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Really, really f*cking scary. (pg. 5)
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| El K Dee |
| quote: | Originally posted by English Rachel
Understood, but as a Minister, you would think his advisors would have assisted him with being able to answer such a question that wouldn't evoke this kind of reaction from people. I think having anyone in that position that hasn't given thought to these kind of questions and the responses they're going to give MEANS he isn't capable of properly executing the duties of his office. |
IMO, him being asked about his belief in evolution was obviously a direct attack on his religious beliefs.
Do you go around asking people if they "believe in the theory of evolution"? No. Obviously he was asked to be trapped. We should probably get someone to ask all the members of parliament what their religious and scientific beliefs are if you think that such a question asked to him was appropriate. |
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| English Rachel |
| quote: | Originally posted by El K Dee
IMO, him being asked about his belief in evolution was obviously a direct attack on his religious beliefs.
Do you go around asking people if they "believe in the theory of evolution"? No. Obviously he was asked to be trapped. We should probably get someone to ask all the members of parliament what their religious and scientific beliefs are if you think that such a question asked to him was appropriate. |
Liam, he is the MINISTER of SCIENCE for goodness sake! |
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| Moral Hazard |
| quote: | Originally posted by English Rachel
Understood, but as a Minister, you would think his advisors would have assisted him with being able to answer such a question that wouldn't evoke this kind of reaction from people. I think having anyone in that position that hasn't given thought to these kind of questions and the responses they're going to give MEANS he isn't capable of properly executing the duties of his office. |
I don't know; my guess is that any answer other then "I believe in the validity of evolutionary theory" would have evoked the same response by many as this answer has evoked from you. I also suspect that any affirmative answer by Mr. Goodyear would have been less then honest; subsequently, refusing to answer the question was the best of bad options. Could he have made a more gracious and eloquent refusal... sure, but eloquence is not a requirement of a minister. |
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| El K Dee |
| quote: | Originally posted by English Rachel
Liam, he is the MINISTER of SCIENCE for goodness sake! |
As Mr. Hazard said, even if he said "No Comment", it would spark a riot. Are you saying that ministers of science should have NO religious beliefs? All he did was avoid the question (poorly) which really shouldn't be a biggie the way your initially quoted article made it out to be. |
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| English Rachel |
| quote: | Originally posted by Moral Hazard
I don't know; my guess is that any answer other then "I believe in the validity of evolutionary theory" would have evoked the same response by many as this answer has evoked from you. I also suspect that any affirmative answer by Mr. Goodyear would have been less then honest; subsequently, refusing to answer the question was the best of bad options. Could he have made a more gracious and eloquent refusal... sure, but eloquence is not a requirement of a minister. |
I'm done in this thread because I am coming down with something and I am going home but before I do, I want it to be known by everyone in here that I really, really don't have an opinion on what anyone thinks, believes in, worships, lives by. I believe in a 'live and let live' society where we can all coexist beautifully and respect what everyone else thinks.
I don't, however, think that the man who heads up Science and Technology in our government, should refuse to believe in a scientifically supported theory. I stand by that comment and always will. |
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| English Rachel |
| quote: | Originally posted by El K Dee
your initially quoted article |
I didn't write the ing thing. |
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| El K Dee |
| quote: | Originally posted by English Rachel
I didn't write the ing thing. |
holy crap I said QUOTED (I guess the "your" was misread) |
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| El K Dee |
| quote: | Originally posted by English Rachel
I don't, however, think that the man who heads up Science and Technology in our government, should refuse to believe in a scientifically supported theory. I stand by that comment and always will. |
I don't think that he, as a Chiropractor, should be in such a position. Forget about his beliefs in evolution. |
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| Moral Hazard |
| quote: | Originally posted by English Rachel
I don't, however, think that the man who heads up Science and Technology in our government, should refuse to believe in a scientifically supported theory. I stand by that comment and always will. |
Fair enough; however, I would suggest to you (and all) that since there is no evidence that the minister's beliefs have adversely impacted his ability to dispatch the duties of his office then anyone who claims a creationist is unfit to hold the Science portfolio is making said statement based on an unsubstantiated belief... essentially, you are pre-judging him based on a prejudice you believe he has. |
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| DJ_Elyot |
Time for me to step in and be the militant atheist .
| quote: | Originally posted by El K Dee
Are you saying that ministers of science should have NO religious beliefs? |
In my personal opinion, yes. Absolutely.
There is an intrinsic contradiction between belief in the supernatural and the ability to make rational decisions.
If you are a Christian, for example, and truly believe that the only road to salvation lies through belief in a magical holy saviour zombie son of Yahweh, then you are a total if you *don't* devote your life to rescuing others from eternal suffering by trying to convert them, right? It would be like leaving people in a burning building when you are perfectly capable of helping them escape.
Those who don't devote their life to service to god -- so-called "moderate" Christians -- are hypocrites. Either they don't truly believe in what their faith prescribes, or they are just letting the non-believers around them fall victim to their non-belief via their own inaction.
If Gary Goodyear truly believes in the core values of mainstream Christianity, then either he must make his political decisions based upon his faith (as several "faith-based" conservative politicians like Harold Albrect claim to do), or he is a complete hypocrite who would rather leave others in a burning building than risk his political career. In my mind, both of these alternatives are unacceptable.
It's fine to claim that he might not be unfit to hold the science portfolio; perhaps that is true and he truly can make unbiased decisions without his faith having an impact. But if this is the case, then he is delusional and untrue to his faith, somewhat like a corporate executive who teaches his children to believe in social justice but simultaneously authorizes the construction of factories in southeast asia where the workers don't get paid living wages.
I don't want somebody with this type of two-faced personality in public office, period. I want honest, rational, free-thinking people running my country.
The only acceptable solution is for Gary's beliefs to differ from those of mainstream Christianity. Perhaps they do, as Paul Martin's did. I can give him the benefit of the doubt. But he sold himself as a Christian to get elected, and with stuff like this, I'm having my doubts. Either way, it's politics as usual. |
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| djshan |
| quote: | Originally posted by MarkT
people have a right to practise their own religion.
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Sure, as long as they keep it to themselves. I think they are crazy, but that doesnt matter. If you ask whats my religon, its trance! haha:D |
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| English Rachel |
| quote: | Originally posted by aflyonthewall
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Hello Daniel. |
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