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Enough is Enough (pg. 10)
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| tiesto14 |
| quote: | Originally posted by da_MynDLesS_one
LOL
LOL
LOL
it's the CANADIAN national team!!! Why would there be anything but CANADIANS on it???!!
LOL!!!!!!!!! |
maybe u should read a little more.....the majority of your players play on American NHL teams cus ur teams are trash....
and i love how u guys make an atempt to play baseball...lol Montreal Expos....be real and stay in the minor leagues |
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| SNAFU_man |
| quote: | Originally posted by da_MynDLesS_one
LOL
LOL
LOL
it's the CANADIAN national team!!! Why would there be anything but CANADIANS on it???!!
LOL!!!!!!!!! |
personally, i think it would have been really bad for the sport if canada lost that game. didn't canada win by just one goal?
did you happen to see how happy the americans were at losing??
hmmm...
lol |
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| tiesto14 |
Canadians can't even support their own favorite sport.
Look at the facts.
The Winnipeg Jets became the Phoenix Coyotes.
The Quebec Nordiques became the Colorado Avanlanche.
Teams like the Edmonton Oilers, the Calgary Flames, and the
Ottowa Senators are in severe economic turmoil. The only teams not in
jeopardy are from the three largest Canadian cities, the Montreal Canadians,the Toronto Maple Leafs and the Vancover Canucks.
Must I also point out that each of these teams are owned by either major corporations (Montreal by Molson, and Vancover by Orca Entertainment) or multibillionaires (Toronto,Harry Baldwin).
hahahahhah....losers |
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| fastmp3 |
who's the best hockey team of all times ? montreal canadiens
where are they from ? canada |
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| tiesto14 |
| quote: | Originally posted by fastmp3
who's the best hockey team of all times ? montreal canadiens
where are they from ? canada |
hahhahhahahahahahha...u really beleive that..LOL
the only hockey team from Canada that WAS any good was like the 1979 Oilers....with Gretzsky(spelling(, Messier and Kuri...since that team, who won like 5 cups in a row or soemthing, there has never been a good Canadian hockey team...
still cracks me up thats all u Canadians have to offer...hockey..lol...besides that, which u guys suck at now, u have ZERO...u guys even ed up bacon..hahahahhahahhahahhahahha
eh |
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| dj_kimbo37 |
which means...that americans are better? damn i hate those threads, but anyway:
you say SOME PEOPLE are dying, you've almost killed the whole ing country....isn't it time to go for the one you actually were looking for, and STOP BOMBING THE ING PLACE!!! well you said that
| quote: | Originally said by Gerorge W. Bush
"oh "some few" civilians are dying, that doesn't mean anything"
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in fact there are 10000's of people dying...but no one cares!!!!
but if ONE SINGLE ING soldier from the usa gets a bullet in his head....
"yeah, now we have TWO reasons for taking bin laden!"
"but where is he, mr bush???"
"uhhh....lets bomb the whole country!"
I HATEHATEHATEHATE BUSH!!!!! and many americans can talk nonsense for hours just to make people think that the world=america! like that hockey over there, thats three-grade NONSENSE BULL!
AND GUESS WHO's BOMBED A WEDDING RECENTLY!! :whip: :whip:
well i don't hate every single american, it's just that bush is making this "america power" in the whole nation. he's ing you up!
everytime i hear about bush i get in a bad mood!!!! what's next? dance valley? cuz the bass sounded like shots:haha: :haha: :haha: |
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| verminator |
| quote: | Originally posted by tiesto14
hahhahhahahahahahha...u really beleive that..LOL
the only hockey team from Canada that WAS any good was like the 1979 Oilers....with Gretzsky(spelling(, Messier and Kuri...since that team, who won like 5 cups in a row or soemthing, there has never been a good Canadian hockey team...
still cracks me up thats all u Canadians have to offer...hockey..lol...besides that, which u guys suck at now, u have ZERO...u guys even ed up bacon..hahahahhahahhahahhahahha
eh |
that you guys from the us start to use the hockey teams as arguments for the discussion shows how pathetic its possible to become.
but anyways, how come canada suck in hockey when they beat the US in the winter olympics???? 5-2 if i remember right.. hmmm
oh.. is it because they...... suck???
nopp, dont think so, its because the US suxx
even if you are a patriot, its so god damn ridicilous to use such stupid arguments in a discussion, only to try to proove that your country is better than another.
do you know that canada is among the top 4 countries in the world, thinkning about the standard of the country?
switzerland,norway,canada and japan or something.
i dont even think the us was in the top10..
doesnt that explain a lot?
c'mon
grow up, and start using real arguments for this discussion
i cant really believe that it has become a discussion about wether the us is better han canada or not..
1 tip: read the first post of the thread, and get back to the point
for tiesto14:
some pages back you said that you had to bash those who are bashing your country, and you called them uneducated.. but
why are you falling down to their level if you think its so ings stupid to do it???
this means with other words that you think of yourself just as stupid as you think they are.. mmm sitting there calling yourself uneducated.. good one.
is it your duty to defend the us when someone are bashing it???
i dont think they have such "defense", so the only thing you actually are achieving is that ppl look at you as a huge fool. a fool who thinks he protects his country because he throws at those who talks about his country..
and so what if canada doesnt got any army?
having a large army only results with problems.. just look at the us.. ed up
nothing more to say about this..
its just too ridicilous
p a t h e t i c
| quote: | | everytime i hear about bush i get in a bad mood!!!! what's next? dance valley? cuz the bass sounded like shots |
hahahaha, i couldnt have said it better myself!! :D :D :D :D :D
btw
thumbs up to those who have used real arguments in the discussion, and not started with this -bashing!!
at least someone knows how to discuss w/o having to throw at the other part :) |
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| Renegade |
Alright, I'll try and keep this brief.
Firstly, Tiesto14, you need to stop taking things so personally. People in this discussion haven't (generally) been attacking American people, they have - as evil_bastard put it - been attacking US policy and that redneck president George Dubbya. If you take criticism of US foreign policy and of your president personally, then you have been brainwashed by a dangerous cult known as "American Patriotism". If you cannot criticise your country, or accept that your country, on the whole, may be at all imperfect, then you are no better than the terrorists: they just advocate a different form of fundamentalism to the one you do. Please try and analyse this situation objectively, and understand that when you see the widespread criticism of your country's economic and military policies, it may be for a real reason, not because we're all "jealous" or because it's "fun" to do so. There is a very serious threat to the world today, and it's not coming out of Afghanistan - it crawled out of some murky swamp in the southern states of the US, and currently has its hand on the button of the worlds largest miliary and nuclear arsenal.
Bin Laden doesn't scare me, George Bush does. And I think most of the people living outside of the US would agree with me.
| quote: | | we are all human. there are no innocents. |
So all the Afghans at the wedding were guilty of original sin and deserved to die? Same goes for the people in the WTC then?
| quote: | wtf ??? that's like saying "hello it's me america , leave everything u own behind you , it does no longer belong to you , get the outta here , go to a refugee camp , and die of starvation"
see why the world thinks america is sick ? |
Yes, good point actually, you remind me of something I read the other day.
The US, with its military involvements over the last decade or so, has created literally hundereds of thousands (possibly millions?) of rufugees, but has one of the smallest intakes of refugees in the world. By continually bombing Afghani infrastructure, the Americans are creating more refugees by the day, yet they make no effort whatsoever to accomodate them when they flee from the destruction. Australia is attempting to fill its quota of refugee intake (which admittedly, probably isn't enough) and as a way of dealing with the refugee crisis we have just had to build a $400 million detention centre to deal with the dailly tide of refugees who try to find sanctuary on our shores. Same with the UK - such was the influx of refugees since the Americans began their "war on terror" that they've had to start turning them back in the channel tunnel.
So why isn't the American government taking any refugees then? They feel that they have carte blanche to bomb the out of any country they feel like, but absolve themselves of any responsibility to house the homeless created by these actions? Am I the only one who finds that sort of policy evil?
| quote: | | No one person or one entity is perfect. In war there are always unintended civilian casualties. No matter how hard you try your going to up once in a while |
Which is exactly why the US should stop bombing Afghanistan.
The longer this goes on, the lesser the chance of catching/killing and terrorists, the greater the chance of murdering innocent civilians.
Oh, hang on, they're not innocent at all are they? All 4 million Afghanis are directly responsible for harbouring Osama Bin Laden, that was the logic wasn't it?
They're guilty terrorists by implication, so we shouldn't feel to bad if one or two die. Silly me. |
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| verminator |
*claps my hands for Renegade*
w0rd! |
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| fastmp3 |
Renegade , i'm speechless ... all i can say is : BIG UP to u , bravo and bravo !!
it's sad (but mostly IRRITATING) to see that the USA is a country built by crushing many nations and their populations , it's sad also to see that inside america it's all democratic and free (i doubt it now ... why Bush and not Gore ??) , but in the same time america is doing whatever it wants in the world , disrespecting the human rights , bribing dictators and politicians in the thirld world country so that these countries can't get a normal developping processus ... hence "the terrorism" and the hatred towards them ...
nowadays america is the strongest , leading every single domain (or almost), but don't forget that every nation , every empire , and every society has a down fall ... maybe not now for america , not in 50 years , not in 100 years , but don't worry it's coming , u can not avoid it :)
God bless america , you're gonna need it tust me on this one :D |
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| SNAFU_man |
from this morning's news:
"Afghans, U.S. probe bombing
Scores of Afghans were reported killed or wounded in a U.S. attack Monday. Click "Play" to see images of the victims brought to Mir Wais hospital in Kandahar, as AP's Robert Reid reports.
July 1 — NBC's Jim Miklaszewski reports on the U.S. explanation of Monday's bombing in Afghanistan that killed civilians.
MSNBC STAFF AND WIRE REPORTS
KANDAHAR, Afghanistan, July 2 — Afghan and U.S. officials headed to a central Afghan village on Tuesday to investigate reports that an American bomb killed up to 40 civilians. The U.S. military has confirmed that it bombed a village near Kandahar and “may have” killed civilians after its aircraft came under fire. Survivors said the warplanes attacked a wedding party, killing mostly women and children.
“WE ARE sending a team to investigate, to find out what happened,” said Tayyab Jawad, a spokesman for newly elected Afghan President Hamid Karzai.
U.S. Central Command, which is responsible for U.S. military operations in Afghanistan, said it was also sending a fact-finding team to determine what happened in Kakarak, in Uruzgan province, about 175 miles southwest of Kabul, the capital. It said news reporters would accompany the team.
CONFLICTING EARLY REPORTS
Initial reports of the incident conflicted. The Pentagon said the aircraft attacked a legitimate hostile target but suggested an errant bomb may have caused civilian casualties.
Bismullah, a province spokesman, said Afghans in Kakarak were firing weapons in the air during the wedding as is common in rural Afghanistan. He said about 40 people were killed and 70 others wounded.
But U.S. officials said a ground patrol had called in air support after feeling threatened by automatic weapon fire. The planes then met sustained and hostile fire that was not consistent with a wedding party.
“Normally when you think of celebratory fire — which is something that is not necessarily uncommon — it’s random, it’s sprayed. It’s not directed at a specific target,” U.S. military spokesman Col. Roger King said Tuesday at Bagram air base, the U.S. headquarters in Afghanistan, near Kabul. “In this instance the people on board the aircraft felt that the weapons were tracking them and that they were making a sustained effort to engage them.”
Noor Mohammed, leader of neighboring Gujran district, said Afghans were “upset because innocent people have died.”
Jawad said the Afghan fact-finding mission would also go to nearby Des Rawat, where the leader of the Taliban movement, Mullah Omar, once preached.
“Mullah Omar is not from here, but a long time ago he was in the Des Rawat mosque,” Noor Mohammed told The Associated Press in a telephone interview. “It is possible that some Taliban commanders may be hiding in the mountains around, but we haven’t seen anyone.”
A cache of weapons, most of them Soviet and Chinese made, were found by U.S. forces in Des Rawat a day before the assault on the village, King said. However, he denied Omar was a target.
The Central Command acknowledged in a statement issued from its headquarters in Tampa, Fla., that attacks by B-52 and AC-130 aircraft north of Kandahar “may have resulted in civilian casualties.”
“The United States expresses its deepest sympathies to those who have lost their loved ones,” King said.
VICTIMS AND SURVIVORS
He said four of the injured — all under 5 years old — were treated by U.S. forces.
In the southern city of Kandahar, where many of the victims were taken, Afghans said the attack began about 2 a.m. and lasted for about two hours. A nurse at the Kandahar hospital, Sher Mohammed, said he heard that about 120 people were killed.
On Monday, a source from the Afghan Ministry of Defense told NBC News that a U.S. bomb had killed at least 250 people at the wedding party; those numbers could not be confirmed, however.
Hospital officials said most of the dead and injured were women and children. One of the injured, a 6-year-old girl named Paliko, was brought to the hospital still wearing her party dress. Villagers said all members of her family were killed.
Another injured child, 7-year-old Malika, lost her mother, father, a brother and a sister, according to neighbors who brought her to the hospital.
“We have many children who are injured and who have no family,” nurse Mohammed Nadir said. “Their families are gone. The villagers brought these children and they have no parents. Everyone says that their parents are dead.”
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Afghan life better but still dangerous
July 1 — Months after the worst Taliban and al-Qaida elements were forced from power in Afghanistan, life still hangs in the balance somewhere between safe and unstable. NBC’s Mike Taibbi reports.
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Raaz Mohammad, an official in the governor’s office in the provincial capital of Tarin Kowt, said 40 people were killed.
“We have buried the bodies in Dehrawud ... including women and children,” he said.
“We ask the Americans to use more caution in their attacks,” he added.
The United Nations said it was helping to arrange a government convoy of emergency medical supplies and burn kits to Tarin Kowt, with the help of the World Health Organization and International Committee of the Red Cross.
U.S. ACTIVE IN REGION
Uruzgan, like most of east and south Afghanistan, is dominated by ethnic Pashtuns, which made up the core of the Taliban movement. Since the collapse of the Taliban ethnic Pashtuns have felt increasingly marginalized, targeted by minority ethnic groups, who dominate the government.
LATEST DEVELOPMENTS
THE HOME FRONT
• Report: Terror alert for July 4th
• Newsweek poll: Terror jitters
• Complete coverage
THE WAR ABROAD
• Errant U.S. bomb hits civilians
• U.S. builds up forces in Qatar
• Complete coverage
In these areas, where U.S. special forces and their coalition allies have focused their war against fugitive al-Qaida and Taliban elements, some villagers say they are being wrongly targeted for arrest or harassment as al-Qaida and Taliban suspects.
International human rights agencies have warned of increasing alienation of ethnic Pashtuns, warning it could sow the seeds of future conflicts.
In an interview last week, Karzai asked the U.S.-led coalition to be cautious following an earlier incident in which a compound was overrun by U.S. special forces, women were tied up — a strict taboo in conservative Muslim society — and a 3-year-old girl drowned in a well where she was hiding.
“I will definitely want the Afghan civilians, the Afghan villages to be immune from accidental damage,” Karzai said. “To be sure that they do not receive accidental firing at them. To make sure that our women and children and villages don’t suffer.”
NEARBY CAVES TARGETED
In Washington, Pentagon spokesman Lt. Cmdr. Jeff Davis said an Air Force B-52 bomber that attacked a cave complex in the same general area of Uruzgan province reported that one of its bombs went astray. Officials said they could not immediately determine where the errant bomb landed.
King said seven 2,000-pound bombs were dropped in the area.
He also said an Air Force AC-130 gunship also attacked anti-aircraft artillery in the same general area after coalition ground forces came under fire. Some of the anti-aircraft artillery could have fallen back to the ground and caused casualties, Davis said.
In Kandahar, one survivor, Abdul Qayyum, told reporters at the Mir Wais Hospital that after the attack, the Americans came to the area demanding to know “who fired on the helicopters.”
“I said ‘I don’t know’ and one of the soldiers wanted to tie my hands but someone said he is an old man and out of the respect they didn’t,” he said.
The injured also included Haji Mohammed Anwar, who Afghans said was a friend of Karzai’s and one of the first prominent local figures who rose up against the former Taliban regime.
The bombing occurred in the same province where U.S. special forces killed 21 Afghans when they stormed buildings in Khas Uruzgan village on Jan. 23 looking for al-Qaida and Taliban forces. The Pentagon later acknowledged that none of those killed were al-Qaida or Taliban, but Secretary of Defense Donald H. Rumsfeld cleared the Americans of any wrongdoing. "
it was an accident. i'm sure there is a cover-up to some extent..but,
if you're in a hostile land and there's gunfire near you how would you react?
so because america is this big "civilized", "moral" country, when push comes to shove, we have to abide by a different set of rules?
say you go walking in the woods. you sneak up on a sleeping bear, grab a log and smash the bear over the head with it. how do you think the bear will react? it'll probably tear the limbs off of what ever's nearby. and as you're running away, are you gonna stop and say "wait mister bear. it's not fair because you are bigger, and faster than me. also, you have these big claws and huge sharp teeth. and me having no natural defenses will have no chance against you. so could you not use your teeth and claws, and give me like an hour head start? huh? huh?" :nervous:
and would the bear discriminate between you or your friends who are nearby rofl at you antics/predicament?
and if you guys out there read this in a paper or hear about it through someone, which side would you be on?
wars suck.
the average american people don't want the military over there. we made our point, let's move on. but it does not mean we are going to forget nor belittle the men and women who are over there doing something that others don't want to face. but then somebody earlier mentioned that the u.s. doesn't do it's fair share of peacekeeping. so the u.s. has to initiate the counterstrikes, gather all intelligence data double checking for any friendlies or civies, coordinate bombing runs, taking out as much resistance as possible before committing ground troops. then stay awhile longer to get shot at and through some unforseen and unfortunate accidents have the whole world mad at you? after 9/11 didn't the whole world just hold it's breath to see what the u.s. would do? well we did what needed to be done. now people are crying foul, it's unfair? a red card??
please... we didn't start this, and we didn't set the rules.
and this crap about america deserves it? actually if you check my first reply, i said that america had it coming. and as sick as this may sound (and i apologize to anyone who knew any of the victims at the WTC) either that or something else like it had to happen to wake up the citizens of this country. (and no i am not for terrorism)
about the "innocents" thing. i didn't finish my thought. i meant to say we are all human and so we f***k up. but in times of war there are no innocents. because if you sit down and think about it, everyone has grievances, and so we're all innocent.
i don't have the statistics but how many immigrants do you take into your country every year? (honestly, i don't know, let's check and compare. compare how many refugees you've been taking in recently to how many people naturally immigrate to this country.) but then is't that what a civilized, upstanding country with higher values are supposed to do? take in and look after those less fortunate? you say america hasn't been doing it's fair share? |
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| sifntj0r |
hi.
| quote: | | Defense Ministry official Dr. Gulbuddin told Reuters: "More than 30 people were killed. It was a wedding ceremony and some of the participants were firing in the sky as part of the celebration. |
I don't get it, since when in civilised society do we 'fire into the sky' as a mark of celebration? And it sure as hell ain't no tribal ritual thing either. They may well have not meant any harm, but hey, the soldiers are out there, anyone who's not on their team and is carrying a weapon would be considered hostile. It's not like they're gonna walk up to the party and say 'yo are you friend or foe?' Before they would reach the 4th word they could well be dead. Also,
| quote: | | if someone killed your brother or sister on their wedding day, how would you feel? |
I bet his brother or sister and associated friends won't fire assault rifles into the sky when they walk down the aisile.
| quote: | | I meant that they are beginning to think that they are the only country in the world |
Can you prove this at all? This is just your opinion, and you've already made it clear enough that your opinion is biased(read: clouded) against the American Government because quote/unquote, "I've had it with George Bush". I'm guessing if say, England led the fight against the Taliban and this was all their doing, you'd make the same statement in the same context, only against England. You could of course argue the general arrogance of America, but that's too broad a generalisation.
| quote: | | PEOPLE attack your homeland?? what people? the starving kids in afghanistan?? they're not the ones attacking america. |
Come on, stop with the World Vision crap. How about you give me statistics of how many 'starving kids in afghanistan' have actually been killed by military fire. Not to mention, that the people in the WTC weren't attacking afghanistan either. The propoganda machine of the Taliban is at work, you'll probably see/read about how innocent 'women and children' are always being killed, never about the males (which are always killed too).
| quote: | | I shudder to think what would be said if the Sept. 11th tradegy happened to Canada. I just wonder... Would you still have the same thoughts? |
ing right on. Someone give the man a cookie. You all have this armchair perspective and are totally ignorant of the whole situation. And in fact I'll answer the mans question and say, no these ignorant wits would not have the same attitude. They'd be gung-ho, pitchforks in hand, ready and willing to do the job themselves, had it been their country or even someone they knew.
| quote: | | What you Americans should analyze is "why do so many people hate America" |
Everyone hates the topdog, they all wanna be where he is.
| quote: | | Yet the ground troops committed afterwards to pick up the pieces and do a little bit of nation-building were mostly foreign. |
Because everyone owes America money :P It's easier for them to say, 'go do this and we'll cancel out x amount of money you owe us. Oh and btw, anytime you need a helping hand with anything, give uncle sam a call.' Rather than waiting around for money which, for the most part, they probably won't see from some countries.
| quote: | | But... when JohnSmith starts a thread, and this time its the other way round, and its the afghanistan civilians are getting killed, all u can say is "its war PEOPLE DIE." |
It's all about intent. America is not intending to kill innocent civilians (if you believe otherwise, get a ing brain check NOW and don't make any babies, less this earth is infected with more retards). Al-Qaeda's intent was to kill civilians, and civilians died. America's intent is to destroy military(Al-Qaeda) targets/personnel and they do that, occaisionally, by accident, civilians die. Can you see the difference?
| quote: | | force people into slavery all over the world. |
Quit with the ing dramatics, wankers. ing hell, starving children, dead housewives, now slavery all over the world. What will it be next? Children die in the arms of housewives who were working their slave job? It's the economic problems of individual countries that force result in slavery. China sure as hell isn't forced by America into slavery, yet slavery in some instances still exist over there(and in other countries for that matter).
| quote: | | but do you mean, that you want the US to use nukes in this war? That would be stupiest idea I have ever heard |
Seeing as tiesto14 was responding to the text "War...its a silly game", and you suggested nukes, you could say that you called yourself stupid.
| quote: | | Bin Laden, Al Qaida and Saddam Hussein have bio-wapons and probably nuclear wapons too, do you want them to use it too?? |
No we don't want them to use them, which is why America must keeping bombing/probing and trying to find the said targets. It's also why America may well go after Saddam Hussein in the near future. But then I can't wait for the thread 'america shuld stay teh fark out of iray kthxbi'. Whats that?? Don't you all want the war to stop?? However you want them found?? I don't get it.
| quote: | | It's very easy to bull and criticize and badmouth a large, powerful country that is at war... |
Wise words!
| quote: | | To be truly succesful we (all the countrys affected by terror) need to think for the future not the present. Otherwise this wont end. |
That's why it can't end until they find bin laden and eliminate all terrorist cells. It can be done if there is patience.
| quote: | | Are you saying you were totally unaware of what's going OUTside America until 11th of september? |
How about you refresh us on what was going on, and what could have been possible pointers that the American public could have picked up, that Al-Qaeda were going to ram two aircraft into the WTC. You took tiesto14's statements out of context and into a broader scale, now bring em back into line and prove they were going to be attacked.
| quote: | earlier this morning i was talking to TTA , and i was telling him this :
"if i was brave enough , i swear to God i'd go and kill that of Bush , even if i have to get the death sentence or spend the rest of my life in jail , the whole world is gonna be thankful to me , even the europeans and all the third world countries will try to reduce my sentence".
and i'm damn serious , too bad i don't have the guts to do it i hope someone else will do that for all of us |
Let's hope you and your parter(or future partner(s)) are infertile, people like you aren't fit enough to bring children into the world to nuture. Btw, we're all awe of just how tough you appear to be.
| quote: | | If you bomb a country without intent to kill innocent people and you DO kill innocent people, shouldn't you be going back to the drawing board and rethinking your strategy? |
More damage has been done to military targets/personnel than innocent civilians. In fact I believe Australian SASR troops have killed 300+ al-qaeda soldiers without a single fatality against us. I think we lead the kill count of the ground forces. Why? Because our troops are the best trained in the world. Proven in folklore as far back as Gallipoli and recently Kosovo, East Timor and now Afghanistan.
Oh you are just so blase in your thinking. Please, enclose further strategies in finding bin laden, then muster up some courage to actually carry out the act, then come back telling us how easy it is.
ok and i can't be ed writing anymore, i've finished up to page 4 and i might do more tomorrow. Overall
-civilian casualties = bad, but unavoidable.
-Israel and Palestine are likely to continue screwing each other until there is nothing left.
-Everyone is quite happy to bag america for what it's doing, but I don't think they or their country could do a better job.
-Everyone is an armchair expert at foreign policy. |
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