Originally posted by paulversuspaul
The problem is that they do play the same tracks over and over again as it is. Go on youtube and pick any famous or premier dj, lets take sasha as an example. Literally search sasha live 2012, and you get a bunch of iphone clips of him spinning at various venues all throughout the year. Next go to 1001 tracklists and look up the tracks on sets that were broadcast. 60-70 percent of the tracks are unchanged from venue to venue. Heck most of the transitions are unchanged. I saw sasha for nye and i could literally predict half the set as I had already seen him play that stuff on youtube at other venues across the country. Its the same for just about any other big name DJ. And like i said, you dont need to keep playing "xpander" at every set. But integrating 30 years of music, and as many genres as possible to truly keep it fresh has serious potential. As an example, i went to a random and non national festival over the summer, and in one of the areas an unknown dj, at least by me, banged out a set in which he was playing modern and fresh deep house tracks mixed into some classic house, techno, and even some progressive from the 90s. He dropped "french kiss" and the place just exploded. and i dont even think most people knew that it was a famous song as the majority of people were very young. His set blew the big names acts completely out of the water and only the 50-100 people in that area realized it.
Sure, you'll see some of the same tracks pop up in their sets for a given period of time, which are usually the ones they like or get a positive reaction from the crowd. I'm just saying, with so many tracks available to them at any given time, they are more liable to move on from tracks that they used to play.
I see Digweed at least once every year and I've never heard him play the same track twice.
idoru
quote:
Originally posted by paulversuspaul
The problem is that they do play the same tracks over and over again as it is. Go on youtube and pick any famous or premier dj, lets take sasha as an example. Literally search sasha live 2012, and you get a bunch of iphone clips of him spinning at various venues all throughout the year. Next go to 1001 tracklists and look up the tracks on sets that were broadcast. 60-70 percent of the tracks are unchanged from venue to venue. Heck most of the transitions are unchanged. I saw sasha for nye and i could literally predict half the set as I had already seen him play that stuff on youtube at other venues across the country. Its the same for just about any other big name DJ. And like i said, you dont need to keep playing "xpander" at every set. But integrating 30 years of music, and as many genres as possible to truly keep it fresh has serious potential. As an example, i went to a random and non national festival over the summer, and in one of the areas an unknown dj, at least by me, banged out a set in which he was playing modern and fresh deep house tracks mixed into some classic house, techno, and even some progressive from the 90s. He dropped "french kiss" and the place just exploded. and i dont even think most people knew that it was a famous song as the majority of people were very young. His set blew the big names acts completely out of the water and only the 50-100 people in that area realized it.
I mean this in the nicest way possible, but the problem isn't the DJ, the problem is you.
When anybody steps up behind a set of decks in a venue they're not thinking, "Hmm, I wonder what I should play for the guy who's gonna listen to this at home". No, they're thinking about what's going to work at that particular venue, with that particular crowd. Put yourself in Sasha's shoes for a second - how many times each week are you boarding a plane to fly halfway across the world? How many different hotels and cities are you staying in each week, each month? How many opportunities, other than when you're in a club, do you get to really sit down and listen to music. Bear in mind that when you're constantly at clubs around the music, you do need a break, but your schedule only allows for brief breaks as it is, so you probably don't want to spend your precious little downtime behind decks or an MP3 player.
This type of grueling schedule has been part and parcel of all forms of music, not just dance music, for decades now (yes, even "back in the day" - sets just weren't recorded as frequently and people couldn't record videos with their phones). Huge-name artists, who don't have time to go over new music on the road, dig for new music and come up with tracklists and general ideas for their shows during their extended downtime. Then, they go and play that set for the people AT the shows, not the people downloading a bootleg copy at home. In reality, you're really not supposed to hear them playing in a country you're not in. So, if you check out every single clip of Sasha from 2012 on Youtube, if you listen to every single set from Sasha in 2012 that someone uploads, and then you go to see him in 2012, you're going to hear the same . It's your own fault.
Hell, the same concept applies to Digweed, and just like Doombot, I've seen him about once a year and I've never heard him play the same track. The difference between Doombot/myself and you, is that we're probably not downloading every single thing we can find.
paulversuspaul
quote:
Originally posted by idoru
I mean this in the nicest way possible, but the problem isn't the DJ, the problem is you.
When anybody steps up behind a set of decks in a venue they're not thinking, "Hmm, I wonder what I should play for the guy who's gonna listen to this at home". No, they're thinking about what's going to work at that particular venue, with that particular crowd. Put yourself in Sasha's shoes for a second - how many times each week are you boarding a plane to fly halfway across the world? How many different hotels and cities are you staying in each week, each month? How many opportunities, other than when you're in a club, do you get to really sit down and listen to music. Bear in mind that when you're constantly at clubs around the music, you do need a break, but your schedule only allows for brief breaks as it is, so you probably don't want to spend your precious little downtime behind decks or an MP3 player.
This type of grueling schedule has been part and parcel of all forms of music, not just dance music, for decades now (yes, even "back in the day" - sets just weren't recorded as frequently and people couldn't record videos with their phones). Huge-name artists, who don't have time to go over new music on the road, dig for new music and come up with tracklists and general ideas for their shows during their extended downtime. Then, they go and play that set for the people AT the shows, not the people downloading a bootleg copy at home. In reality, you're really not supposed to hear them playing in a country you're not in. So, if you check out every single clip of Sasha from 2012 on Youtube, if you listen to every single set from Sasha in 2012 that someone uploads, and then you go to see him in 2012, you're going to hear the same . It's your own fault.
Hell, the same concept applies to Digweed, and just like Doombot, I've seen him about once a year and I've never heard him play the same track. The difference between Doombot/myself and you, is that we're probably not downloading every single thing we can find.
I think people are missing the point I was making. I dont have a problem with them playing the same tracks. I brought up the fact that they play a lot of the same tracks against the argument that the reason they dont play older tracks is because its boring to play the same tracks venue to venue night after night. my point was that if they play a lot of tracks nightly that are new, the reason they dont play a 10 year old track because they dont want to play the same track again doesn't really hold water.
SYSTEM-J
They don't play old tracks because older tracks are less likely to fit in with modern material. There are a few genres (a lot of techno, for example) where old and new can blend pretty seamlessly, but Sasha (to stick with him) has always been known for playing a very up-front and contemporary sound. He would heavily change his style every 2-3 years or so even back in the halcyon days, when "progressive" actually meant something. When you do that, you do inevitably become dependent on new music. I'm no massive fan of what Sasha does these days, but he will still occasionally play older tracks even now - I'm pretty sure Austin said last time he saw Sasha he dropped Ruhe (Humate Remix). It's not out of the question, it's just pretty apparent that anything from 10+ years ago isn't going to fit except in rare moments.
Also, with Sasha in particular, he's made it clear in interviews he does not want to dwell on the past and trade in his legendary status, because that is an unofficial retirement from the frontline. He's still trying to do new things, not always successfully, but I have more respect for him for trying to push things, even if I like his modern sound a lot less than if he'd just call it a day and whip out the likes of Dreamstate (LSG Remix) at classics nights.
enydo
omggggg, yes. I was outside with some people smoking at the time, and I heard those familiar stabs and literally ran inside to dance my ass off. Was at about 4am in this dingy warehouse-type club in Atlanta, so that was pretty special. Unfortunately, the next time he came through here he played at the worst VIP-style club in the city.
He followed it up with some version of Morgan King - I'm Free too, just can't remember which.
I actually found a clip of it, although the quality is truly e.
There were a lot of people who recognized it, and people lost their on the floor.
paulversuspaul
quote:
Originally posted by enydo
omggggg, yes. I was outside with some people smoking at the time, and I heard those familiar stabs and literally ran inside to dance my ass off. Was at about 4am in this dingy warehouse-type club in Atlanta, so that was pretty special. Unfortunately, the next time he came through here he played at the worst VIP-style club in the city.
He followed it up with some version of Morgan King - I'm Free too, just can't remember which.
I actually found a clip of it, although the quality is truly e.
There were a lot of people who recognized it, and people lost their on the floor.
haha that is awesome. i think i would have ran over any women or small children to get inside.
EDIT/UPDATE: the people losing their to it is kind of my point. Those moments could become very special for those seeing it live.
As for systems point, i agree its very hard to make older songs fit into a set, but my main argument is that these premier djs have the talent and chops to pull it off and to me in the era of digital dj equipment that has made mixing so much easier its something that could separate someone like sasha from the rest by actually being able to pull it off live.
Adam420
What a garbage set (IMO - off Russel)
He was supposed to play here tonight but cancelled. After hearing this I'm kind of glad this was the case. Well at least I don't mind it now.
enydo
ew, that all sounds like the same stupid congo k-house.
so, definitely BPM.
SYSTEM-J
I imagine it would have been the William Orbit mix of I Am Free.
EDIT: I think Sasha has become a very hot-and-cold DJ these days, through the very versatility that people value so much from a DJ. When I saw him in 2009 it was mostly white noise tech garbage, but a couple of months later there was all that hype coming out of Australia that he was back to playing melodic trancey stuff. I saw him last April and it was a solid set, lots of big atmospheric Involver-esque tracks and great set structure, and then not long after that he can come out with snooze-fest K-hole nonsense.
Adam420
Exactly. It's like that 2-3 year cycle you mentioned earlier has become 2-3 months. He is simply not content playing the same style for too long. Personally I think he's a bit lost, musically, with his heart being constantly pulled in different directions. Sometimes he wants to do the k-house thing, sometimes he wants to do melodic prog, sometimes he wants to do dry boring white noise tech house, etc...It could be that he is also trying to cater to too many different crowds.
enydo
quote:
Originally posted by SYSTEM-J
I imagine it would have been the William Orbit mix of I Am Free.
I believe you are correct.
paulversuspaul
quote:
Originally posted by SYSTEM-J
a couple of months later there was all that hype coming out of Australia that he was back to playing melodic trancey stuff
Ii think this might have to do with the fact that its Australia, its one of the few places that have a real movement to get rid of ketamine out of the scene. They promote no K parties from what some friends were telling me, and also do their best to have people available to test pills for MDMA content on site from what i was reading. I hate to make a drug argument, because the music is great without it, but i think a lot of the loss of good trancey or progressive sounds has a lot to do with less good pills being available. Its really hard for some people to understand trance or progressive without having been on mdma to see how great it is live in a big club, and because of that most DJs who read a crowd just dont see a need to keep pushing up the bpm etc. At a certain point, even if sasha didnt want to play anything prog or trance related and realizes he has a room full of people who are really energetic and going crazy its hard to find a k-house track or techy garbage track to satisfy them and its time to drop something a little more melodic with a higher tempo. For most techno djs this is not a problem as you can just pitch up a lot of tech tracks to appease the masses. I saw carl cox a couple of years ago and he literally just pitched everything up to around 135bpm bc the crowd was just losing it. I have a couple of DJ friends, local socal guys no one famous, who usually play techno or deep house etc who always bring some classic progressive or trance with them just in case they end up playing to a jam packed crowd on good mdma to create that peak time moment they remember from when they first started going out, but sadly its never happened to them to be able to play it. To be honest, there isnt a lot of energy in most clubs now days, and ketamine literally sucks the life out of a party for everyone not on it.
