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War in Afghanistan and Iraq (pg. 5)
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| Theresa |
| quote: | Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN
and in the last 9 years, how much work has been finished on that pipeline? |
I don't think that's relevant. The fact of the matter is, Afghanistan has a deal with Turkmenistan to get oil, and there is a plan to build the pipeline. Like I said, what do I know, but it wouldn't be stupid for the Americans to stick around as long as they can to make good with the people who are going to cash in on petroleum reserves of the Caspian Sea which are among the largest in the world.
You gotta clear the way before you can start building. The path planned for the pipeline is largely run by the taliban, the same area that we are trying to clear out. Odd coincidence.
I may be entirely wrong, but I am also not stupid enough to believe that we are just hanging out there for no reason, or for altruistic reasons. There is something in it for us, and future access to a whole ton of oil seems like a great motivator.
Unless you can give me a better reason? |
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| pkcRAISTLIN |
| quote: | Originally posted by Theresa
I don't think that's relevant. |
yeah, not at all! the primary reason according to you, is a pipeline that in 9 years doesn't even have a business plan. so, at a cost of roughly $1 trillion (if we just halve the costs of both wars for simplicity) the US has done exactly nothing to promote its primary reason for staying in the country.
| quote: | Originally posted by Theresa
The fact of the matter is, Afghanistan has a deal with Turkmenistan to get oil, and there is a plan to build the pipeline. Like I said, what do I know, but it wouldn't be stupid for the Americans to stick around as long as they can to make good with the people who are going to cash in on petroleum reserves of the Caspian Sea which are among the largest in the world. |
exactly, what do you know? nothing as far as i can tell. happy reading: http://propagandistmag.com/2010/10/...nspiracy-theory
i cannot vouch for that site, but she is a lot more compelling than you are.
| quote: | Originally posted by Theresa
You gotta clear the way before you can start building. The path planned for the pipeline is largely run by the taliban, the same area that we are trying to clear out. Odd coincidence. |
so you're saying it would be less of a coincidence if the US was trying to "clear out" regions not run by the taliban?
| quote: | Originally posted by Theresa
I may be entirely wrong, but I am also not stupid enough to believe that we are just hanging out there for no reason, or for altruistic reasons. |
that's possibly the only thing you're not stupid enough to believe.
| quote: | Originally posted by Theresa
There is something in it for us, and future access to a whole ton of oil seems like a great motivator.
Unless you can give me a better reason? |
the US is there to fight islamic extremists and attempt to leave a stable government in place before shipping out. it has exactly zero to do with your ficticious pipeline, and everything to do with US strategic concerns in the region (not to mention, political "face saving" concerns). |
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| Zharen |
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| Theresa |
| quote: | Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN
yeah, not at all! the primary reason according to you, is a pipeline that in 9 years doesn't even have a business plan. so, at a cost of roughly $1 trillion (if we just halve the costs of both wars for simplicity) the US has done exactly nothing to promote its primary reason for staying in the country.
exactly, what do you know? nothing as far as i can tell. happy reading: http://propagandistmag.com/2010/10/...nspiracy-theory
i cannot vouch for that site, but she is a lot more compelling than you are.
so you're saying it would be less of a coincidence if the US was trying to "clear out" regions not run by the taliban?
that's possibly the only thing you're not stupid enough to believe.
the US is there to fight islamic extremists and attempt to leave a stable government in place before shipping out. it has exactly zero to do with your ficticious pipeline, and everything to do with US strategic concerns in the region (not to mention, political "face saving" concerns). |
Yep... there is nothing in it for them at all. Just to get rid of some extremists and to "help" a country.
I'll bump this post in 10 years and we can see what has happened. In the meantime, I am going to agree that I am wrong and have no idea what I am talking about. :) |
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| Fledz |
| Agree totally with PKC and also posting to once again confirm what an idiot Theresa is :rolleyes: |
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| Theresa |
| quote: | Originally posted by Fledz
Agree totally with PKC and also posting to once again confirm what an idiot Theresa is :rolleyes: |
:tongue2
| quote: | Originally posted by RandomGirl
I am also playing a bit of devil's advocate for interesting discussion purposes. |
That isn't to retract my point that I don't believe we are there for no or altruistic reasons, or that I think oil is a big incentive. |
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| pkcRAISTLIN |
| quote: | Originally posted by Theresa
or that I think oil is a big incentive. |
but how do you get to that conclusion? im honestly curious. normally we'd follow logical points to their conclusion, but you've started it at the conclusion and gone nowhere. |
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| Theresa |
| quote: | Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN
but how do you get to that conclusion? im honestly curious. normally we'd follow logical points to their conclusion, but you've started it at the conclusion and gone nowhere. |
783 billion barrels of oil = $$$$$$$$$$$$$
The U.S. was planning to attack the middle east before 9/11 back in the 90's.
I don't know how reliable this site is, but:
http://www.newamericancentury.org/iraqclintonletter.htm
| quote: | | a significant portion of the world’s supply of oil will all be put at hazard. |
Google that one line... over 10,000 results reference that letter written in 1998. The American government isn't stupid. That amount of oil can make the country that controls it the next super power, especially as we run into more and more difficulty getting it. Considering the U.S.A. has been bankrupt for nearly a century, and they love their power, it makes sense for them to want a hand in it.
There are thousands upon thousands of articles written suggesting that oil is the number one incentive to stick it out in the middle east. Google it and pick whichever one you think is a valid source. Like I said, maybe I am wrong, but I find this a lot easier to believe (since there is a very clear, and obvious incentive involved), than some bull about altruism or whatever.
Unless someone can explain to me what the reason for staying is, and doesn't tell me it has something to do with us Westerners just being swell old people wanting to help out a pal, this seems the most logical.
There is always a motive that in the end, benefits the person acting. There wouldn't have been an invasion, and it wouldn't have lasted so friggen long, if there wasn't some anticipated/hoped payout at the end of the day. |
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| MrJiveBoJingles |
| quote: | Originally posted by Theresa
Considering the U.S.A. has been bankrupt for nearly a century... |
Wtf? :wtf: |
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| MrJiveBoJingles |
| quote: | Originally posted by Theresa
Unless someone can explain to me what the reason for staying is, and doesn't tell me it has something to do with us Westerners just being swell old people wanting to help out a pal, this seems the most logical. |
Reason for staying is to save face and maintain American image of being the world's greatest superpower capable of any military objective.
No need for "altruism" in there, contra your straw man. |
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| Theresa |
| quote: | Originally posted by MrJiveBoJingles
Wtf? :wtf: |
Guess it depends on how you define bankruptcy.
Bankrupt - at the end of one's resources; lacking, any person unable to discharge all his or her debts
Owing money to China and always at a deficit... I consider that bankrupt. |
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| Theresa |
| quote: | Originally posted by MrJiveBoJingles
Reason for staying is to save face and maintain American image of being the world's greatest superpower capable of any military objective.
No need for "altruism" in there, contra your straw man. |
Saving face? Seriously?
Trillions of dollars and peoples lives simply to save face? That just sounds ridiculous to me. |
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