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John 00 Fleming: Response to essential mix, state of trance today (pg. 11)
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| SYSTEM-J |
| As I've said, you shouldn't be looking at it "in terms of the scene" because that is allowing trance's flaws to draw the artistic boundaries. |
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| FCB_Fanatic |
| quote: | Originally posted by SYSTEM-J
Again: we wouldn't have a problem if he hadn't claimed to play anything if he liked it, including techno, house and breaks, even though he clearly doesn't operate like that and has subsequently admitted so because narrow-minded trance fans box him in. How many times does it have to be stated before you'll grasp it: J00F wants to play more widely than he does. It's not myself or Sand Leaper who has the problem, it's the guy himself who cannot play everything he wants. All these bull defences like "Why should he play anything else?", "Why aren't you happy with good trance?" - ask the ing man yourself! He's the one who ing complained! This thread seems like massive, overwhelming evidence that even these snobby "proper trance" fans are incredibly narrow minded and are actively opposed to diversity. |
who ever said he would even like to play techno, house and breaks ... ??? as you say youself he stated he wanted to play more widely than he does, he never specified which genres he would like to play with the genres he plays now. Personally I wouldn't mind him playing some good techno in his sets. It barely doesn't exist anymore, but I would love it if he played it. I can really enjoy some good banging techno tracks in a set |
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| SYSTEM-J |
| He's mentioned all three of those as things he likes to play. Learn to ing read. |
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| djnitride |
Ok SYSTEM-J, I guess you are right. But I have said many times before in the thread, I would not mind if J00F mixed things up (whether he dropped breaks, drum n bass, techno etc).
J00F is still a great DJ, regardless if how he feels is boxed in. |
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| FCB_Fanatic |
| quote: | Originally posted by SYSTEM-J
He's mentioned all three of those as things he likes to play. Learn to ing read. |
this thread is going on for about 3 days, I must have missed it.
ing idiot !!!! according to me you're just over analyzing everything |
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| nefardec |
Im going to start a trance act and call it 'Fanbass'.
We'll give away free trips to people in hot air balloons and stuff. |
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| chrisday |
I personally don't see the problem in playing just one type of genre, I think the big problem with the scene today lies with the quality of productions.
Armin from 2002 is a good example of playing one consistent style to good effect, his marathon sets of 5 or so hours of nothing but quality uplifting trance always made for a great night.
But its a shame, in the context of trance where are the real pioneers of today? No Oakenfold, Sasha, Tiesto, no one brave enough and creative enough to set any real trends. Its all a money game, clever marketing and the so called stars of the future copy catting the mainstream sound which packs out clubs.
But... Again, this is old news. |
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| melijane |
| quote: | John 00 Fleming
When you've experienced these local nights with a 'family vibe' that are packed out with regular faces every week, you crave to get them back as these are the places that let DJ's breathe musically. Todays Trance nights are events, kinda like mini concerts focused around the DJ, so the DJ is forced to play all the hits the crowd require, he just doing his job!
| quote: | Domesticated
From a column I wrote in January:
In the past few years, I’ve seen every international jock from DJ Sneak to Yoji Biomehanika, Simon Dunmore to John ‘00’ Fleming and Jesse Rose to Adam Beyer. I’ve grooved to house, bopped to techno, shuffled to trance and stood dumbfounded at my inability to dance to drum ‘n’ bass (is hopping dancing?). The point being, nearly every ‘big’ DJ, even the most credible ones, suffer from the same problem: they flog their own music too much. |
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I'll raise you on all the 'Internationals' you've seen... but by-the-by, J00F is ONE of the VERY few who as a DJ does NOT FLOG his own MUSIC - at ALL!! :conf:
In fact MANY have often 'complained' to him that he DOESN'T but should - because there's MANY - esp. over the last couple of years since he's stuck his teeth into producing J00F Titles as well as with The Digital Blonde (00.db) in their Heaven & Hell releases - who just CRAVE to HEAR HIS tunes on the Dance / Dirt Floor, or Sand!!! :eyes:
:toocool: |
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| Domesticated |
| quote: | Originally posted by SYSTEM-J
Dubstep and techno come from completely different musical backgrounds, typically have very different rhythms and usually different tempos. The only reason you think of them as similar is because DJs have successfully put them together in sets, which is because DJs and crowds from that scene are much more open-minded and willing to mix it up. |
The same can be said for trance and psy-trance. They come from very different musical backgrounds. If you understood the history of psy-trance you would know that. Again, they have very different rhythms too. I never claimed that dubstep and techno were similar anyway, I said they're "not so dissimilar", as in, not worlds apart. They are closer than say, funk and happy hardcore.
It's funny that you're commenting on how DJs and crowds from "that scene" are much more open minded and willing to mix it up. Again, your complete ignorance of the psy-trance scene is evident. At any given psy-trance festival in the world there are generally three to four stages playing everything from reggae to dark psy.
Perhaps you're talking about uplifiting/club trance, in which case you'd be correct; those crowds are incredibly ignorant. The only thing is that Fleming plays in both scenes. In Australia he's played the big commercial festivals as well as the more closeted events out in the bush.
| quote: | Originally posted by SYSTEM-J
For me, the difference between progressive trance and progressive house, particularly the atmospheric house J00F plays, is so ridiculously small as to barely be worth noting. To take that as evidence of diversity and then to compare it to the gap between dubstep and techno is just talking nonsense. Get a box of techno and dubstep records and play a cohesive set with them, then get back to me. |
Again, no one has claimed that playing prog house and prog trance is evidence of true diversity, only evidence of more diversity than the average trance jock.
| quote: | Originally posted by SYSTEM-J
You didn't even read my whole post before replying did you, because I destroyed this point before you'd even written it. Again, I like J00F a lot. I've got his mix CDs, I've got his productions, I loved the EM, I paid to see him live, I'm looking forward to this new tour. I've got no problem with what he does because he does it well. That isn't the point, and the reason I call you a fanboy is because you're repeatedly making over-defensive and unreasonable points. |
Of course I read your post before replying, I'm not an idiot. What exactly have I said that's over-defensive and unreasonable?
I've not claimed that Fleming is a diverse DJ in the true sense of the word and I've not claimed that his comments aren't hypocritical unless viewed with proper context.
| quote: | Originally posted by SYSTEM-J
Again: we wouldn't have a problem if he hadn't claimed to play anything if he liked it, including techno, house and breaks, even though he clearly doesn't operate like that and has subsequently admitted so because narrow-minded trance fans box him in. How many times does it have to be stated before you'll grasp it: J00F wants to play more widely than he does. It's not myself or Sand Leaper who has the problem, it's the guy himself who cannot play everything he wants. All these bull defences like "Why should he play anything else?", "Why aren't you happy with good trance?" - ask the ing man yourself! He's the one who ing complained! This thread seems like massive, overwhelming evidence that even these snobby "proper trance" fans are incredibly narrow minded and are actively opposed to diversity. |
I think the point you're missing is that Fleming does think he's playing diversely. He doesn't want to play more widely than he does currently.
From the original post that started this thread: "I'd be happy to perform a 4/5 hour version of my Essential Mix to an open-minded crowd." Note the words "open-minded". Fleming thinks that his Essential Mix was something diverse and which requires an open mind.
And again: "It's the fact that the trance scene is heading down a one-way street with the same euro format for the past decade and it worries me that the next generation of DJs/clubbers are growing up in this scene thinking this is the only form of trance."
No where does he say "I'd love to play techno in a set." The whole piece is about trance, and trance only. Hence my recurring assertion that Fleming is railing against the lack of diversity within the trance world only. He's not talking about wanting to play other genres, simply expanding the range of music within trance. The sooner you understand this, the sooner you can understand why his comments aren't hypocritical and why I'm not being a fanboy in the least. |
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| SYSTEM-J |
| quote: | Originally posted by Domesticated
The same can be said for trance and psy-trance. They come from very different musical backgrounds. If you understood the history of psy-trance you would know that. Again, they have very different rhythms too. |
No they don't. Their musical heritage is very similar and their rhythms are the same 4/4 thump. You can (and I have) mix trance and psy-trance very easily. There's no great tempo gap to negotiate, no different rhythmic templates to meld.
| quote: | | Again, your complete ignorance of the psy-trance scene is evident. At any given psy-trance festival in the world there are generally three to four stages playing everything from reggae to dark psy. |
Then why is Rebel9 saying the psy trance scene is incredibly cut off?
| quote: | | I think the point you're missing is that Fleming does think he's playing diversely. He doesn't want to play more widely than he does currently. |
I think you need to read his posts again. |
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| Domesticated |
| quote: | Originally posted by SYSTEM-J
No they don't. Their musical heritage is very similar and their rhythms are the same 4/4 thump. You can (and I have) mix trance and psy-trance very easily. There's no great tempo gap to negotiate, no different rhythmic templates to meld. |
:haha:
How is their heritage similar? They evolved in different countries and in different time periods, nearly ten years apart.
| quote: | Originally posted by SYSTEM-J
Then why is Rebel9 saying the psy trance scene is incredibly cut off |
He only said it was cut off from club trance, which is very correct.
| quote: | Originally posted by SYSTEM-J
I think you need to read his posts again. |
Do I? Perhaps you should just supply what you think I've missed rather than asking me to review the article again. If it was that obvious you would already have done so. |
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