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War in Afghanistan and Iraq (pg. 3)
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| Jake Benson |
| America needs to invade Florida and bring it up to par with America. |
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| Silky Johnson |
| quote: | Originally posted by Fledz
Terrorism orginally. Now it's about not letting the place get even worse by just pulling out. |
Lol "pulling out". |
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| Arbiter |
| quote: | Originally posted by Theresa
why have we stayed for so long? |
Because we're more interested in killing as few of our enemies as possible than actually winning. |
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| Joss Weatherby |
Afghanistan, because it was being used as a base of operations for al Queda.
They have moved since then (though having been severely disrupted) so the fight there now is against a native insurgency funded by Arab actors (not the movie type!).
Iraq... false pretenses and neo-conservative insanity. Not a lot of people left, some 50,000 US "advisors" and that is it.
If you want to really look at the largest contribution these military actions have made its this: The people who want to hurt America and the west find its more bang for the buck to go to these war zones and cause havoc then sending them over here to blow up. The flip side of that is those that come away from these war zones are battle hardened and experienced (though there are few of those, the kill ratio between NATO and Afghani insurgents is very lopsided). |
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| Zewad |
| quote: | Originally posted by Joss Weatherby
Afghanistan, because it was being used as a base of operations for al Queda.
They have moved since then (though having been severely disrupted) so the fight there now is against a native insurgency funded by Arab actors (not the movie type!).
Iraq... false pretenses and neo-conservative insanity. Not a lot of people left, some 50,000 US "advisors" and that is it.
If you want to really look at the largest contribution these military actions have made its this: The people who want to hurt America and the west find its more bang for the buck to go to these war zones and cause havoc then sending them over here to blow up. The flip side of that is those that come away from these war zones are battle hardened and experienced (though there are few of those, the kill ratio between NATO and Afghani insurgents is very lopsided). |
^^ This is pretty close as any of the above mentions. ^^
Additionally, the powers that be at the upper echelons of US Gov didn't anticipate what would happen as a result of the former Iraq government being overthrown. Result - a lengthy combative conflict (not war, that was only 3 months in 2003) in which we(coalition forces, to include Canada) have been put in the situation to start the COIN(counter insurgency) fight to bring up Iraq and Afghanistan's government and militaries to a level which they can sustain their people's protection from internal or external aggressors. There are current AABs(Advise and Assist Brigades) in Iraq with strict rules to only assist the Iraq military with training and mentoring. Currently there is the "surge" in Afghanistan which will, as I predict, in a couple years transform into their own AABs including NATO forces.
Iraq = We invaded to overthrow their despot of a dictator, Sadam.
Afghanistan = Invited along with other NATO countries to help stop their former Taliban government, stop harboring terrorists and to bring it up to a level of higher safety and security. IMHO, this is much more challenging b/c of their lack of infrastructure and education. They are a long way off from being where they need to be.
Me =
Iraq - 31 January 2005 - 17 January 2006
Afghanistan - 11 November 2008 - 9 August 2009
Korea - 20 October 2010 - Present |
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| tubularbills |
| quote: | Originally posted by Zewad
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/thread |
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| EddieZilker |
| quote: | Originally posted by tubularbills
/thread |
+1, Zewad. |
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| Comrade Stalin |
| America fell right into Osama's hand. Their goal isn't really to defeat America with some huge attack that destroys America. They know they can't do that. Rather, it's much easier to bring a giant down by luring it into a swamp, bogging the giant down, until it dies of exhaustion. Kind of like the Soviet Union. |
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| Halcyon+On+On |
| What if you swamp it down and then draw it into a bog? Would that have the same effect? I've not killed as many giants you have, Krypton. |
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| Joss Weatherby |
Yea, Afghanistan is a generational war. The culture there is too strong and not even close to being in line with anything that ISAF is trying to get established. When every valley has its own tribe thats existed for hundreds or thousands of years they really don't understand the concept of unified, central government.
The big deal is that these guys are the ones doing all the fighting, but only because they are being paid by Arab actors and Taliban operating from Pakistan.
Its a sad situation, much akin to the "taming" of Native Americans during the 19th century... Except with much deadlier weapons and sponsors with lots of money helping the other side. Luckily it is not nearly as brutal as the Indian wars were (though the 10 some years the Russians were in there was close to the same level), but a serious solution in Afghanistan could take just as long to reach. :( |
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| Chris Crossland |
| We're at war!?:conf: |
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| Joss Weatherby |
Oh and if Theresa wants to know why everyone followed the US into Afghanistan, it is because of the NATO charter. An attack on one member nation is an attack on all member nations and they are obligated to respond in kind (to some degree and with some exceptions).
Now the debate of whether or not NATO forces should exist in any sort of non-agressive, non-offensive, policing action like what Afghanistan has become in a large part is a whole other debate, and not an old one at that. It was the same debate made during the Balkans crisis during the 1990s. |
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