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The Pacific (pg. 14)
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| MGT |
| quote: | Originally posted by idoru
Who said anything about public figures? I'm talking about "normal" people, not people who are in the spotlight. But, this debate will get really nasty if I continue, so I'm just going to let you continue jerking off to this thread.
Have a nice day. |
If you want to talk, talk. I have no problem with you or anyone expressing their views. Don't just assume that I fit into your stereotype. |
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| idoru |
| It's kind of hard, when the only posts I've ever seen from you have consisted of you whining about racism. |
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| MGT |
| lol What do you want to know? |
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| EddieZilker |
| quote: | Originally posted by MGT
I just feel that some of the issues are the cause of blindly antagonizing rather than basing on facts. In reality, many things are not as clear cut or black and white. This goes for any country. |
Look. China has two ways to deal with their problems. One is that they face them openly. The other is to continue to be a closed society. Because there are so many issues, and so many decisions being handled by a number of people in any society, in addition to the fact that China is rapidly changing as an emerging power on the stage; encountering some of this change not on a time table of its choosing, it's natural for there to be a bifurcation in the way many things are handled.
What I deplore, be it, here in the United States, or elsewhere is the willful obfuscation of the truth. Both countries engage in a fair amount of duplicity. For what its worth, I believe that the worst lie of the twenty-first century was uttered by Colin Powell at the UN in the prelude to the second Iraq War. I like Colin Powell. I legitimately believe he thought he was telling the truth - or some form of the truth. Unfortunately, he told a lie and one which has helped propel the United States into concession of the moral high-ground. The harm it has caused in Iraq was something that, in 2003, I would have considered unfathomable.
But, here's the difference, between you and I. I don't show up in a forum and ask, "Why the hate?" I know the answer to that question and if one of these foreigners, here, wants to give me a hard time about my country, well, chances are I'm educated enough about most topics to speak to him or her about it.
Your whole attitude seems to be, well, yeah, but it's water under the bridge. No big deal. Why the grudge? Where-as mine is, yeah, we ed some up and I know I can't fix it but I'm sure as hell going to ing acknowledge that it happened and that harm did occur. I make it a point to know as much of the truth as possible when I speak to these issues. I know who I am and where I'm from.
That doesn't seem to be the case, with you. You seem to think that China should have respect, regardless of what its done, and while I do give it respect, there is an entitlement implicit in your remarks and omissions from them - where you have to be prodded in order to acknowledge - yes - that DID happen...
BUT...
Then you speak to the Tienanmen Square Massacre...
Have you read Chairman Mao on Guerrilla Warfare?
You're saying some things that just don't make a whole lot of sense. I am assuming that you have read a book by Mao, correctly, am I not. Let's say that you have. You see, I'm willing to bet that those protesters had read it too. I mean, they're college educated, right? Here they are, having a pretty big demonstration, but then, you maintain that some people started throwing bottles filled with gasoline - a common guerrilla weapon - it's also used in riots, but, personally, I don't think that a group of students are that ing stupid.
Particularly when Chairman Mao would have dictated that then was not the time for such tactics. He advocated the use of time and space and an elastic ing time line, but here you are, telling me that the pogrom in question was triggered by an event having to do with not just one tactical mistake on the part of the trouble-makers, but a series of incompetent blunders made by the authorities, themselves.
It just doesn't make any sense unless the command of the soldiers had read Mao, too. You see, what I think happened, is that they just wanted to crush the pending rebellion, then and there, and militarily it made sense, rather than letting a nascent rebellion foment to include the space and time where the Chinese Government could no longer contain it, they, instead, chose to squash it, right then and right there - with essentially all the players in one location and they wouldn't have to deal with protracted military engagement against an enemy who would have had them dead to rights in ten to fifteen years.
Your explanation makes sense if you're five, junior, but I ain't five years old. |
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| MGT |
You're putting words in my mouth again.
I posted the "why the hate" post because I genuinely want to know the reasoning behind people who hate and how would anyone know the reasoning without asking.
In regards to your "Tienanmen Square Massacre", what you've written is a presumption. Again, I'm not speaking for China or any country or anyone but myself; what I've written is from what I've heard from the locals when I was in China. I didn't say a group of students threw gasoline filled bottles. I said trouble makers. They could be criminals, gangsters, anyone. |
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| EddieZilker |
| quote: | Originally posted by MGT
In regards to your "Tienanmen Square Massacre", what you've written is a presumption. Again, I'm not speaking for China or any country or anyone but myself; what I've written is from what I've heard from the locals when I was in China. I didn't say a group of students threw gasoline filled bottles. I said trouble makers. They could be criminals, gangsters, anyone. |
It makes no sense for anyone to do that. Do you understand? No one, in their right mind, would do that. What you're reporting is propaganda. And, it's not that I'm putting words in your mouth.
You're just leaving such a gaping wound in your logic that one could drive a tank through it. |
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| MGT |
| quote: | Originally posted by MGT
I just feel that some of the issues are the cause of blindly antagonizing rather than basing on facts. In reality, many things are not as clear cut or black and white. This goes for any country. |
Oops, meant to include after this "I just feel that some of the issues are the cause of blindly antagonizing rather than basing on facts" that [that is the reason why I'm posting and asking the question].
I agree that open dialogue is key to moving forward and I appreciate the civil dialogue so far. |
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| MGT |
| quote: | Originally posted by EddieZilker
It makes no sense for anyone to do that. Do you understand? No one, in their right mind, would do that. What you're reporting is propaganda. And, it's not that I'm putting words in your mouth.
You're just leaving such a gaping wound in your logic that one could drive a tank through it. |
Aside from your witty writing, what makes no sense about some people starting trouble in a protest? |
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| R.j. |
| For 's sake, this thread is aboot The Pacific, even if it is a ty series thus far! |
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| EddieZilker |
| quote: | Originally posted by R.j.
For 's sake, this thread is aboot The Pacific, even if it is a ty series thus far! |
If it weren't for WWII, we probably wouldn't be having this conversation about China, right now. /douche |
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| leph555 |
| quote: | Originally posted by MGT
Aside from your witty writing, what makes no sense about some people starting trouble in a protest? |
plz remove the American Flag from your profile, FOX would not approve :o
oh and plz don't send a death squad after me |
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