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Ontarians want booze at corner store: Poll (pg. 3)
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| FunkyCrew |
| quote: | Originally posted by Yohan
yeah I don't think we need to worry about crap alcohol being sold in stores in Ontario/Canada. this isn't the rodina ;) |
I guess! :) lol even food is wonky there sometimes :( |
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| Orko |
If I can buy bacon at the grocery store, why not some beer to go with it? There are many many things at the grocery store that will slowly kill you just the same as alcohol will. Grocery stores used to (some still do) sell cigarettes, and are licenses to check for ID, so this wouldn't exactly be a far stretch to train staff.
Russia's problems with alcohol are not just down to the availability, let's make that point clear. The place isn't exactly a shining beacon of happiness.
I was just in Germany, and you can drink and buy beer everywhere. Sure they do have a very high rate of usage, but they also have the best economy year after year. They are very productive people, who have struck some kind of balance.
Funky, you have a very good point of concern: bootleged booze. We can already see that with cigarettes in small convenience stores, operators will buy from anybody to get the lowest price.
We already have independent retailers for wine, like Wineyards and so I think we can have more. Maybe giving licenses to the larger stores, with good supply chain management, and a proven track record of passing health/safety standards would be the right route. Start selling beer and wine at Sobeys, Metro, Loblaws? |
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| malek |
| quote: | Originally posted by devnull
and Quebec is having so much problems by selling alcohol in corner stores and selling it much cheaper than here!
Ontario 24 Case of Bud: $40+
Quebec 24 case of Bud: $26-28 |
and our criminal rate is lower than in Ontario... might be unrelated, but it defeats magneto's point. |
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| Orko |
Sometimes you also have to think about the people that cannot get to a LCBO or Beer store. Vdub is great that you have a car, and are able bodied, but that is not the case with everyone.
Allowing the elderly to pick something up with their groceries makes so much sense. Why should a grandma have to go to two different stores, sometimes kilometers apart, just to complete her shopping? They put drug stores in grocery stores, why not a small beer/wine store? |
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| CMR |
| quote: | Originally posted by Magnetonium
in places like Russia they kill each other with vodka. I lived there, I can tell you that first-hand. |
Thats because Russia is a hole - its a little disingenuous to compare it to Ontario. They also have the world's highest heroin usage...and thats not because they can buy it in corner stores (its actually even less accessible there than in western countries, apparently), its because its a country dealing with high unemployment, corruption, high crime, discrimination, etc.
Instead, looking at countries/provinces that are a little more comparable to Ontario in a cultural & economic sense (the aforementioned Quebec, Alberta, USA, and western Europe), find me some data that shows that they have a greater rate of alcoholism or drunk driving accidents or any other alcohol-related ill. I guarantee you won't. |
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| NuERA |
| most definitely want |
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| Adamo |
| also marijuana cigarettes please, thanks |
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| Magnetonium |
There are some good points made, and as for others:
Didn't want to turn this into Russia vs. Canada discussion, and silly assumptions (or conclusions?) that alcohol consumption rate somehow correlates to crime rates too. Among other things.
I see everyone here is all of the same opinion so there's just no point of waging the discussion, is there?
I occasionally witness regrettable outcomes following improper or heavy use of alcohol, and I feel that making alcoholic beverages easier to obtain will only increase the rate of drinking. Had a buddy at work today excited about this (he doesn't have a car, so instead of drinking once a week he'd grab beer from the local store more often now). Surely some people will be responsible, but others will not be. Then sooner or later we will get into a controversy where a young lad will buy booze from a grocery store, get into a car, have few sips, and kill someone.
I am from decaying Hamilton, there are already plenty of drunks and druggies in downtown as it is - if you haven't been here, just please don't give them easier access to booze.
While you're at it - also make marijuana legal at every corner store as well, right?
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| chinamon |
| quote: | Originally posted by Magnetonium
:wtf:
You think you're a funny guy, eh? I lost friends and a relative to alcohol, so at least for me this issue is not a joke.
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I know someone that died from drowning so maybe we should ban swimming pools and beaches? Or maybe we could ban water altogether?
I also know people that have been victims of car accidents so maybe we should ban cars too. |
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| Magnetonium |
| quote: | Originally posted by chinamon
I know someone that died from drowning so maybe we should ban swimming pools and beaches? Or maybe we could ban water altogether?
I also know people that have been victims of car accidents so maybe we should ban cars too. |
If you are drunk and go swimming, there's a good chance you can drown ... Alcohol related deaths and accidents are very preventable, for most part, and often alcohol harms not the person who consumes it, but others around him/her.
Or perhaps then we should take off ALL restrictions from alcohol, buy it anywhere, from anyone, whatever the concentration, homebrewed, bootlegged, whatever, and also so that people can drink and drive all they want! After all, people are very responsible, right!
A random first-result article I found which shows that the current system works better dealing with ill-effects of alcohol:
http://www.sciencedirect.com/scienc...140673609607443
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Summary
This paper reviews the evidence for the effectiveness and cost-effectiveness of policies and programmes to reduce the harm caused by alcohol, in the areas of education and information, the health sector, community action, driving while under the influence of alcohol (drink-driving), availability, marketing, pricing, harm reduction, and illegally and informally produced alcohol. Systematic reviews and meta-analyses show that policies regulating the environment in which alcohol is marketed (particularly its price and availability) are effective in reducing alcohol-related harm. Enforced legislative measures to reduce drink-driving and individually directed interventions to already at-risk drinkers are also effective. However, school-based education does not reduce alcohol-related harm, although public information and education-type programmes have a role in providing information and in increasing attention and acceptance of alcohol on political and public agendas. Making alcohol more expensive and less available, and banning alcohol advertising, are highly cost-effective strategies to reduce harm. In settings with high amounts of unrecorded production and consumption, increasing the proportion of alcohol that is taxed could be a more effective pricing policy than a simple increase in tax.
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| Adamo |
| just like putting graphic warnings, raising prices and making packs not visible in stores have reduced cigarette sales, right? :rolleyes: |
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| Nick Cenik |
| Right, because making alcohol more easily accessible is such an important issue demanding our attention at this time :rolleyes: |
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