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Did Ferry Corsten killed trance? (pg. 23)
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| Sykonee |
| quote: | Originally posted by kr00t0n
Seems more like people hate breakdowns, not epic trance, even though they do go hand in hand :toothless |
That's about it in a nutshell, really. Of course, a breakdown here and there is fine, but not song after song. It just kills the flow of the rhythm.
That's just my taste, mind. I'm sure there are those who enjoy breakdowns every 5-8 minutes just fine, even look forward to them. More the power to them.:) |
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| sandstorm03 |
| quote: | Originally posted by kr00t0n
Seems more like people hate breakdowns, not epic trance, even though they do go hand in hand :toothless |
i dont think i can name any music with out a breakdown really...
maby some techno tracks but that is quite dull... |
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| Subey |
| quote: | Originally posted by sandstorm03
Even some tracks with vocals mean nothing, satellite? can anyone tell me the meaning to it? |
I could... but you wouldn't believe me |
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| SYSTEM-J |
| quote: | Originally posted by Blue Balls
Prove it. Give us some examples.
Prove it. Give us some examples.
If you can give proof to your argument than I would agree with you. |
I'm going back to an earlier post here. Epic trance has more musical merit than classic trance because the melodies employed are without exception more complex and there tend to be more than one within a track. Classic trance has very simple and short melodies that are repeated over longer periods. For a random example, take Age of Love (Jam & Spoon Mix) which is generally regarded as a very classic trance track and compare the melodies and repetition to System-F - Out of the Blue, a textbook epic trance record. See that the former has an effective but simplistic bassline and a short, choiral lead. See that the former has four seperate hooks, from very simple to fairly complex, in addition to the bassline.
The percussive elements are also more sophisticated (largely because it's more recently made, but still) and the production as a whole is much stronger. If you play an old trance track loud and then mix into a new trance track, the newer one towers over in the mix because the sound is so much fuller.
As for bad classic trance, take your pick. The amount of unoriginal and badly made classic trance is far from small, and personally I even think material such as Jam & Spoon's Tripomatic Fairytales 2001 to be pretty crap (sorry Sykonee). Of course, "bad" is subjective, so its hard to prove any classic trance as bad. But equally, you cannot prove any epic trance as bad. |
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| DJ Laher |
ferry did not kill trance
Just listen to indigo, kyoto, sublime and cubikated and then tell me if he killed trance. Ishkur's a dumbass, nuff said..
And as for paul oakenfold killing trance, thats gotta be the funniest ive heard ever on these boards, no wonder i dont post much *sigh* |
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| Sykonee |
| quote: | Originally posted by SYSTEM-J
As for bad classic trance, take your pick. The amount of unoriginal and badly made classic trance is far from small, and personally I even think material such as Jam & Spoon's Tripomatic Fairytales 2001 to be pretty crap (sorry Sykonee). Of course, "bad" is subjective, so its hard to prove any classic trance as bad. But equally, you cannot prove any epic trance as bad. |
:eyes:
Oh, d'ems fightin' words!:happy2: |
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| LazarusDJ |
| quote: | Originally posted by DJ Laher
ferry did not kill trance
Just listen to indigo, kyoto, sublime and cubikated and then tell me if he killed trance. Ishkur's a dumbass, nuff said..
And as for paul oakenfold killing trance, thats gotta be the funniest ive heard ever on these boards, no wonder i dont post much *sigh* |
+1 |
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| JakeC |
| I dunno what ive been listening to on my stereo for the past 2 hours cuz it cant be trance, aparently trance is dead. :rolleyes: |
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| eulerfx |
| quote: | Originally posted by JakeC
I dunno what ive been listening to on my stereo for the past 2 hours cuz it cant be trance, aparently trance is dead. :rolleyes: |
much like God, according to Nietzsche. |
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| Ishkur |
Age of Love might very well be the most perfect trance song ever made.
If I had to pick a top 5:
Age of Love - Age of Love
Resistance D - Cosmic Love
Union Jack - Red Herring
Underworld - Thing in a Book
William Orbit - Water From a Vine Leaf (technically not trance, but no one was caring at that point)
These are songs I could put on repeat and dance to for 8 straight hours without knowing I did. |
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| Aristronica |
| this thread is gold, should go in the archives in the future |
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| Cobalt |
| quote: | Originally posted by Zombie0915
alright, I can come up with a couple songs off the top of my head, that some people sonsider epic style, but doesn't quite fit in to this "definition"
"How can anyone take this trite, derivative garbage seriously? What the hell is this, anyway. It's bombastic melodrama; a pompous, over-the-top, monstrously grotesque caricature of what trance used to be. The final betrayel. Trance is dead. Ferry Corsten killed it."
It seems like you want an example of some epic trance songs that aren't pompous, over-the-top, obnoxious, what have you.
Now this is kind of hard because ideas like pompous, over-the-top, and grotesque caricature are subjective terms, any song I give can be judged as pompous or not depending on each person's point of view.
But I still have a few ideas,
PvD - Nothin but You
this one can fit that idea, as you have already said
I also find that PvD - Forbidden Fruit is an epic trancer that isn't pompous, it has a lot of emotion, so it can be argued that is is a "grotesque caricature of what trance used to be", since trance used to not have such emotion in it, but one can counter this argument by saying that this track is not grotesque, a songs "grotesqueness" canot be measured objectively. I find that this isn't a pompous track though, it almost has a humble vibe to it actually.
Another tune which could qualify is Salt Tank - Eugina, another epic track, but even people with a highly developed taste for EDM find this one pleasing to hear. The classification of this track as epic is arguable, so is any sort of over-the-top factor. Subjective ideas, so if you really want to beleive ishkurs definition badly enough, you can just say "this track is pompous." If you judge the music for yourself, you might come to a different conclusion. |
I think this has more to do with definition of epic trance (particularly Dutch) than it does with finding Dutch epic which isn't pompous and over-the-top. Some people will say there are pompous tracks within epic, whereas others will say that all Dutch epic trance is pompous and overblown, considering this a separate subgenre. I would go in the latter group, because I think the dividing trademark of Dutch epic trance IS overblown anthems with ridiculously long breakdowns. Take that away and it's just epic trance (like Forbidden Fruit), not Dutch. Eugina I wouldn't even call epic trance -- instead balearic trance or epic house -- so it's very dependent on the definitions people use.
Still, I think Dutch epic trance can be both its signature overblown self AND be good, but only on rare occasions, such as in Tenshi and Armin's 2000-01 work. It seems one of the most difficult trance genres to pull off effectively, actually. The problem isn't with the genre itself, but that it's enormously difficult to make, and legions of people with relatively little skill have taken on production. It's like high school watercolorists attempting to make Renaissance frescos.
| quote: | How about Tiesto vs Junkie XL - Obsession
This one is most definately a dutch trancer, because tiesto had a hand in it. |
Obsession is textbook progressive trance, not epic, and Junkie XL had more to do with its production than Tiesto.
Nothing But You I'm really on the fence about. I think it's too abrasive to be Dutch, which is much more melodic and orchestral. In addition, its breakdown isn't extraordinarily long compared to most Dutch. |
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