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Cease Fire? (pg. 19)
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| DrummeRaver86 |
| quote: | Originally posted by Viber
palastinian how it feels to have cyrus in your ass?:haha: :haha: |
sorry to rain on your parade, but unless you mean cyrus's dick, you're wrong. |
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| Palestinian |
| quote: | Originally posted by occrider
Well I'm sure Israel wouldn't be an occupying force if Hamas and other terrorist groups didn't have these handy dandy clause in its covenant and charter:
Israel will exist and will continue to exist until Islam will obliterate it, just as it obliterated others before it."
"The Islamic Resistance Movement believes that the land of Palestine is an Islamic Waqf consecrated for future Moslem generations until Judgement Day. It, or any part of it, should not be squandered: it, or any part of it, should not be given up. "
"There is no solution for the Palestinian question except through Jihad. Initiatives, proposals and international conferences are all a waste of time and vain endeavors."
"After Palestine, the Zionists aspire to expand from the Nile to the Euphrates. When they will have digested the region they overtook, they will aspire to further expansion, and so on. Their plan is embodied in the "Protocols of the Elders of Zion", and their present conduct is the best proof of what we are saying."
Do you think Israel truly wanted these territories so badly that they were willing to accept the terrorist attacks? What made Israel so desparate in 67? How about the fact that they were surrounded on all borders with egyptian and syrian forces mobilizing at the borders? Keep in mind that Israel didn't even POSSESS the west bank or gaza at this point in time. They only captured it after the war and even TRIED to give the territories back in return for Arab recognition of Israel's right to exist. To say that the entire conflict can be avoided by a simple Israeli withdrawal from the occupied territories is is ridiculous ... why, because it's been tried before! The Palestinains need to control their extremists or their is no point in Israel making any concessions. Because regardless of how many concessions Israel makes, the extremists will never be content until Israel is completely destroyed. |
Israel was an occupying force long before Hamas was formed.
Let's not get into what's in Hamas' charter. The Knesset has a map of Eretz Israel from the Nile to the Euphrates. The occupation was only recognized by a Likud member, Sharon, two months ago, and the other members still won't recognize it. And notice that I'm comparing Hamas and the Israeli government here, not Hamas and any Israeli gangs such as the the Kahan extremists who shot Rabin and who will never recognize Palestine. It's in their charter too.
And yes I believe Israel do want these territories so badly that
they're willing to accept the terrorist attacks. The attacks give Israel the license and excuse to take more land, build more settlements, and destroy more lives without hesitation. Apart from the innocent civilians killed, this is the other reason why I don’t like Hamas.
Now I'm going to tell you something that will anger you about the war of 67. The media at this point in time doesn't tell you this because it would be dangerous to Israel's reputation. The war of 1967 was started by Israel and it wasn't a defensive or desperate act. Some of Nasser's forces were at the border ready to protect Syria and that was used as the excuse to start the war. An invalid excuse:
The former Commander of the Air Force, General Ezer Weitzman, regarded a hawk, stated that there was "no threat of destruction" but that the attck on Egypt, Jordan, and Syria was nevertheless justified so that Israel could "exist according to the scale, spirit, and quality she now embodies". Manachem Begin stated: "In June 1967, we again had a choice. The Egyptian Army concentrations in the Sinai approches do not prove that Nasser was really about to attack us. We must be honest with ourselves. We decided to attack him." Yitzhak Rabin said: "I do not think Nasser wanted war. The two divisions he sent to the Sinai would not have been sufficient to launch an offensive war. He knew it and we knew it." Moshe Dayan, the commander who gave the order to conquer the Golan said "many of the firefights with the Syrians were deliberately provoked by Israel, and the Kibbutz residents who pressed the Government to take the Golan Heights did so less for security than for the farmland." Also, "They didn't even try to hide their greed for the land..We would send a tractor to plow some area where it wasn't possible to do anything, in the demilitarized area, and knew in advance that the Syrians would start to shoot. If they didn't shoot, we would tell the tractor to advance further, until in the end the Syrians would get annoyed and shoot..And then we would use artillery and later the air force also, and that's how it was..The Syrians, on the fourth day of the war, were not a threat to us." "[Israel] may, no-it must-invent dangers, and to do this it must adopt the method of provocation and revenge..And above all-let us hope for a new war with the Arab countries, so that we may finally get rid of our troubles and acquire our space." Mordechai Bentoff, a cabinet member, eventually admitted that "all the story about the danger of extermination had been a complete invention and had been blown up a posteriori to justify the annexation of new Arab territories." I could tell you how much economic significance the occupied territories are to Israel, but that would need another essay. Provocation is Israel's best strategy such as the provocation of Hamas and Sharon's Al Aksa visit which I won't talk about here.
Senator Fulbright proposed in 1970 that America should guarantee Israel's security in a formal treaty, protecting her with armed forces if necessary. In return, Israel would retire to the borders of 1967. The UN would guarantee this arrangement, and thereby bring the Soviet Union (the supplier of weapons to the Arabs) into compliance. A peacekeeping force would be replaced by Israeli troops as they withdrew. The plan drew favorable editorial support in the US but was flatly rejected by Israel. "The whole affair disgusted Fulbright" his biographer wrote. "The Israelis were not even willing to act in their own self-interest." This was one of many such proposals. How can you say Israel was willing to give it back while it confiscated 52 per cent of the land in the West Bank and 30 percent of Gaza for military use or for settlements? Israel's military government demolished 1,338 Palestinian homes on the West Bank. Over this period, more than 300,000 Palestinians were detained without trial for various periods by Israeli security forces.
Arabs DID recognize Israel's right to exist first in 1974, then repeatedly afterwards.
Even if Nasser wanted to attack, it is against international law to take land beyond your borders. The occupation is illegal. Under the UN charter there can lawfully be no territorial gains from war, even by a state acting in self-defense. The occupation was labelled as a "denial of self determination and hence a serious and increasing threat to intenational peace and security."
Ending the occupation is simply abiding by international law. And no it hasn't been tried before. A few withdrawals from Palestinian towns isn't an end to occupation. But we have given that a chance. Right now Israeli withdrawal from a few towns is good but human rights are still being violated with new murders and provocations everyday. I just cross my fingers that Hamas doesn't fall for it.
We have stated over and over that an end to occupation with a viable Palestinian state will bring you peace. Now Abu Mazen might even accept a non-viable state. Even Hamas has stated many times that it will stop killing Israeli civilians when Israel stops killing Palestinians. If Israel ends its 36 year occupation, and is attacked, then it can reoccupy it. They occupied us in 6 days. This time they can do it in two.
:thepirate Moshe Dayan :thepirate ;) |
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| Palestinian |
| quote: | Originally posted by Izzy
i think it all comes down to responsibility
in order for this any peace to work the two sides have to prove responsibility.
in my opinoin throughout history israel has show it is a responsible peace partner who can honour its truces. as of yet i have not seen the responsiblility required from the palestinian side. They have not proved that they can stop terrorism. However, since Abbas now represents the palestinians i am willing to give him a chance to prove that he can reign down on terror, he has a chance to prove to world that he along with israel can achieve peace.
palestinian, although 1992 may have been when the first suicide bombing to take place lets not forget that Hamas was only formed in late 1987, to carry out such an attack withing five years of of exsistance is dispicable. however i can reference you to even earlier terrorist activities on israeli buses. In march March 1978 PLO terrorists (at that time their was no hamas or islamic jihad, the terrorist were straigh up PLO members) infiltrated israel. After murdering an american tourist walking near an israeli beach, they hijacked a civilian bus. when israeli troops intercepted the bus the terrorists opened fire, killing 34 of the hostages.
Occrider, what you said about the palestinians not willing to negotiate after the six-day war is correct. The arab leauge formed the PLO in cairo in 1964 as a weapon agianst israel (remember the six day war didnt happen till three years later). Until the six day war the PLO engaged in terrorist attacks that contributed to the momentum toward the war. After the end of the war the palestinians did not alter their basic objective. They belived the now had the prospect of waging a popular war of liberation. During September - December of 1967, a total of 61 attacks were launced, most agianst civilian targets such as factories, movie theatres, and private homes. When israeli security forces became effective in thwarting terrorist plans inside israel, the PLO started conducting terrorist activities outside israel. In 1968 the first of many aircraft was hijacked by palestinian terrorists. |
The first action of responsibility the Palestinians initiated was ending the first intifada in 1993. Another responsible action was the PLO's recognition of Israel since 1974. A period of Palestinian calm from 1993 to 2001 is another extremely responsible action. Yes, there were a few suicide bombs during those 8 years but the Israeli military was still destroying the Palestinians which created the suicide bombers. The fact is that Palestinians were dramatically worse off than they were before the Oslo process began. Their annual income was less than half of what it was in 1992; they were unable to travel from place to place, more of their land had been taken than ever before, more settlements existed, and Jerusalem was practically lost. "Every house demolished, every expropriated dunum, every arrest and every torture, every barricade, every closure, every gesture of arrogance and intended humiliation simply revives the past and re-enacts Israel's offenses against the Palestinian spirit, land, body politic. To speak about peace in such a context is to try to reconcile the irreconcilable."--Edward Said. Israel demolished Palestinian homes, taking over Arab neighborhoods in East Jerusalem for Jewish housing, and seizing Palesitnian land for new settlements. A massive new highway network built after 1993 on confiscated Palestinian land isolates Palestinian towns and villages from one another and from East Jerusalem, forcing many to go through Israeli checkpoints just to get to the next town. As Palestinian protests against this grew, army helicopters rocketed neighborhoods in several Palestinian cities, destroying entire city blocks and causing scores of casualties. Israeli tanks surrounded Palestinian towns with their guns turned toward the town. Armed Israeli civilians within the green line rampaged through Arab neighborhoods destroying Arab property and shouting "Death to Arabs". On September 6, 2001, a group of Israeli border police stopped three Palestinian workers as they were retuning home from Israel and, for no reason at all, subjected them to 40 minutes of torture. The San Francisco Chronicle reported on Sept 19 that the policement punched the three men, slammed their heads against a stone wall, froced them to swallow their own blood, and cursed their mothers and sisters. The incident only came to light because the policement took photographs of themselves with their vctims, holding their heads by the hair like hunting trophies. Israeli human rights workers said such beatings are a common occurrence, but they are seldom reported. When Barak announced a new plan to determine the status of the region, over 100 Palestinians were killed in a few weeks including 30 children. While speaking about peace, Barak enlarged the settlements. Cut the Palestinian territories into pieces by 'by-pass' roads. Confiscated lands. Demolished homes. Uprooted trees. Paralysed the Palestinian economy.
The list goes on. But point is, Israel has to prove that it can stop terrorism as well. Stop Israeli terrorism. The occupation is terrorism in itself.
Hamas was created in 1987, but what you say doesn't make sense that it is dispicable for Hamas to carry out an attack within five years of its existence. Although the organization formed, the people who formed it were there a long time before 87. The members of Hamas are people who's families have been slaughtered. Who's sister became paralyzed, who's home was demolished, who's mother killed in his arms. Those are the members of Hamas. People who go through this turn insane, and may turn to terror. And five years is a loong time. My friend is in the West Bank now with the ISM, he's going crazy after a few days in the occupation. And no they didn't wait 5 years, but 28 years. Since 67 they went through hell. Terrorism meted out by the Palestinians, regrettable as it is, is minute by comparison with that which has been inflicted on them. The mass media have failed to make this point adequetly.
Israeli terrorism, my friend, dates back to the beginning of european zionist immigration to Palestine. Dates back to Begin and Shamir. As for post 1948, Israeli terrorism existed then as well. And finally, the occupation is one of the most destructive forms of terrorism. :eyes: |
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| Viber |
| quote: | Originally posted by Palestinian
The first action of responsibility the Palestinians initiated was ending the first intifada in 1993. Another responsible action was the PLO's recognition of Israel since 1974. A period of Palestinian calm from 1993 to 2001 is another extremely responsible action. Yes, there were a few suicide bombs during those 8 years but the Israeli military was still destroying the Palestinians which created the suicide bombers. The fact is that Palestinians were dramatically worse off than they were before the Oslo process began. Their annual income was less than half of what it was in 1992; they were unable to travel from place to place, more of their land had been taken than ever before, more settlements existed, and Jerusalem was practically lost. "Every house demolished, every expropriated dunum, every arrest and every torture, every barricade, every closure, every gesture of arrogance and intended humiliation simply revives the past and re-enacts Israel's offenses against the Palestinian spirit, land, body politic. To speak about peace in such a context is to try to reconcile the irreconcilable."--Edward Said. Israel demolished Palestinian homes, taking over Arab neighborhoods in East Jerusalem for Jewish housing, and seizing Palesitnian land for new settlements. A massive new highway network built after 1993 on confiscated Palestinian land isolates Palestinian towns and villages from one another and from East Jerusalem, forcing many to go through Israeli checkpoints just to get to the next town. As Palestinian protests against this grew, army helicopters rocketed neighborhoods in several Palestinian cities, destroying entire city blocks and causing scores of casualties. Israeli tanks surrounded Palestinian towns with their guns turned toward the town. Armed Israeli civilians within the green line rampaged through Arab neighborhoods destroying Arab property and shouting "Death to Arabs". On September 6, 2001, a group of Israeli border police stopped three Palestinian workers as they were retuning home from Israel and, for no reason at all, subjected them to 40 minutes of torture. The San Francisco Chronicle reported on Sept 19 that the policement punched the three men, slammed their heads against a stone wall, froced them to swallow their own blood, and cursed their mothers and sisters. The incident only came to light because the policement took photographs of themselves with their vctims, holding their heads by the hair like hunting trophies. Israeli human rights workers said such beatings are a common occurrence, but they are seldom reported. When Barak announced a new plan to determine the status of the region, over 100 Palestinians were killed in a few weeks including 30 children. While speaking about peace, Barak enlarged the settlements. Cut the Palestinian territories into pieces by 'by-pass' roads. Confiscated lands. Demolished homes. Uprooted trees. Paralysed the Palestinian economy.
The list goes on. But point is, Israel has to prove that it can stop terrorism as well. Stop Israeli terrorism. The occupation is terrorism in itself.
Hamas was created in 1987, but what you say doesn't make sense that it is dispicable for Hamas to carry out an attack within five years of its existence. Although the organization formed, the people who formed it were there a long time before 87. The members of Hamas are people who's families have been slaughtered. Who's sister became paralyzed, who's home was demolished, who's mother killed in his arms. Those are the members of Hamas. People who go through this turn insane, and may turn to terror. And five years is a loong time. My friend is in the West Bank now with the ISM, he's going crazy after a few days in the occupation. And no they didn't wait 5 years, but 28 years. Since 67 they went through hell. Terrorism meted out by the Palestinians, regrettable as it is, is minute by comparison with that which has been inflicted on them. The mass media have failed to make this point adequetly.
Israeli terrorism, my friend, dates back to the beginning of european zionist immigration to Palestine. Dates back to Begin and Shamir. As for post 1948, Israeli terrorism existed then as well. And finally, the occupation is one of the most destructive forms of terrorism. :eyes: |
but the palastinians had an agreement with israel in the oslo agreement which they broke
and the palastinins was offered 97 precent of the occupied terretories in camp david and they denied the offer
and the palastinians broke sevrel truces that should have led to peace
and its a fact that when the idf is in the terretories less scuiside boombings is happening
Btw:the truce is holding up pretty well now ahh?
:) |
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| Izzy |
| quote: | Originally posted by Palestinian
Now I'm going to tell you something that will anger you about the war of 67. The media at this point in time doesn't tell you this because it would be dangerous to Israel's reputation. The war of 1967 was started by Israel and it wasn't a defensive or desperate act. Some of Nasser's forces were at the border ready to protect Syria and that was used as the excuse to start the war. An invalid excuse:
The former Commander of the Air Force, General Ezer Weitzman, regarded a hawk, stated that there was "no threat of destruction" but that the attck on Egypt, Jordan, and Syria was nevertheless justified so that Israel could "exist according to the scale, spirit, and quality she now embodies". Manachem Begin stated: "In June 1967, we again had a choice. The Egyptian Army concentrations in the Sinai approches do not prove that Nasser was really about to attack us. We must be honest with ourselves. We decided to attack him." Yitzhak Rabin said: "I do not think Nasser wanted war. The two divisions he sent to the Sinai would not have been sufficient to launch an offensive war. He knew it and we knew it." Moshe Dayan, the commander who gave the order to conquer the Golan said "many of the firefights with the Syrians were deliberately provoked by Israel, and the Kibbutz residents who pressed the Government to take the Golan Heights did so less for security than for the farmland." Also, "They didn't even try to hide their greed for the land..We would send a tractor to plow some area where it wasn't possible to do anything, in the demilitarized area, and knew in advance that the Syrians would start to shoot. If they didn't shoot, we would tell the tractor to advance further, until in the end the Syrians would get annoyed and shoot..And then we would use artillery and later the air force also, and that's how it was..The Syrians, on the fourth day of the war, were not a threat to us." "[Israel] may, no-it must-invent dangers, and to do this it must adopt the method of provocation and revenge..And above all-let us hope for a new war with the Arab countries, so that we may finally get rid of our troubles and acquire our space." Mordechai Bentoff, a cabinet member, eventually admitted that "all the story about the danger of extermination had been a complete invention and had been blown up a posteriori to justify the annexation of new Arab territories." I could tell you how much economic significance the occupied territories are to Israel, but that would need another essay. Provocation is Israel's best strategy such as the provocation of Hamas and Sharon's Al Aksa visit which I won't talk about here.
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woah there buddy, i can give you so many facts that israel had justification for its offensive in 1967, never mind the continual syrian bombardment from the golan on farmers, never mind the incursions of egyptian gangs on southern towns, Egypt was the first to declare war. The closure of the strait of Tiran in june 1967 was the casus belli for the war. The UN charter equates a blockade of any nations port as an act of war. israel's attack was a response to this egyptian first strike. simple as that, no way to arguee around that.
| quote: |
Senator Fulbright proposed in 1970 that America should guarantee Israel's security in a formal treaty, protecting her with armed forces if necessary. In return, Israel would retire to the borders of 1967. The UN would guarantee this arrangement, and thereby bring the Soviet Union (the supplier of weapons to the Arabs) into compliance. A peacekeeping force would be replaced by Israeli troops as they withdrew. The plan drew favorable editorial support in the US but was flatly rejected by Israel. "The whole affair disgusted Fulbright" his biographer wrote. "The Israelis were not even willing to act in their own self-interest." This was one of many such proposals. How can you say Israel was willing to give it back while it confiscated 52 per cent of the land in the West Bank and 30 percent of Gaza for military use or for settlements? Israel's military government demolished 1,338 Palestinian homes on the West Bank. Over this period, more than 300,000 Palestinians were detained without trial for various periods by Israeli security forces.
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agian, woah there buddy, slow down
from what i see you are arguing that israel refused to give back the newly acquired lands while the palestinians wanted to have it as their own.
do you remember resolution 242?
it says and i quote, "Withdrawal of Israeli armed forces from territories occupied in the recent conflict". sound like something any palestian would want, no occupying force? well all good and nice but it was the palestinians who rejected the resolution and the israeli's who embraced it
In a statement to the General Assembly in Oct 15, 1968 (before your 1970 refernce), the PLO rejected resolution 242, saying "the implementation of said resolution will lead to loss of every hope for the establishment of peace and security in Palestine and the Middle East region".
By contrast, Amb. Abba Eban (who passed away this spring) expressed israel's postition to the security council on May 1, 1968: "My governmet has indicated its acceptance of the Security Council resolution for the promotion of agreement on the establishment of a just and lasting peace."
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Arabs DID recognize Israel's right to exist first in 1974, then repeatedly afterwards.
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what the? where did this come from?
Egypt only formaly signed peace with israel in 1979, Jordan in 1993, and only in that year ('93) under signing the Oslo Declaration of Principles did the PLO recognize Israel's right to existance. the only thing i can find about 1974 is:
Jan 18, 1974 - Egypt-Israel Separation of Forces Agreement. this does not deal with anything but security measures.
May 31, 1974 Syria-Israel disengagement agreement. Which was basicly a cease-fire agreement.
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Ending the occupation is simply abiding by international law. And no it hasn't been tried before. A few withdrawals from Palestinian towns isn't an end to occupation. But we have given that a chance. Right now Israeli withdrawal from a few towns is good but human rights are still being violated with new murders and provocations everyday. I just cross my fingers that Hamas doesn't fall for it.
We have stated over and over that an end to occupation with a viable Palestinian state will bring you peace. Now Abu Mazen might even accept a non-viable state. Even Hamas has stated many times that it will stop killing Israeli civilians when Israel stops killing Palestinians. If Israel ends its 36 year occupation, and is attacked, then it can reoccupy it. They occupied us in 6 days. This time they can do it in two.
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this just sounds to wishy-washy for me. The hamas stating it will stop killing israeli civilians when israel stops killing palestinians, it's laughable. I will not even deal with an organization founded on the priciples in its charter, they deserve to be dismantled, but force if nessacry. |
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| Izzy |
| quote: | Originally posted by Palestinian
Another responsible action was the PLO's recognition of Israel since 1974. |
Once agian, i will call bull
In his letter of September 9, 1993 to Prime Minister Rabin, Yasser Arafat stated that those articles which deny Israel's right to exist or are inconsistent with the PLO's new commitments to Israel following their mutual recognition, are no longer valid. Several of the key articles to be amended are highlighted below.
On April 24, 1996, the Palestinian National Council, convening in Gaza, voted 504 to 54, with 14 abstentions, as follows:
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"The Palestinian National Charter is hereby amended by canceling the articles that are contrary to the letters exchanged between the P.L.O. and the Government of Israel 9-10 September 1993.
Assigns its legal committee with the task of redrafting the Palestinian National Charter in order to present it to the first session of the Palestinian central council." (24/04/96)
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On December 14, 1998, the Palestinian National Council, in accordance with the Wye Memorandum, convened in Gaza in the presence of U.S. President Clinton and voted to reaffirm this decision.
Oh and just so you know what in the charter was talked about being amended, here are a few of the articles taken from the 'Palestinian National Covenant' which is the PLO charter:
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Article 15: The liberation of Palestine, from an Arab viewpoint, is a national (qawmi) duty and it attempts to repel the Zionist and imperialist aggression against the Arab homeland, and aims at the elimination of Zionism in Palestine. Absolute responsibility for this falls upon the Arab nation - peoples and governments - with the Arab people of Palestine in the vanguard. Accordingly, the Arab nation must mobilize all its military, human, moral, and spiritual capabilities to participate actively with the Palestinian people in the liberation of Palestine. It must, particularly in the phase of the armed Palestinian revolution, offer and furnish the Palestinian people with all possible help, and material and human support, and make available to them the means and opportunities that will enable them to continue to carry out their leading role in the armed revolution, until they liberate their homeland.
Article 19: The partition of Palestine in 1947 and the establishment of the state of Israel are entirely illegal, regardless of the passage of time, because they were contrary to the will of the Palestinian people and to their natural right in their homeland, and inconsistent with the principles embodied in the Charter of the United Nations, particularly the right to self-determination.
Article 20: The Balfour Declaration, the Mandate for Palestine, and everything that has been based upon them, are deemed null and void. Claims of historical or religious ties of Jews with Palestine are incompatible with the facts of history and the true conception of what constitutes statehood. Judaism, being a religion, is not an independent nationality. Nor do Jews constitute a single nation with an identity of its own; they are citizens of the states to which they belong.
Article 22: Zionism is a political movement organically associated with international imperialism and antagonistic to all action for liberation and to progressive movements in the world. It is racist and fanatic in its nature, aggressive, expansionist, and colonial in its aims, and fascist in its methods. Israel is the instrument of the Zionist movement, and geographical base for world imperialism placed strategically in the midst of the Arab homeland to combat the hopes of the Arab nation for liberation, unity, and progress. Israel is a constant source of threat vis-a-vis peace in the Middle East and the whole world. Since the liberation of Palestine will destroy the Zionist and imperialist presence and will contribute to the establishment of peace in the Middle East, the Palestinian people look for the support of all the progressive and peaceful forces and urge them all, irrespective of their affiliations and beliefs, to offer the Palestinian people all aid and support in their just struggle for the liberation of their homeland.
Article 23: The demand of security and peace, as well as the demand of right and justice, require all states to consider Zionism an illegitimate movement, to outlaw its existence, and to ban its operations, in order that friendly relations among peoples may be preserved, and the loyalty of citizens to their respective homelands safeguarded.
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| Cyrus King |
| quote: | Originally posted by Izzy
woah there buddy, i can give you so many facts that israel had justification for its offensive in 1967, never mind the continual syrian bombardment from the golan on farmers, never mind the incursions of egyptian gangs on southern towns, Egypt was the first to declare war. The closure of the strait of Tiran in june 1967 was the casus belli for the war. The UN charter equates a blockade of any nations port as an act of war. israel's attack was a response to this egyptian first strike. simple as that, no way to arguee around that. |
What about all those quotes from Israeli leaders that implied it ws a provocation tactic utilized to excuse a "defensive" war? |
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| Viber |
| quote: | Originally posted by Cyrus King
What about all those quotes from Israeli leaders that implied it ws a provocation tactic utilized to excuse a "defensive" war? |
he didnt wrote from where are all of the quotes
what makes them unimportant |
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| NyKoN |
im sorry but i really cant read all of that stuff you wrote.. forgive me
anyways... Palestinian dude.. ur just full of ****
you're brain washed obviously so i wont even comment on what uve said
ill just say that Israel does not negotiate with terrorists and if we release prisoners its bcz we want to help Mahmud Abas(abu mazen) to gain power and to push up the road map.
its funny hamas put up conditions to the cease fire bcz they need it much more than Israel... you see, Israel got a green light from the entire world (but the arab) to finish hamas.. and now hamas decided to announce the cease fire to calm things down and releve the stress that they are under... its quite rude actually when you think about it... they need the ceash fire but put up conditions to it... i dont really understand that....
i just have to say that maybe some of you know my VERY extreme opinion regarding the Israeli-arab conflict... i just hope i get to have my crazy 3 minutes of raving wildly with my M16 in the middle of an "occupied territory" city street and get my 2 months in jail for killing some ppl :P yumzzz
palestinian.. warn ur friends from us... muhahahahahahaha
MAGAV WILL OWN |
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| Cyrus King |
| quote: | Originally posted by NyKoN
i just have to say that maybe some of you know my VERY extreme opinion regarding the Israeli-arab conflict... i just hope i get to have my crazy 3 minutes of raving wildly with my M16 in the middle of an "occupied territory" city street and get my 2 months in jail for killing some ppl :P yumzzz
palestinian.. warn ur friends from us... muhahahahahahaha
MAGAV WILL OWN |
NAZI |
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| Viber |
| quote: | Originally posted by NyKoN
im sorry but i really cant read all of that stuff you wrote.. forgive me
anyways... Palestinian dude.. ur just full of ****
you're brain washed obviously so i wont even comment on what uve said
ill just say that Israel does not negotiate with terrorists and if we release prisoners its bcz we want to help Mahmud Abas(abu mazen) to gain power and to push up the road map.
its funny hamas put up conditions to the cease fire bcz they need it much more than Israel... you see, Israel got a green light from the entire world (but the arab) to finish hamas.. and now hamas decided to announce the cease fire to calm things down and releve the stress that they are under... its quite rude actually when you think about it... they need the ceash fire but put up conditions to it... i dont really understand that....
i just have to say that maybe some of you know my VERY extreme opinion regarding the Israeli-arab conflict... i just hope i get to have my crazy 3 minutes of raving wildly with my M16 in the middle of an "occupied territory" city street and get my 2 months in jail for killing some ppl :P yumzzz
palestinian.. warn ur friends from us... muhahahahahahaha
MAGAV WILL OWN |
LEAVE IT |
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| DrummeRaver86 |
| quote: | Originally posted by NyKoN
im sorry but i really cant read all of that stuff you wrote.. forgive me
anyways... Palestinian dude.. ur just full of ****
you're brain washed obviously so i wont even comment on what uve said
ill just say that Israel does not negotiate with terrorists and if we release prisoners its bcz we want to help Mahmud Abas(abu mazen) to gain power and to push up the road map.
its funny hamas put up conditions to the cease fire bcz they need it much more than Israel... you see, Israel got a green light from the entire world (but the arab) to finish hamas.. and now hamas decided to announce the cease fire to calm things down and releve the stress that they are under... its quite rude actually when you think about it... they need the ceash fire but put up conditions to it... i dont really understand that....
i just have to say that maybe some of you know my VERY extreme opinion regarding the Israeli-arab conflict... i just hope i get to have my crazy 3 minutes of raving wildly with my M16 in the middle of an "occupied territory" city street and get my 2 months in jail for killing some ppl :P yumzzz
palestinian.. warn ur friends from us... muhahahahahahaha
MAGAV WILL OWN |
It's stupid -eating s like you that need to be slaughtered like animals so peace can be achieved in this world. Who the are you? If i ever meet you i swear i'm gonna dropkick you in the teeth |
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