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The best way to learn how to produceTrance (pg. 6)
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| DJMiakoda |
Well, I myself can understand why some people are reluctant to share some of their work, it does take years to develop the abilities to produce decent sounding tracks I'm a firm believer in this.
I've been at it for 2 and a half, maybe 3 years now and I'm not even confident enough in my music to post it here for critiquing yet.
That being said, please make no mistake, when I decided to jump into this debate and agreed that sharing session files might be a great way to help some of us noobs, I had no intentions of coming off as someone interested in copying someone else's work.
Frankly, that.
I'd like to think that when I do finally come to the table with something I'm proud of, it will be of my own, original creation, not a carbon copy of someone else's work.
I'm interested in making my own music, different and original.
The things that I find myself stumbling and tripping over right now are things like proper compression, proper EQ'ing, understanding the stereo spectrum, where the frequencies fit, and where they don't.
I thought maybe by looking at someone else's creation I could see more clearly what I've been struggling with in just reading it out of books and internet tutorials.
On the same token, I can see why some of you refuse to share your work in fear of someone copying it and not being creative enough to come up with their own style, especially with some of the recent posts I've been reading, that making Trance is no different than paint by numbers basically, ugh.
Tweaking in each and every little minute sound to perfection is no paint by numbers procedure in my opinion, it takes years to develop the knowledge and ability to create what you hear in your head with musical instruments, software etc. I know this well.
I guess I'll go back to reading tutorials and plugging away at my music 'til I come up with something I feel confident enough in to post up here for critiquing.
It's a fun process anyway I approach it, I'm in no hurry to be the next big thing in this music genre, I just enjoy making music. |
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| cronodevir |
Trance isn't paint by numbers, but alot of what has been coming out in the past years, i think, IS paint by numbers
The things you mentioned, compressing etc etc...don't look at my project, alot of that kinda stuff i didn't even bother with. lol. I use compressors and EQ to make sounds, not to fix them, so if you happen to see an eq its probably to change the sound to soemthign diffrent, not to fix or clean up or 'make it professinal', and i only use a compressor to limit. I could careless about conforming to e-trnace's standard of professinalism. I don't useual care about the small detials, unless they really through the entier track off...[like the guy before who said my kick/clap were horrid]
I also rarely 'mixdown'or EQ the entier track etc etc. due to technical difficulties [hardware related], and not really careing about the fine points that much. |
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| thecYrus |
| quote: | Originally posted by cronodevir
Trance isn't paint by numbers, but alot of what has been coming out in the past years, i think, IS paint by numbers
The things you mentioned, compressing etc etc...don't look at my project, alot of that kinda stuff i didn't even bother with. lol. I use compressors and EQ to make sounds, not to fix them, so if you happen to see an eq its probably to change the sound to soemthign diffrent, not to fix or clean up or 'make it professinal', and i only use a compressor to limit. I could careless about conforming to e-trnace's standard of professinalism. I don't useual care about the small detials, unless they really through the entier track off...[like the guy before who said my kick/clap were horrid] |
BUT if you can't produce trance by numbers how should you be able to produce something which needs way more skill? |
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| cronodevir |
I don't think its a matter of skill, as to why everything is trance by numbers these days, i believ its a matter of creativity. People hear soemthgin thats like "whoa aaah oooooh" and so they want to make that same whoahoh but with a diffrent lead sound, bassline, and pad, and kick, the arrangement, is useualy the same forumla. And there is this little 'standard' of the way something should sound [for instance, ""its not trance if it doesn't sound like armin""..some have said]
Its a problem of people looking at top DJ's and going wow, i want to make music like his!..instead of, wow hes cool, but i want to define my own style! Theres is plenty of room for everyone to be unique in thier work.
Trance is not like building a house for example, where everyone does everything the same, those who lay bricks use the same method, thsoe who lay roofing do the same, those who do the electrical work follow the same forumla etc etc.,and the only diffrence is that its just a diffrent person doing it...and that is what i think happened to trance. People trying to coem up with diffrent ways to produce the same sound, rather than coming up with diffrent ways to produce diffrent sounds. Sure a few tracks my sound cool, but thats on the micro level of things, on the macro level how ever, most of it is basicly the same. |
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| BOOsTER |
i think an architect would kill you with passion, as would a composer...oh well whatever...
Yours,
Mr. Bricklayer
lol |
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| cronodevir |
I work for an architect, at Federal Express. lol
Btw, i have been looking for an hour now...on google, no elss, and still haven't found the song in this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EMvLJn3Ui2E&mode=related&search=
Why don't some of you GURU's of google help a measly peon like me..sence, google answers everything..right? |
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| Storyteller |
Please....
let...
the........
hurting............
stop.............
pleasee..................
post.......
no...........
more...........
anyone...........
pretty please? |
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| Storyteller |
| This entire discussion is retarded and going nowhere. We all know you have a different point of view now. You've made that clear now, no problem. Nearly everyone in here disagrees, please just accept that.. And others please do the same with cronodevir's opinion. There is no point in taking this any further. |
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| DigiNut |
| quote: | Originally posted by cronodevir
I also rarely 'mixdown'or EQ the entier track etc etc. due to technical difficulties [hardware related], and not really careing about the fine points that much. |
And that is clearly the reason you want session files. You think you know how to produce, but you don't know how to mix, waving it away as "fine points" even though it actually accounts for a good 50% of the knowledge and skill involved in the production of any music, including trance.
And that's precisely the reason you won't get it. Even if you did, it wouldn't help you - mix and EQ settings are highly specific to individual tracks and getting a session file not only won't teach you anything about that, it won't be adaptable to any of your own tracks.
One last thing, for those still reading. Most of the people who insist that session files are the best way to learn are the people who haven't learned yet. Surely it must be obvious to everyone reading that those people are the least qualified to be discussing learning and teaching strategies. If you haven't been through the learning process yourself, you don't know what the best way to learn is. You can't know.
I blame the school system of today - doesn't teach kids the difference between actually learning a concept and kludging through one of its narrow applications. |
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| DJMiakoda |
| quote: | Originally posted by DigiNut
And that is clearly the reason you want session files. You think you know how to produce, but you don't know how to mix, waving it away as "fine points" even though it actually accounts for a good 50% of the knowledge and skill involved in the production of any music, including trance.
And that's precisely the reason you won't get it. Even if you did, it wouldn't help you - mix and EQ settings are highly specific to individual tracks and getting a session file not only won't teach you anything about that, it won't be adaptable to any of your own tracks.
One last thing, for those still reading. Most of the people who insist that session files are the best way to learn are the people who haven't learned yet. Surely it must be obvious to everyone reading that those people are the least qualified to be discussing learning and teaching strategies. If you haven't been through the learning process yourself, you don't know what the best way to learn is. You can't know.
I blame the school system of today - doesn't teach kids the difference between actually learning a concept and kludging through one of its narrow applications. |
I don't know if any of this is directed at me but if so I'll take the time to respond, respectfully...
I myself responded to this thread saying session files would be a good teaching tool and yes, you are correct sir, I'm fairly new to the art of making this type of music and I guess you could say 'I haven't learned yet', I confess, I'm guilty of not being nearly as good as some of the people on this message forum seem to be.
I'm also guilty of having a strong desire to want to learn how to make the music I hear in my head, by any means I can find.
I'm willing to take my chances with any approach, it may teach me nothing, it may teach me a great deal, but what is wrong with trying?
Should I be so close minded and only focus diligently on what the 'veterans' here say to do?
Or should I try anything and everything until I find what works for me?
My honest opinion, any tool is good when it comes to teaching.
No, it's not going to give someone ALL of the specifics, ALL of the little details for creating great music, that's nearly impossible as like you hinted, making the right sounds is very specific to the music you're working on and will vary from track to track.
But it may help some of us get started in the right or better direction, it may help some of us understand why things work the way they do.
Is this such a bad thing?
Believe me when I say I have read countless articles, books, tutorials etc on this subject, and I plan on continuing to pursue this approach.
Perhaps I'm not as artistically inclined to learn from text sitting there lifelessly on a page as some of you people are, sorry, my only excuse is everyone is different.
Blaming the modern day educational system is somewhat stereotypical in my opinion, I myself have been out of school and part of the working class for some time now, and frankly, I excelled quite well in school.
I don't see any need for this to turn into a war of words, I'm willing to accept that many people's opinions differ from many others on the best approach to learning how to create good music.
Just remember, what works well for you, may not work so well for others. |
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| cronodevir |
| quote: | Originally posted by DigiNut
And that is clearly the reason you want session files. You think you know how to produce, but you don't know how to mix, waving it away as "fine points" even though it actually accounts for a good 50% of the knowledge and skill involved in the production of any music, including trance.
And that's precisely the reason you won't get it. Even if you did, it wouldn't help you - mix and EQ settings are highly specific to individual tracks and getting a session file not only won't teach you anything about that, it won't be adaptable to any of your own tracks.
One last thing, for those still reading. Most of the people who insist that session files are the best way to learn are the people who haven't learned yet. Surely it must be obvious to everyone reading that those people are the least qualified to be discussing learning and teaching strategies. If you haven't been through the learning process yourself, you don't know what the best way to learn is. You can't know.
I blame the school system of today - doesn't teach kids the difference between actually learning a concept and kludging through one of its narrow applications. |
I have been through the learning process actually, and i don't care much for fine tuneing mixing and that stuff, because most of the music i make, doesn't require it [ie, it sounds like i want it without it]..and the genra itself doesn't really call for it...psy/goa trance require very little. Mostly because, generally speaking, no one cares.
However with comercial trance, its diffrent because everyone is trying to get paid, so they want to sound as 'professinal' as possiable. Reguardless to the fact that thier song consists of a cheezy 1 bar melody which is repated over and over with a supersaw. |
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