Originally posted by SYSTEM-J
Just because we're both speculating doesn't mean we're both equally likely to be correct. If I speculated that Sasha summoned Satan as a co-producer it doesn't make it as likely as any other theory. I've read interviews with Sasha, Dekkard, BT and Charlie May, interviews that go right back to the mid-90s. I've heard most of Sasha's productions since his career started and I've heard a lot of productions by all his co-producers. I've offered up realistic, plausible counters to your pie-in-the-sky suggestions about what Sasha has probably learned.
but what we're both speculating is equally likely...afterall its his name attached to the project and no matter how much outside input there is, its common sense that he be an integral part of the process. Mongoose being an exception, and one that was specifically announced as having nothing to do with him. innocent until proven guilty surely?
and Id like to see an interview where its said that he isn't involved in the production at all.
quote:
Originally posted by SYSTEM-J
I completely disagree. There are Spooky records that have been way better than anything Sasha has made. Likewise with BT, Richard Dekkard, Phil Dane and even The Light.
well thats all subjective. Spooky have a couple of nice tracks but I don't find them all that special, BT sure, but again thats relative. the point I was trying to make is that when these artists collaborate with Sasha there's a certain sound thats gotta come from somewhere, and since he's been calling on various producers over the years its only logical that it comes from him.
quote:
Originally posted by SYSTEM-J
I don't think it's valid to call Tiesto your favourite producer either. You can't admit you don't know what Sasha does in the studio and then call him your favourite ever producer anyway. Especially when he's used a phalanx of co-producers right through his career. You can't claim the others are just "polishing" his core work.
I can't claim that no more than you can claim that he doesn't assist in producing his own music. if I see "*written by A.Coe* or *produced by A.Coe*, I'm gonna go ahead and assume that it carries some weight.
quote:
Originally posted by SYSTEM-J
I've sat with a good producer and told him how I wanted things to sound. The results were very different to what his own work sounds like and the results did have my influence all over them. But I have no musical talent and no production expertise. This bull about how Sasha has a distinct sound (which I disagree with anyway, the switches between producers were massively obvious and clearly evidence of more than just a change in "polishing) doesn't wash with me, because I've been in exactly that situation and I know you can have a distinct sound with no knowledge and no talent.
how do we know how much of the producing is done by him? there's absolutely no way to tell. I'm sure he does a lot of overseeing and direction but as I've said before, being in the music business that long, and working with all of these big name producers, you're bound to have picked up enough technical tricks to know how to craft a solid tune.
in the end we're both throwing assumptions around.. I like sasha's work and i'm not going to say that Charlie May is my favourite producer because he's not the only one who creates the music.
geroin
quote:
Originally posted by RapidFire
how do we know how much of the producing is done by him? there's absolutely no way to tell. I'm sure he does a lot of overseeing and direction but as I've said before, being in the music business that long, and working with all of these big name producers, you're bound to have picked up enough technical tricks to know how to craft a solid tune.
in the end we're both throwing assumptions around.. I like sasha's work and i'm not going to say that Charlie May is my favourite producer because he's not the only one who creates the music.
you say that because you don't know how much skill and work is required to even make something simple sounding good..
you can sit in the studio with a producer and boss him around and tell him what to do, yes that may eventually sound ok but the minute the producer leaves the chair and you are on your own and you will never be able to create anything good, technical skill is not picked up by watching, that's why it's technical because you have to sit down and spend YEARS learning the skill.
ps. being able to create melodies is good but that ain't when it comes to producing as there are millions of other factors involved in play.
RapidFire
quote:
Originally posted by geroin
you say that because you don't know how much skill and work is required to even make something simple sounding good..
you can sit in the studio with a producer and boss him around and tell him what to do, yes that may eventually sound ok but the minute the producer leaves the chair and you are on your own and you will never be able to create anything good, technical skill is not picked up by watching, that's why it's technical because you have to sit down and spend YEARS learning the skill.
ps. being able to create melodies is good but that ain't when it comes to producing as there are millions of other factors involved in play.
i dont doubt that but hes a ing artist and a dj... give him some credit. i've been around producers and I do know how much it takes. its not easy but its not rocket science either.
creativity is a much bigger asset than technical proficiency anyways.
geroin
quote:
Originally posted by RapidFire
i dont doubt that but hes a ing artist and a dj... give him some credit. i've been around producers and I do know how much it takes. its not easy but its not rocket science either.
creativity is a much bigger asset than technical proficiency anyways.
being an artist and a dj does not magically give him the ability to create music. his dj credit is there, i think hes an amazing dj but giving him credit for some of his music is not legitimate, as much as i want to.
it is not rocket science i agree but it does take a very long time and patience to become good at.
both creativity and technicality are important as i've seen many producers are either good in one or the other but it is when that formula has both, that's when we start to hear amazing tracks.
yourma2000
I'm split between Chicane, BT and Oliver Lieb
Arnold
Sunny Lax & Nitrous Oxide
and lately Bart Cleassen. He really is on a role with some nice tunes...
mathew1204
For me it's Quincy Jones no one comes close and in clasical music Yanni.
Prydz
Telefon Tel Aviv
Ulrich Schnauss
M83
Arno Cost
geroin
quote:
Originally posted by mathew1204
Quincy Jones
agreed, he's ing ridiculously talented..
SYSTEM-J
quote:
Originally posted by RapidFire
but what we're both speculating is equally likely...afterall its his name attached to the project and no matter how much outside input there is, its common sense that he be an integral part of the process.
That's begging the question. I think it's considerably more likely that a professional full-time DJ who regularly tours worldwide would not have enough time to learn up-to-date production than your optimistic claim that he's "bound to have" picked it up simply because he's been working with producers for 20 years.
I'm especially cynical because in interviews Richard Dekkard said that Sasha knew nothing when he joined up with him, and when Dekkard left after 1995 Sasha knew enough to make his album. Sasha also claimed around 1997 that he now knew his way around the studio. So he makes one single (Arkham Asylum/Ohmna) that has a new sound and which is the one Sasha record I'm willing to admit is his own production (also one of very, very few Sasha tracks where production is actually credited to "A. Coe" and not the ambiguous "Sasha"). But there was no album for another five years and then Sasha starts working with progressively more and more co-producers when it does come out. I also read an interview around the time of Involver where Sasha was saying the same things as in 1997 - previously he hadn't known how to do anything and now he did because May had taught him. For me it's pretty clear that he just doesn't have enough time to stay on top of the production game.
I can't be bothered to argue this point around because what's apparent is you're going to keep assuming the best about Sasha no matter what, which is why I'm saying you're being fanboyish. With no idea how much Sasha does you instantly assume he does the "core work" and he must have lots of studio knowledge. I think it's much more likely that a full-time DJ who has always relied on co-producers would not be able to function without them, and as such I wouldn't say it's valid to nominate Sasha in this thread.
