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the Wikileaks/ Cablegate scandal (pg. 16)
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| StereoPrincess |
| quote: | Originally posted by ChemEnhanced
this is the start of WWIII |
more like Web War 1. |
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| infinity HiGH |
| quote: | Originally posted by Yohan
I still don't get why people are so upset that wikileaks is being targeted by govts.
We never had free speech in the first place. We always lived in censorship of sort, to varying degrees from country to country. If we had genuine free speech, I should be able to say whatever I damn want and I should be able to get away with it, as long as it doesn't harm anyone. (I think holocaust deniers are idiots, but that doesn't mean they should be denied their right to say whatever they want)
And a lot of people are ok with censorship. I mean, just how many of you are fine with anti hate speech and holocaust denier laws? I bet couple of you are angry that the govt is going after wikileaks is quite fine with censoring those that are claiming the holocaust never happened. For most part, we're okay with living under some sort of censorship. Go read War Measures Act (Canada) and Official Secrets Act (Britain) and see just how much free speech we really have.
And there is aspect of what wikileaks is doing is clearly illegal, not because of free speech, but from ownership point of view. Wikileaks never had legal ownership of the files it published. Would you be happy if someone published all your emails and online banking info without your consent?
I find it shocking that a lot of people are equating wikileaks to Gandhi or something, considering that wikileaks is 'fighting for' something that never existed in the first place, meaning free speech. |
actually what wikileaks is doing is not illegal at all. they (the US Government) don't really have a case against wikileaks/Assange. The person that originally leaked the documents is already in custody and faces a maximum sentence of ~50 years in jail. Wikileaks on the other hand didn't do anything wrong.
As for the freedom of speech thing: I agree that that term is greatly exaggerated, and the idea doesn't exist on the scale that we'd like to believe it exists, but there's a difference between releasing information and people spreading hate, ignorance and bigotry under the guise of freedom of speech.
And people are pissed off because whether it's true or not, our glorious leaders like to beat that into our heads day in and day out. That we live in a "free world" unlike those communist-nazi bastards over in the middle east, China, North Korea, etc. People are reacting the way they should be reacting. Afterall isn't that what the west is trying to spread all over the world? |
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| Yohan |
| quote: | Originally posted by infinity HiGH
actually what wikileaks is doing is not illegal at all. they (the US Government) don't really have a case against wikileaks/Assange. The person that originally leaked the documents is already in custody and faces a maximum sentence of ~50 years in jail. Wikileaks on the other hand didn't do anything wrong. |
I is immigrant and I speak engrish. I need to make my posts more clearer.
Wikileaks may not be criminally guilty of breaking the law, I think they are guilty of breaking the spirit of the law. Certainly something to do with dealing in stolen property, if that makes any sense.
Some dude hacked into your computer and stole your banking info, and he gave it to some guy. That guy decided to tell a bunch of people your banking info. Clearly That guy is doing some sort of wrong, no?
| quote: |
As for the freedom of speech thing: I agree that that term is greatly exaggerated, and the idea doesn't exist on the scale that we'd like to believe it exists, but there's a difference between releasing information and people spreading hate, ignorance and bigotry under the guise of freedom of speech. |
I agree that there is a difference. But what is censorship, but a bunch of people deciding what should be allowed and not. For me, I don't have problem with hate speech, because I know better than to buy into that stuff, and at least I also know who the idiots are. (and if you are persuaded by hate speech, then clearly you need to be removed from the gene pool)
Censorship is just a difference in opinion.
| quote: |
And people are pissed off because whether it's true or not, our glorious leaders like to beat that into our heads day in and day out. That we live in a "free world" unlike those communist-nazi bastards over in the middle east, China, North Korea, etc. People are reacting the way they should be reacting. Afterall isn't that what the west is trying to spread all over the world? |
Eh. Depends on how much you buy into rhetoric the politicians spew and compare it to realpolitik that is practiced in global politics scene.
| quote: | Originally posted by StereoPrincess
can you explain this further?
from what i understand, the authorities will try to catch the anonymous people. |
Bunch of 'hackers' retaliating with attacks on sites of major credit companies under guise of helping out wikileaks is illegal, no? And people think govts going after wikileaks is some sort of illegal too.
So some people think it's ok to correct or commit retribution against an illegal act by committing illegal acts of their own. |
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| Special K |
Assange for Nobel Peace Prize?
The Russians think so
http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/201...bel-peace-prize
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http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/blog...es-live-updates
Meanwhile, the Russian strongman, Vladimir Putin (referred to as an "alpha dog" in the leaked cables), has also been sounding off at the US, accusing it of hypocrisy. Reuters reports on his mixed metaphors.
| quote: | "If it is full democracy, then why have they hidden Mr. Assange in prison? That's what, democracy?" Putin said, in the strongest Russian criticism of the affair. "So, you know, as they say in the countryside, some people's cows can moo, but yours should keep quiet. So I would like to shoot the puck back at our American colleagues," Putin said at a briefing with his French counterpart Francois Fillon.
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:haha: |
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| Yohan |
| lol. the rodina isn't very good with this free speech business either. though she doesn't really pretend to practice like the yanks do |
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| hardcore trancer |
I was just about to post his comments.:p No country in the world should take the US seriously when it comes to the talk of free speach and democracy. |
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| Sly_Guy |
| putin is as evil as they come, but he's right in calling out US |
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| geroin |
:p |
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| FunkyCrew |
| quote: | Originally posted by Sly_Guy
putin is as evil as they come, but he's right in calling out US |
hey, the US always accuse Russia of breeching of the basic rights and freedoms - now it's Russia's turn! |
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| Sly_Guy |
| quote: | Originally posted by FunkyCrew
hey, the US always accuse Russia of breeching of the basic rights and freedoms - now it's Russia's turn! |
with both of those nations, it's always been the pot calling the kettle black. But I'm glad to see Russia firing back. |
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| Magnetonium |
Honestly, Wikileaks is the 2010 story of the year. Period. All these shocking revelations, shortcomings, drama, political intervention (and now Russian comments, WTF) and so on - make this a very exciting case to follow.
I wonder if they have a cable that says something like Osama Bin Laden is not in charge of Al-Qaeda (or already dead), or something provocative like that.
Now think of this - Wikileaks has ONLY released over 1,100 cables so far out of 250,000 !!!!!!!!!!! :crazy: :crazy: :crazy:
I bet by the time they release 10,000 - Americans will launch missile attacks against all bunkers around the world that are hosting servers to Wikileaks files. That will be quite a twist.
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