There are lies, damned lies, and theres statistics. Those studies are too general. These are the questions that should have been asked:
1. What percentage of gun crimes are committed with a weapon obtained legally/illegally?
2. Were those offenders previously convicted of other crimes?
3. Have they committed gun crimes before?
4. Percentages of the types of the crimes (robbery, murder, possession, ect.)
Ill just use Columbia as an example because its ranked first in homicide per 100,000 people. 20% of homicides were gun related. Why aren't the other 80% of things killing people being made illegal?
Tranceporter99
quote:
Originally posted by Lira
Some people :(
Oh, there's a guy shooting at us right now! If I run upstairs, get the gun, come back, aim at him, and shoot right between his eyes, I can save the say! Everybody, hold on, I'm going to get my gun in my drawer and I'll be back in a minute, please dodge from the bullets while I'm away!
:p
i dont understand. you don't believe in self defense? what would you have done had this happened?
squats
I don't like to use youtube as a reference but:
She is a governor from Texas AND Pro-gun(that part shouldn't have been a surprise) Watch the full episode if you have the chance.
If you don't watch the clip heres a summary for ADD'ers:
20,000 Gun laws haven't done to stop crazy people. Go ahead and make another one.
Originally posted by Lira
Well, here's the tip of the iceberg. Firstly, the ubiquitous graph:
banning guns. We need to ban central & south america.:wtf:
:p
zag2me
quote:
Originally posted by squats
Stupid people will will commit crimes with guns regardless of whether or not they are legal! Why are you so anti-gun? Is it because you're afraid I'm going to track down your I.P address, go to your home with my gun and rape you? You shouldn't call people shmucks. Especially when the person saying it is the only one in the room.
edit:
Strict gun laws only prevent people with legitimate reasons to own a gun from getting one. Meanwhile criminals can buy a gun out of some guys truck for next to nothing.
I don't own a gun nor do I feel I need one because I'm "ashamed that mr.tiny won't work when it needs to." I feel they should should put tougher requirements in order to use internet so that people like you don't go around and spread stupid ideas around to other stupid people like yourself.
We don't have guns in the UK, and we also don't have incidents like this.
Coincidence?
Lira
quote:
Originally posted by Tranceporter99
i dont understand. you don't believe in self defense? what would you have done had this happened?
It depends on the context quite a lot. But I don't think I'd have a gun at hand if children were around, and go look for something certainly isn't among the things I'd ever do in an emergency, specially if people were being shot while I looked for the gun and, worse yet, my so-called self-defence could accidentally hit an innocent (or, also, I could simply miss and supply the criminal one extra weapon).
quote:
Originally posted by squats
There are lies, damned lies, and theres statistics. Those studies are too general. These are the questions that should have been asked:
1. What percentage of gun crimes are committed with a weapon obtained legally/illegally?
Originally posted by squats
2. Were those offenders previously convicted of other crimes?
3. Have they committed gun crimes before?
How is that relevant if a crime was committed, regardless of what happened before?
quote:
Originally posted by squats
4. Percentages of the types of the crimes (robbery, murder, possession, ect.)
For every and each one of those countries? Of course that graph is a simplification, the amount of data would be otherwise overwhelming.
But, you can compare the kind of crime most frequent in those countries here. But, how does that disprove the fact that "more guns, more crime"?
quote:
Originally posted by squats
Ill just use Columbia as an example because its ranked first in homicide per 100,000 people. 20% of homicides were gun related. Why aren't the other 80% of things killing people being made illegal?
Columbia? I need a context here. You mean the District?
Lira
quote:
Originally posted by squats
Outlaw Cars!
Outlaw Pipes!
Outlaw Bombs!
Outlaw Explosions!
Outlaw Santa Claus!
Well, speeding is against the law, isn't it?
As for guns, what are you going to do with them except for shooting animals/people? Drill holes on the wall to hang a picture? ;)
DJ Shibby
quote:
Originally posted by Lira
Do you happen to know what a vicious circle is, and how it works?
Wait til you see the next generation of weaponry about to land in the hands of your local police enforcement agency.
You'll be wishing you had a gun as soon as any major shift in global power occurs.
DJ Shibby
quote:
Originally posted by Lira
Well, here's the tip of the iceberg. Firstly, the ubiquitous graph:
All things being equal, the more guns around, the more likely it is to see a rise in gun violence. Naturally, a fraction of that percentage could have happened in cases where the gun was used in self-defence - but these homicides don't seem to have been necessary in countries where gun control is more strict, do they? This is far, however, from being the only problem, I also give you that. Along with loose gun control, poverty seems to raise homicide levels:
These are, by far, the two major causes behind high gun mortality, reason why it's not even funny to compare the US with those other countries, such as Colombia, South Africa, and Brazil (where I live). In all these cases, there would be far more to compare than just gun ownership (although, coincidentally, I don't think any of these countries have strict gun regulation).
The United States have an incredibly high level of gun homicide rates when compared to other developed countries and, except for the high levels of gun ownership, I can't see what else could be a factor behind this issue.
You'll notice two things in your information here:
1. There is obviously a close tie to gun homocide rates and prohibition of drugs. This is basic supply & demand, and illegal entities such as the war on drugs are used to help keep these regions destabilized. Guns can't be banned until the governments of the planet and the societies of the planet mature enough to move beyond these black markets and find other solutions.
2. Switzerland. Every household owns an automatic weapon, and there is a minimal drug issue in this country. Check out the homocide rate.
