Originally posted by Clovis
I used to like trance before I knew there was other music to be discovered, music that didn't consistently rely on the same formula, the same tired lyrics, and tricks to keep me interested. My tastes evolved, simple as that. I got bored of hearing the same sounds being used day in and day out, the same side-chained bass lines, the same synths and notes just arranged in a slightly different manner. I grew out of it. Big deal. I fully admit to loving trance back in the day and raving my ass off to it. I don't look down on people who like trance as "inferior", I just hope they explore what else EDM and music in general has to offer, and follow the rabbit hole as deep as it goes (and you must know as well as I do that it does go deep).
Also, while trance took me places, it never did in the same way such influential albums (to me) like Fabric 20, Sasha & Digweed sets from the early days, Moby - Play etc...did. The fact is I can still listen to those today and enjoy them just as much as I did the first time (I've actually recently been bumping Fabric 20 on my ipod). Trance, not so much. I can enjoy it for nostalgia purposes, but it is just not good, interesting music to me, and I'm sorry if that offends. I loved it at first because it was so different to what I was used to, (growing up in the US) and I happen to really like rhythmic, repetitive, simple music in all forms (from Philip Glass to minimal techno). Trance was the first thing I found that was close to what I like, but I kept going and didn't stop there thinking it was the be-all end-all of electronically produced music. I did jump on the electro bandwagon afterwards, because, again, it was new to me. But for the past 2 years I've been DJing and playing my own music, not having it spoon fed to me by the DJ du jour, and I really take offense to you accusing me of being a bandwagon jumping trend whore, when this is really not the case. You ask anyone who actually knows who the I am and listens to the music I like and play, and they can tell you the same. I spend hours going through back catalogues, looking for old tracks and trying to get a grasp on all the great electronic music I missed out on while I was listening to hip-hop like a good little American in highschool. Discovering new music is probably what I enjoy MOST about EDM, because there is constantly something new around the corner or under old rocks that have not been over-turned in years.
As for the last statement:
I disagree. Maturity is constantly challenging your own taste, your own perceptions about music and never sitting on one thing and thinking "thats it, thats the best". Thats akin to saying people should just accept soulja boy and britney spears as "another genre" even when they put minimal effort and creativity into what they do. I would much rather be a snob looking for people who actually are putting thought into their music than some "I love everything" goody two shoes just so I don't offend anyone on a message board, who pretends to like everything.
But "Accepting something for what it really is" doesn't mean that you have to love it or say that it is "The Best" and end of story. This is indeed not implied! By accepting that Britney Spears makes mainstream simple music for the masses (that have fun to it) doesn't mean that you have to love it. You have to accept it as just "another musical genre" which makes people (of a certain age and maybe gender i would say) have fun though because thats what it is. You also don't have to pretend liking it either. You just accept it (for what it is). There is a category-tag in accepting something for what it really is and thats all there is to it. This is also not related to any further musical explorations.
And yeah M83 are awesome, both "Dead Cities, Red Seas and Lost Ghosts" and "Before The Dawn Heals Us" are magical. I also liked the ambient album, "Digital Shades vol. 1", especially the track "the highest journey". It builds and builds with all these ambient pads, quitars and angelic choruses added in the process its simply beautifull. Looking forward to the new album! If you like M83 then try some other ambient-post-rock-neo-shoegaze bands such as "Port-Royal", "Lights out Asia", "Saxon Shore" and "Bethany Curve". They all have myspace pages.
Spirit5
From the way I see it, trance music is JOURNEY music, so those who complain about those saying "letting the music take you on a journey" are obviously not listening to trance or just listening to Top 40 style stuff and not seeing that trance music is called trance music BECAUSE YOU GET LOST IN IT! it's music that was and is a journey and many tracks are a journey in themselves..why they are often described as "epic" and are long and why set building is so important, not just playing anthem after anthem. Now when someone complains about someone obsessing over it, being all they listen to and saying it's "their life" now that is something that could be complained about. But music is a central part of people's lives, I just don't think a particular type of music should (but I will admit that I used to be like this, esp around 2003 and 2004 when I was big into trance).
Clovis
quote:
Originally posted by PETRAN
But "Accepting something for what it really is" doesn't mean that you have to love it or say that it is "The Best" and end of story. This is indeed not implied! By accepting that Britney Spears makes mainstream simple music for the masses (that have fun to it) doesn't mean that you have to love it. You have to accept it as just "another musical genre" which makes people (of a certain age and maybe gender i would say) have fun though because thats what it is. You also don't have to pretend liking it either. You just accept it (for what it is). There is a category-tag in accepting something for what it really is and thats all there is to it. This is also not related to any further musical explorations.
Did you really just start this whole argument because you think I don't "accept trance for what it is"?
:wtf: I know perfectly well trance works for a lot of people. (what website is this again?) I can see the appeal it has to certain folks even today, and there are people who loved it back then who are still into it (although they do notice the decline in quality accross the board). I'm seriously baffled. I know what most trance/pop/mainstream rap is, it's overly commercialized music which appeals to the masses. Thats not generally what I like. My opinion. End of story. I'm seriously at a loss to try and explain why you decided to initiate this huge argument only to arrive at these conclusions.
noikeee
Any "xxxxxxx isn't just yyyyyyy to me, it's my life" attitude is bad for you and limits your experience of life.
Spirit5
quote:
Originally posted by Clovis
Did you really just start this whole argument because you think I don't "accept trance for what it is"?
:wtf: I know perfectly well trance works for a lot of people. (what website is this again?) I can see the appeal it has to certain folks even today, and there are people who loved it back then who are still into it (although they do notice the decline in quality accross the board). I'm seriously baffled. I know what trance/pop/mainstream rap is, it's overly commercialized music which appeals to the masses. Thats not generally what I like. My opinion. End of story. I'm seriously at a loss to try and explain why you decided to initiate this huge argument only to arrive at these conclusions.
Not to get into a big argument but you say you've moved on, you stop liking trance, you like Sasha, and Digweed, and Fabric series and such, but what about delving into at least some newer trance and STILL liking these other guys? I have been in since I got into EDM, both the dark progressive and even somewhat the minimal or more experimental sides, and the melodic, epic and uplifting trance stuff. I really think it's possible to like both and not just think of it as nostalgia (yeah I liked it back in the day but not anymore). Not saying you have to like trance, but at least try some newer stuff and see if you might like it. I got sick of trance for the past two years, but I decided a month or so ago to try out some newer stuff that I missed, and it's not all the same to me. Some deeper stuff, some harder stuff, some with different structures, different style melodies (some more complex than they used to be), breakdowns etc. I think once you give yourself a break from it, and revisit it later, you'll appreciate it just as much.
PETRAN
quote:
Originally posted by Clovis
Did you really just start this whole argument because you think I don't "accept trance for what it is"?
:wtf: I know perfectly well trance works for a lot of people. (what website is this again?) I can see the appeal it has to certain folks even today, and there are people who loved it back then who are still into it (although they do notice the decline in quality accross the board). I'm seriously baffled. I know what trance/pop/mainstream rap is, it's overly commercialized music which appeals to the masses. Thats not generally what I like. My opinion. End of story. I'm seriously at a loss to try and explain why you decided to initiate this huge argument only to arrive at these conclusions.
I didn't say that Trance is mainstream music like Britney Spears. I said Britney Spears is. I guess that "looking at something for what it really is" has a subjective component to it. Because IMO, trance (epic/melodic trance i guess), structurally speaking, is no different then the most underground type of techno or obscure minimal or whatever. It is another EDM genre which is made by similar tools, in similar ways, has a similar 4/4 structure and has the potential to make people dance and trip such as any other EDM genre. As a result i don't see it as "Superior/inferior" to any other EDM genre. This is what looking at "Trance for what really is" means to me.
Cobalt
It saddens me that today's fashionable attitudes reject or deny emotional content. Feeling seems almost entirely absent from the present dance music vocabulary. It's all about what's trendy, or different, or interesting, or whatever. Whether something establishes an emotional connection with the listener is of very little concern to the current scene. Feeling forms the backbone of art, particularly music. What's currently popular seems abstract, disconnected from immediate sensation, and wrapped up in sophistication. Emotion is so uncool.
Trance and progressive were precisely about taking the listener on a journey. One can trot out the same tired excesses that finally killed the scene, but that isn't a criticism of the genres themselves. Those that ridicule trance and progressive for emotion seem to do so more as a symbolic break from old values than as real criticism of those genres. Emotion in art! What vulgar nonsense! Such are the values of today.
r5a
Over-analyzing things much?
People who usually say that phrase just mean they love it and like listening to it a lot.
The whole journey through music thing happens. Some people get lost in the music and others don't, simple as that really. I know with me if I listen to really 'emotional/melodic' music I start to imagine and just feel a little uplifted. Dark sounding stuff I sometimes get down or just feel on my own/alone, ect. , some people even have synesthesia (sp?)
And can we please ing stop bopping on Clovis's dick, that argument is so gay. Just stop. .
Clovis
quote:
Originally posted by Spirit5
Not to get into a big argument but you say you've moved on, you stop liking trance, you like Sasha, and Digweed, and Fabric series and such, but what about delving into at least some newer trance and STILL liking these other guys? I have been in since I got into EDM, both the dark progressive and even somewhat the minimal or more experimental sides, and the melodic, epic and uplifting trance stuff. I really think it's possible to like both and not just think of it as nostalgia (yeah I liked it back in the day but not anymore). Not saying you have to like trance, but at least try some newer stuff and see if you might like it. I got sick of trance for the past two years, but I decided a month or so ago to try out some newer stuff that I missed, and it's not all the same to me. Some deeper stuff, some harder stuff, some with different structures, different style melodies (some more complex than they used to be), breakdowns etc. I think once you give yourself a break from it, and revisit it later, you'll appreciate it just as much.
I still do like some of it, whats to say I don't listen to ANY of it anymore? I have friends who are good trance DJs and I sometimes dip into the new releases on digital download sites to see whats up. Over-all though, I don't find anything memorable, that makes me want to burn it to CD right away and hit the decks. And I wish I had time to browse every genre but I don't, so I usually stick to areas where the majority of interesting music is coming out for me, and work those angles. I'm always open to suggestions and I listen to stuff people send me even if I have a pretty good idea that I won't like it. This is why I wrote "generally" in bold up top, to emphasize that, like most things in life (and this is a philosophy I try to subscribe to heavily) there are always exceptions to every rule. I still like the odd classic trance tune as well. I think overall, interesting music is timeless...and in most cases it ages well.
jupiterone
this thread needs more
Spirit5
quote:
Originally posted by PETRAN
I didn't say that Trance is mainstream music like Britney Spears. I said Britney Spears is. I guess that "looking at something for what it really is" has a subjective component to it. Because IMO, trance (epic/melodic trance i guess), structurally speaking, is no different then the most underground type of techno or obscure minimal or whatever. It is another EDM genre which is made by similar tools, in similar ways, has a similar 4/4 structure and has the potential to make people dance and trip such as any other EDM genre. As a result i don't see it as "Superior/inferior" to any other EDM genre. This is what looking at "Trance for what really is" means to me.
It's got a similar structure, but the feel is different. Trance has typically made more use of melody, whether it was a complex melody or a simplistic melody. I'm not specifically talking about goa/psy (although they can be), but the traditional trance that came out of Germany, The Netherlands, Finland, England etc. Techno does have some melodies, but more miminal. Techno and house to me are more "pure" dance music, being made specifically for dance floor execution (and there are exceptions to the rule...ambient techno/house) while trance has been made with large festivals and trance nights in mind. Yeah sure played in clubs as well, but it's typically had the large events like Trance Energy, Sensation, Gatecrasher, Dance Valley etc. Kind of music that doesn't need to be, but gets the maximum effect and why it got anthemic or epic to reflect the large expanses. Even in the early days, you still hear about large outdoor raves where it was played at.
To me, a part of trance is the euphoric and emotional edge that it has. At one moment, it will make you feel energized with a pulsating, bass filled, heavy hitting tech track, and the next it will be really melodic, emotional, almost makes you want to cry (haha) and then it will send you on a trip through outerspace or through some desolate void, or through a portal filled with colors. It does things to you that I feel not many other forms of EDM do (or as well). Except progressive house, but that's so close to trance...
IMO..house is more about soul, it's uplifting, but it's not quite as visceral, it's more about having a good time. Techno is a little less fun, but more about a maximum dance effect on the dance floor, kind of picture sweaty dance clubs and ravers and lights all over. Breaks...hard to describe. But trance, it's got this visceral aspect, it really puts images in your head and sends your mind on a head trip with so many different feelings...
jpisani
quote:
Originally posted by noikeee
Any "xxxxxxx isn't just yyyyyyy to me, it's my life" attitude is bad for you and limits your experience of life.
wouldn't "yyyyyyyy" just be "xxxxxxxxx"? i thought they were supposed to be the same thing? like "xxxxxxxx isnt just xxxxxxx", instead of two different variables? :p
