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U.S & obesity (pg. 9)
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| Mr.Mystery |
| quote: | Originally posted by Innocence Lost
calm down loser.
:stongue: |
How do you count your chins? Do you sweat grease? |
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| Innocence Lost |
| quote: | Originally posted by Mr.Mystery
How do you count your chins? Do you sweat grease? |
aww ogranik is mad.
:( |
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| SYSTEM-J |
| quote: | Originally posted by DJ RANN
But that's the problem; I'm not talking about localized cultural differences, I'm talking about a widespread cultural issue that is present in every single state, in virtually every single city.
If you go in to a walmart in New Jersey, you're going to see exactly the same scary weigh issues en masse as you do in Walmart down in inglewood, south central LA. |
I don't know, you seem to have changed tack here, when a few posts ago you were saying:
| quote: | But you live in seattle, possible the single most liberal, educated, blue voting, outdoorsey, progressive place in north America.
The 10 states with the highest obesity are all in the south.
You can say all you want about certain states, cities or enclaves being healthy and fit and their shops selling really good produce etc, but that is not represeantive of the USA as a whole. |
Now it seems that they can't say all they want about certain states, cities or enclaves. Maybe it would be easier to just say "Okay, fair enough" here rather than reverse engineer your entire argument? And seriously mate, talk about death by line breaks. |
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| DJ RANN |
| quote: | Originally posted by SYSTEM-J
I don't know, you seem to have changed tack here, when a few posts ago you were saying:
Now it seems that they can't say all they want about certain states, cities or enclaves. Maybe it would be easier to just say "Okay, fair enough" here rather than reverse engineer your entire argument? And seriously mate, talk about death by line breaks. |
Eh? What change of tack? There is none? I don't think you've read the thread or my posts in entirety.
I said from my very first post on this (and throughout) that you can find enclaves which buck the overall trend but that's not the USA as a whole as the problem is both widespread and endemic to the USA.
Which is opposite of Lews saying: don't paint the whole USA with the same brush, just because some tiny, relatively small population area happens to be better than the rest of the state or coast.
btw, the place Lews as an example, Seattle is in Washington state, and the entire state's population isn't even close to London's population. Seattle has the same population at cornwall, and in comparison to the USA as a whole it's 0.02% of the population.
So yes, If you look at any country or area under a small enough microscope you can draw conclusions that don't actually represent the common reality or any macro of discussion.
So which bit are you confused about? |
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| Vector A |
Even the state with the lowest obesity rate, Colorado, sits at about 21%: http://stateofobesity.org/adult-obesity/
It is one of just 7 states with less than 25% obese. The vast majority of the states are at 1 in 4 people or higher, with twenty of them at 30% or more.
Washington, by the way, is around 27%. Must be plenty of chubsters waddling around outside Seattle. |
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| LoveHate |
| I mean we all know what fast food chains are but where do we draw the line? No Red Robins? They serve burgers and fries but because it's "gourmet" it's okay to eat? |
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| Vector A |
Fast food won't make you fat if you don't eat a lot of it.
If every person who got fat from fast food had instead eaten exactly one half of what they ate, at every one of their fast food meals, they would likely not be fat now.
Even if a typical sedentary young man eats three to four Big Macs per day and nothing else, he will not get fat. He might run into vitamin or mineral deficiencies at some point, but obesity would not be his problem. |
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| Chimney |
| quote: | Originally posted by Vector A
Fast food won't make you fat if you don't eat a lot of it.
If every person who got fat from fast food had instead eaten exactly one half of what they ate, at every one of their fast food meals, they would likely not be fat now.
Even if a typical sedentary young man eats three to four Big Macs per day and nothing else, he will not get fat. He might run into vitamin or mineral deficiencies at some point, but obesity would not be his problem. |
Technically true. What's the price of a Big Mac menu over there? |
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| SYSTEM-J |
| quote: | Originally posted by DJ RANN
I said from my very first post on this (and throughout) that you can find enclaves which buck the overall trend but that's not the USA as a whole as the problem is both widespread and endemic to the USA.
Which is opposite of Lews saying: don't paint the whole USA with the same brush, just because some tiny, relatively small population area happens to be better than the rest of the state or coast. |
That's not the opposite at all. It's exactly the same thing. You both agree that the distribution of obesity is not even because you yourself point out contributing socio-economic factors (poor people are a lot fatter than more affluent people) and geographic distribution (obesity being most concentrated in the South, for exmaple). Lews is simply pointing out that there are whole communities, even whole cities and areas, that don't fit the prevailing standards, which someone not familiar with the US (IE: Chimney) should keep in mind. That's exactly the same as someone from London urging perspective so a foreigner doesn't get the impression everyone in England has the diet and lifestyle of someone from Blackburn or Newcastle, even though statistically the latter demographic is probably the great majority.
That point does not exist in opposition with the fact that America generally has a problem with its food culture and the ingredients found in food, that chains like Walmart and McDonalds are pervasive or even that every state taken overall has worrying obesity statistics. It was simply a call for perspective which you've carpet bombed with stats of varying relevance. |
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| wotyzoid |
| Im gonna go out on a limb here, but if people want to kill themselves through eating who are we to stop them and judge? I only wish the food wasn't so terrible and it was distributed properly. |
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| wotyzoid |
| I grew up watching goku eat, I'll go in on a rodizio or breakfast everyonce in a while especially after a night out or something extensive. |
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| Silky Johnson |
In some ways I support what Big Worm is saying.
In the 80s, beliefs about health and health care shifted from the personal responsibility model, whereby health and wellness was considered the result of personal choices, to the "social determinants of health" model, whereby health and wellness is understood to be a result of the factors affecting health - income and social status, social support networks, education, employment/working conditions, social environments, physical environments, personal health practices and coping skills, healthy child development, gender, and culture.
http://www.who.int/social_determinants/en/
Yes, making healthy choices is up to the individual, but those choices are affected by the individual's access to and quality of the social determinants.
The Ottawa Charter is a document that outlines specific goals for health promotion, which is intended to give people more control + power over their health by addressing the social determinants.
www.who.int/healthpromotion/conferences/previous/ottawa/en/
Anyhow, this shift actually coincides with my point about the difference in obesity rates in the last 20-30 years. To me the implication is that this shift has enabled people to make excuses for themselves more than ever...and then you have people like what Big Worm is talking about crying "I can't help it because I was abused!" or some other . We've swung so far the other way that it's akin to victim blaming if you dare suggest health is mostly a personal choice.
I feel very ambivalent about it, to be honest. It can be difficult, as a health care provider, to be compassionate about these issues 100% of the time (especially in Canada where we DO have so ing much of everything, even our "poor" are better off than poor people in other countries) - but then I witness the reality of it every day, and I know for a fact that the majority people who get sick and are unwell are of lower socio-economic status and their issues really can't be helped because they literally do not know any better, rather - they do not have access to better.
Also re: bariatric surgery. It RARELY ends well. The patients who do it usually can't stay compliant for long, and the surgeries themselves aren't free of complications down the road (these types of surgeries often require more surgery to fix complications later on - it's pretty well known that once you start ing around in the gut you are pretty much guaranteed to need future surgical intervention). I cannot tell you how often we have to treat patients who have had some form of weight loss surgery who end up really sick or near death, no joke.
| quote: | Originally posted by wotyzoid
Im gonna go out on a limb here, but if people want to kill themselves through eating who are we to stop them and judge? |
Unwell people cost the health care system (essentially Canadian citizens) billions of dollars. At least up here where we actually take care of ALL our unwell. Health promotion and prevention is actually a thing in Canada. :p |
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