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Thread Hijacking at it's finest (pg. 10)
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| rabbitjoker |
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| ShadoWolf |
| quote: | Originally posted by karim
Only a dare if you see it as a formidable challenge. Who knows, you might even learn something..... |
I'm not going to question your basic beliefs or policy preferences, but your posts in this thread show a serious lack of factual knowledge.
For example: your assertion that the CPC is anti-gay.
Fact: they support civil unions with full gay rights.
check out: http://gayandright.blogspot.com/
| quote: | (note: not saying tribe's better, just that their political discussions go deeper due to sheer volume of participants and discussions)
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bull. check out this gem:
http://www.tribemagazine.com/board/...&threadid=93137
:rolleyes: |
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| Swamper |
Wow.. wonder how I missed reading this thread all day long.
Good times! |
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| Jayx1 |
| quote: | Originally posted by Swamper
Wow.. wonder how I missed reading this thread all day long.
Good times! |
drama at its finest LOL |
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| rabbitjoker |
Yappin' back and forth like a bunch of clowns (j/k).
:D ;) :p :toothless :haha: :crazy: :eyespop: :happy2: :tongue3 :tongue2 :gsmile: :toocool: |
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| karim |
| quote: | Originally posted by ShadoWolf
I'm not going to question your basic beliefs or policy preferences, but your posts in this thread show a serious lack of factual knowledge.
For example: your assertion that the CPC is anti-gay.
Fact: they support civil unions with full gay rights.
check out: http://gayandright.blogspot.com/
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You think it's always been like this? Only recently has Harper lightened up on gay marriage because of the huge critical backlash that he has faced when he first started stating his views on the issue. Remember, harper did lead the anti-gay marriage amendment which was ultimately defeated.
Not only that, onto another widely discussed conservative issue, who is he to say that everyone who seeks an abortion should recieve counselling that forces the moral issues down their throats before making the decision. Ultimately you know he really wants to ban abortion, but he can't say it without losing alot of potential voters.
What? Just cause they don't repeat what's written in editorials and agree with your point of view? :rolleyes:
:)
Karim |
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| ShadoWolf |
| quote: | Originally posted by karim
Only recently has Harper lightened up on gay marriage because of the huge critical backlash that he has faced when he first started stating his views on the issue. Remember, harper did lead the anti-gay marriage amendment which was ultimately defeated. |
First of all, CPC party policy is decided at the grassroots level with some input by the leader alone. Second, the CPC policy is EXACTLY what the Canadian people want: yes to gay rights, AND yes to traditional marriage.
http://www.compas.ca/data/050202-SameSex-EPC.pdf
Third, the Lieberal/NDP position on this issue is very extreme, because it ignores the majority.
| quote: | | Not only that, onto another widely discussed conservative issue, who is he to say that everyone who seeks an abortion should recieve counselling that forces the moral issues down their throats before making the decision. Ultimately you know he really wants to ban abortion, but he can't say it without losing alot of potential voters. |
Once again, you're ignoring the facts.
Harper is personally PRO-CHOICE; he's not a social conservative, he's a free-market libertarian. He's actually pissed off a lot of so-cons, esp. on partial birth abortion. The CPC itself is neutral on the issue; it would not introduce new abortion laws. IN that sense, it's arguably pro-choice, because that is the status quo.
http://www.conservative.ca/document...DECLARATION.pdf
In contrast, John Kerry (and people like Mario Cuomo) is personally PRO-LIFE in a pro-choice party. Where were people like you in 2004 to call him a knuckle-dragger?
The fact is, there is a middle ground on abortion. Yes to choice, but ban partial birth abortion, and regulate it to protect the health and safety of the woman (like in every other civilized country). Also, what's wrong with counseling? The Lieberals and NDP once again are extremists on the issue. |
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| karim |
| quote: | Originally posted by ShadoWolf
First of all, CPC party policy is decided at the grassroots level with some input by the leader alone. Second, the CPC policy is EXACTLY what the Canadian people want: yes to gay rights, AND yes to traditional marriage.
http://www.compas.ca/data/050202-SameSex-EPC.pdf
Third, the Lieberal/NDP position on this issue is very extreme, because it ignores the majority.
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Read the policy report you posted, specifically points
63.iii: The Conservative party believes that Parliament through a free vote, and not the courts should determine the definition of marriage....
63.iv: A Conservative Government will suppport Legislation defining marriage as the union of one man and one woman.
Point 63.iii. goes against the constitution. If such a policy were "fair" one could argue that it'd have been fair for the majority whites that were pro slavery back in the old time USA to deem it proper because "most" people wanted slavery to remain intact. And there was a time where such a majority policy existed. Didn't make it the right and proper policy. The whole basis of majority rule and minority rights is to not allow the majority to have the power to dictate what rights the minority has.
63.iv simply states the obvious that the conservative party does NOT support gay marriage.
Where are you getting this "They do support gay marriage" babble from?
| quote: | Originally posted by ShadoWolf
Once again, you're ignoring the facts.
Harper is personally PRO-CHOICE; he's not a social conservative, he's a free-market libertarian. He's actually pissed off a lot of so-cons, esp. on partial birth abortion. The CPC itself is neutral on the issue; it would not introduce new abortion laws. IN that sense, it's arguably pro-choice, because that is the status quo.
http://www.conservative.ca/document...DECLARATION.pdf
In contrast, John Kerry (and people like Mario Cuomo) is personally PRO-LIFE in a pro-choice party. Where were people like you in 2004 to call him a knuckle-dragger?
The fact is, there is a middle ground on abortion. Yes to choice, but ban partial birth abortion, and regulate it to protect the health and safety of the woman (like in every other civilized country). Also, what's wrong with counseling? The Lieberals and NDP once again are extremists on the issue. |
The policy declaration states the standard response of non regulating any issues to do with abortion because as a party, their decisions are still greatly unresolved. However, alot of their decision makers oppinions are fueled by religious views/pro life stance on abortion, which make me very sketchy on their future policies for when they decide to have a firm stance on the issue. From my understanding (and your link doesn't support otherwise) they are leaning to a more pro-life stance although they like to sit pretty for now leaving things the way things are until pressured to decide.
:)
Karim |
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| che |
| Pretty lame if you ask me but a decent and entertaining read none the less....:p |
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| magikb |
| quote: | Originally posted by che
Pretty lame if you ask me but a decent and entertaining read none the less....:p |
LOL.. well keeping some entertained..
I think RJ is keeping himself entertained as well as others with photos now though... :haha: :p ;) |
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| loca |
| quote: | Originally posted by karim
Jay's HOLIER THAN THOU attitude with NO MERIT pisses me off. I'm not the only one that thinks it. I've just got balls to finally say it to him.
:whip:
Karim |
You may not be the only one that thinks it, but there are a lot of people (myself included) who enjoy reading Jay's posts and think he's a great guy, and not because i support the PCs (i'm more NDP enclined).
I find his posts and opinions interesting and well formulated. |
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| ShadoWolf |
| quote: | Originally posted by karim
Read the policy report you posted, specifically points
63.iii: The Conservative party believes that Parliament through a free vote, and not the courts should determine the definition of marriage.... |
A free vote in Parliament is a democratic way to settle the issue.
Remember, the most socially conservative MP's are in the LIBERAL party.. people like Tom Wappel ("homosexuality is evil") etc.
| quote: | | Point 63.iii. goes against the constitution. |
uh huh :roll: and what part of the constitution would that be? do you have a cite?
A single unelected Lieberal-appointed judge cannot unilaterally amend the constitution. Also, aren't you aware of JudgeScam?
http://www.tranceaddict.com/forums/...threadid=259972
| quote: | | If such a policy were "fair" one could argue that it'd have been fair for the majority whites that were pro slavery back in the old time USA to deem it proper because "most" people wanted slavery to remain intact. |
No, because homosexual couples are fundamentally different from heterosexual couples... most notably because they can't produce children, so the union is by it's nature unequal.
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Didn't make it the right and proper policy. The whole basis of majority rule and minority rights is to not allow the majority to have the power to dictate what rights the minority has. |
THe policy you and the Lieberal support would dictate what rights the majority has.
The CPC policy balances the majority and the minority.
| quote: | 63.iv simply states the obvious that the conservative party does NOT support gay marriage.
Where are you getting this "They do support gay marriage" babble from? |
I never said "marriage." It's not a "marriage" on its face.
The CPC does however support gay UNIONS - with full legal rights and responsibilities.
| quote: | | . However, alot of their decision makers oppinions are fueled by religious views/pro life stance on abortion, which make me very sketchy on their future policies for when they decide to have a firm stance on the issue. |
Again, the most socially conservative MP's are in the LIBERAL party.
| quote: | From my understanding (and your link doesn't support otherwise) they are leaning to a more pro-life stance although they like to sit pretty for now leaving things the way things are until pressured to decide.
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Pure fiction; not based on any facts at all. |
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