for more suburban areas. |
Interestingly enough, the sweeping majority of Germany's above-ground public transit uses Bombardier Transporatation technology.
Why can't we use our own technologies to solve crises here at home? |
|
|
| ShadoWolf |
Berlin:
Structural data:
(As of 31 Dec. 2003)
Area of Berlin:
892 km2
Inhabitants:
3.39 million
Underground system
No. of lines: (day / night)
9 - 7
Total line length in km (day / night)
144.2 - 120.3
Total route length in km (day / night)
151.7 - 120.3
Stations (day / night)
170 - 145
Platforms (day / night)
389 - 330
Average distance between stations (km)
0.79
Average speed
30.9
Wide gauge (km/h)
32.7
Narrow gauge (km/h)
27.2
Tram system
No. of lines (day / night)
27 - 5
Total line length in km (day / night)
187.7 - 57.2
Total route length in km (day / night)
362.6 - 59.7
Tram stops (day / night)
377 - 110
Unidirectional tram stops (day / night)
789 - 224
Average distance between stops (km)
0.461
Average tram speed (km/h)
19.4
Bus system
No. of lines (day / night)
161 - 54
Total line length in km (day / night)
1.271 - 568
Total route length in km (day / night)
1.905 - 754
Bus stops (day / night)
2.730 - 1.522
Unidirectional bus stops (day / night)
6.822 - 3.188
Average distance between stops (km)
0.52
Average bus speed (km/h)
19.56
ExpressBus
22.71
Bus lanes (km), unidirectional
101.923
Underground vehicles
Total vehicles
1.361
wide gauge
840
narrow gauge
521
Tram vehicles
Total vehicles
602
Tatra drive carriages
388
trailer carriages
64
low platform articulated trams
one-directional vehicels
105
low platform articulated trams
bi-directional vehicles
45
Bus vehicles
Total vehicles
1.426
double-deckers
394
single-deckers
512
articulated busses
409
special services and bus pool
111
Personnel
Total
12.878
staff members
9.234
apprentices
422
Infrastructure facilities
Escalators, underground
366
Lifts, underground (total)
71
Underground stations with lifts
46
Ramps in underground stations
10
Sales machines / ticket printers
3.649
Ticket cancelling machines
6.309
Emergency and information columns
521
Operating resources
Operating maintenance facilities, total
16
underground workshops
3
tram workshops
6
bus workshops
7
Depots
12
tram depots
5
bus depots
7
Main underground workshops
2
Operating maintenance facilities (underground)
central workshops bus
1
1 |
|
|
| ShadoWolf |
Keep in mind that Germany has 2.5X the population of Canada, and is far richer than Canada.
I think Canadians forget how poor we've become relative to other OECD economies. |
|
|
|
|
