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The Official 2008-2009 NBA/Toronto Raptors Discussion Thread (pg. 17)
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| MarkT |
pretend you're the GM.
Do you move Kapono, Humphries and Jermaine to net Marion and Camby?
tough to pass that up. Replace Kapono with Parker and I'd do it.
I think Van Gundy is biased. Most GM's want their own guy in there, so I think Colangleo didn't want Mitchell from the start...but when you go out and win even a weak division and get named coach of the year, it's tough to turf him :D The poor start this year, Bosh's impending decision-time, and the god-awful 39 point loss made it easy to justify getting rid of him now (easier than during the off season, anyway). |
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| Sly_Guy |
| quote: | Originally posted by MarkT
pretend you're the GM.
Do you move Kapono, Humphries and Jermaine to net Marion and Camby?
tough to pass that up. Replace Kapono with Parker and I'd do it.
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I would too, I just don't see anyone crazy enough to agree with it. |
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| infinity HiGH |
| That sounds like a complicated trade. Colangelo should go for someone like John Salmons. |
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| Porky |
| quote: | Originally posted by MarkT
Do you move Kapono, Humphries and Jermaine to net Marion and Camby? |
hell yes |
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| Sly_Guy |
Goddamn, exam time has left me with nothing to do but surf the internet:
Source via Italian news La Stampa: [sorry no link, but it's in Italian anyway, so I've given you a google translation:
| quote: |
It can not be formalized, but the turn has already been decided, on the advice dell'italianissimo Maurizio Gherardini, executive vice president of the Canadian club
Sam Mitchell has never been seen by very technical Gherardini, if that is found in the house and some 'has endured. Idem dicasi per il presidente Bryan Colangelo, che cognome a parte, tanto per inciso, ha sposato l’italiana Barbara Bottini. The same goes for the president Bryan Colangelo, that last part, so incidentally, has married the Italian Barbara Bottini. Colangelo poco tempo fa dichiarò: «Il problema non è sapere se Messina allenerà nella Nba, ma quando». Colangelo short time ago said: "The problem is not whether allenerà Messina in the NBA, but when." Dalla prossima primavera, è la risposta già scritta, ma non ancora ufficializzabile eppure data da tutti per scontata. From next spring, the answer is already written, but not yet formalized yet given by all for granted.
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| MarkT |
Messina would be quite the interesting choice.
I wonder if he'd hand over the head coaching position right away though. Even with an experienced staff behind him, shouldn't this guy be an assistant or something...at least for a year? What does it say to Bosh when you bring in a coach with ZERO NBA experience who's likely going to implement a rather different style of play? Does Bosh stick around to see if it pans out in a year or two or does he bail?
(I'm not necessarily against it, given Messina's success in Europe...just throwing that out there). |
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| Sly_Guy |
| quote: | Originally posted by MarkT
Messina would be quite the interesting choice.
I wonder if he'd hand over the head coaching position right away though. Even with an experienced staff behind him, shouldn't this guy be an assistant or something...at least for a year? What does it say to Bosh when you bring in a coach with ZERO NBA experience who's likely going to implement a rather different style of play? Does Bosh stick around to see if it pans out in a year or two or does he bail?
(I'm not necessarily against it, given Messina's success in Europe...just throwing that out there). |
That's what a lot of people are saying. But if you look by reputation, would he accept a assistant's job? I'm not sure someone as decorated as him would. Doug Smith was saying that he'd need a couple of season's at assistant before going out and getting at the helm of a team of his own, but on that point, if you look at the cavs right now, him and coach brown have been doing an 'exchange' program in the off-seasons, where they've been coaching and learning from each other and the NBA-Euro styles of play respectively. I don't know if he's as-far off as one might think, but still, that doesn't make up for lack of NBA experience.
As for Bosh, yeah, it does send a rather mixed signal to him should it happen. But I guess it comes down to how secure BC feels in his own job, how much further down the line he's willing to gamble on this coach and consequently, the franchise's future? Is bringing in your own coach and style worth the trading of the franchise player, or another 2 years of retooling? |
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| infinity HiGH |
| quote: | Originally posted by Sly_Guy
Goddamn, exam time has left me with nothing to do but surf the internet:
Source via Italian news La Stampa: [sorry no link, but it's in Italian anyway, so I've given you a google translation: |
From ESPN Weekend Dime:
| quote: | The current economic crisis is a global one, as the Russians could tell you. Perennial powerhouse CSKA Moscow recently shut down its women's team, which some European hoops experts we know well see as a clear sign that legendary men's coach Ettore Messina (at right) will be leaving CSKA at season's end as part of the club's financial cutbacks.
If Messina indeed becomes a coaching free agent this summer, that'll only make it tougher for Raptors president and GM Bryan Colangelo to resist hiring the Italian as the first European-born head coach in the NBA. Messina is super close with Raptors assistant general manager Maurizio Gherardini and counts Colangelo as one of his biggest fans.
Back in October, when CSKA was in Toronto to face the Raptors for an exhibition game, Colangelo was asked whether a foreign-born coach who speaks English as his second language could really land one of the NBA's 30 head-coaching jobs. Colangelo told our man Dave Feschuk of the Toronto Star, "It's not a matter of if it's going to happen, it's when it's going to happen."
Colangelo, remember, didn't have a job opening when Mike D'Antoni and the Suns parted suddenly in May because of the four-year contract Colangelo felt he had to give Sam Mitchell after Mitchell won Coach of the Year honors in 2006-07. It'll be fascinating to see what happens now with Messina given that he's believed to be Colangelo's other favorite coach.
The obstacles to such a hire, though, are obvious and numerous. Messina is enormously respected in the coaching biz worldwide for his X's-and-O's acumen, but there are undoubtedly hundreds of NBA players who've never heard of him. There would inevitably be loud questions about how NBA players would respond to Messina's firm hand -- far firmer than you generally see over here -- even with Toronto ranking as the NBA's most Europe-like setting, both in terms of the city and the roster.
So it would be sensationally bold from Colangelo, even for a GM as aggressive as he is, to take that gamble, when at the same time he has made no secret of the fact that the organization's No. 1 goal over the next 18 months is keeping hold of 2010 free-agent supreme Chris Bosh.
Obstacle No. 2: As Colangelo also conceded in October, any NBA coach has to "understand the sensibilities of the North American athlete," and that's something Messina could do only if he came to the NBA as an assistant first. Yet for the likes of overseas coaching legends such as Messina and Dynamo Moscow's David Blatt -- the American/Israeli from Princeton who ranks with Messina as Europe's best -- taking an assistant's job over here can't be especially appealing, from a financial or prestige standpoint.
Another wrinkle here is that you shouldn't underestimate Jay Triano's ability to keep this job full-time, especially if Colangelo ultimately decides in the summer that it's too soon to make history with Messina. Triano is a certifiable Canadian legend -- as a player and a coach -- who has spent six-plus seasons as a Raptors assistant after memorably guiding the red and white to within one victory of the medal round in the 2000 Summer Games in Australia. The only recognizable names on that overachieving team were former Nets and 76ers center Todd McCulloch and a struggling young point guard out of Dallas named Steve Nash.
"Players love Jay," Nash said this week, welcoming the opportunity to talk about something other than the Suns' gloomy start and clearly moved by Triano's promotion. "He's a fantastic coach. They're going to find out that he has a great feel and understanding of the game and is a lot of fun to play for." |
In my personal opinion; either this guy comes in as an assistant for 1 or 2 years or not at all. I know he's a legendary coach over in Europe but that doesn't mean a damn thing in the NBA. There's too much to lose if he would be just dropped in like that.
From Messina's point of view it shouldn't matter whether he's too "decorated" for assistant coach for his first year in the NBA. He can't just come in without any real experience. No matter who he is.
edit What's so special about this guy anyways? I'll be honest with you that I've never heard of him before. |
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| Fuertez |
| so just because you have never heard of him before he's no good? |
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| infinity HiGH |
| quote: | Originally posted by Fuertez
so just because you have never heard of him before he's no good? |
Uh....Yea :rolleyes: |
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| Sly_Guy |
| quote: | Originally posted by infinity HiGH
edit What's so special about this guy anyways? I'll be honest with you that I've never heard of him before. |
read that link to issue of the magazine I added above. See how his team, with less talent managed to beat powerhouse Tel Aviv simply with x's and o's. This is why so many people are impressed with him. He's detail oriented, understands the game on the level of a popovic [I refuse to put the 'h' on his name, he's a slav, goddammit!!], sloan, riley, of jackson.
Read about his achievements, it'll take you like 5 mins just to get through them. For someone never to have coached in the NBA, he's pretty much done everything else.
Guys like this will never be assistant coaches simply because they can't 'coddle' their players like the NBA too often does. Sam himself had to learn that on-the-job, and the coaches I mentioned above often times don't. |
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| infinity HiGH |
| quote: | Originally posted by Sly_Guy
read that link to issue of the magazine I added above. See how his team, with less talent managed to beat powerhouse Tel Aviv simply with x's and o's. This is why so many people are impressed with him. He's detail oriented, understands the game on the level of a popovic [I refuse to put the 'h' on his name, he's a slav, goddammit!!], sloan, riley, of jackson.
Read about his achievements, it'll take you like 5 mins just to get through them. For someone never to have coached in the NBA, he's pretty much done everything else.
Guys like this will never be assistant coaches simply because they can't 'coddle' their players like the NBA too often does. Sam himself had to learn that on-the-job, and the coaches I mentioned above often times don't. |
Sick. Needed some reading material for the subway :D |
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