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Gareth Emery: 95% of Trance is Cheesy Bollocks (pg. 9)
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| SYSTEM-J |
| quote: | Originally posted by Axolotyl
Because trance used to be about innovation and pushing the limits of sound and synthesis. It was also about taking you on a mental journey or sorts. Somehow all this really important stuff has been handed over to psy and progressive and well... trance just seems to be about making grown men cry with beautiful lyrics and tracks that sound a lot like shampoo commercials. It also really desperately wants to be electro or house now by most indications and has this ing stupid desire to be played to people in stadiums. |
That doesn't answer the question at all.
Techno. House. Jungle. Hardcore. All of these we define by the sounds. Why is it that trance is increasingly being fought over because of whether or not it "entrances"? Why must trance fulfill certain vague criteria that have nothing to do with the instruments, effects or techniques used? Why is minimal techno or ambient house not entrancing? |
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| torontotrance |
| I think GTR forgot to include that 95% of his stuff is cheesy crap :stongue: |
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| isoterra |
| quote: | Originally posted by DJ Intrigue
Because trance is the only genre that takes itself so seriously in regards to being some sort of magical "sent-from-the-heavens" type of music that takes you to the highest highs of euphoria, and unfortunately with that predisposed outlook, the music in itself tries too hard to provide this so-called "ethereal spirituality" that the main focus of the music is shifted into this type of falsified mindset which many people don't seem to realize. |
see... i'm really not seeing that. sure, some of the LISTENERS may take it too seriously and base their lives around the emotions triggered by that kind of music but that isn't the fault of the music itself. i personally can't see anything remotely tryhard about music which not only uses really basic musical & technical composition techniques, but revolves around a done-to-death formula with little variation.
the way see it, trance is simply music that can both make you dance, and give you a euphoric rush. none of this spiritual bs... there's really nothing ethereal nor spiritual about an alternating major/minor chord sequence and a off big supersaw riff/snareroll buildup/whatever. thus i'm really not down with the whole view that it takes itself too seriously.
mind saying that, i'm on about a specific type of 'trance'. namely the energetic driving ~140bpm sort with the big breakdowns, big riffs & big buildups... the kind i produce. maybe you're on about the less in-your-face asot/gdjb/mcproggy type.. which i can't really speak for so well. |
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| isoterra |
| quote: | Originally posted by torontotrance
I think GTR forgot to include that 95% of his stuff is cheesy crap :stongue: |
list it. |
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| torontotrance |
| quote: | Originally posted by isoterra
list it. |
Well you knew with me around that some smartass comment would come but if I list it, this will start a major flame war and someone will get canned and that's not fair to the idiots, is it? |
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| isoterra |
| quote: | Originally posted by torontotrance
Well you knew with me around that some smartass comment would come but if I list it, this will start a major flame war and someone will get canned and that's not fair to the idiots, is it? |
with you around? LOL, i'd have replied with the same retort to anyone posting such an inane comment, don't flatter yourself. besides reading a few posts by you i don't even know you :conf:
i'm actually genuinely intrigued as to what is 'cheesy' about his recent productions & sets, over the past 6-12 months. call them uninspiring, dull, forgettable or whatever... but from what i've seen he's made a credible effort to steer away from the old trance formula & push the sound into a deeper territory.
infact i don't get why he's getting so much stick for saying what he said; people outside the trance scene have been saying it for years... i'd have thought someone *within* the scene saying it would get a rapture of applause from those outside. he obviously wants to change the state of trance... regardless of what he's produced in the past. |
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| Spirit5 |
| I want to be done with this debate. It seems like I'm going to go nowhere with it. These threads always seem to have me repeating my same old speil about the emotional attachment trance has and it's profound effect on the listener. But none of this will stop me from having this connection to it, in this sense, because it's how i've enjoyed it, how i've come to know it and appreciate it over the years, and not right it off as simply "dance music" or just "music" in general, but thats all "taking it too seriously" or "thinking too deeply about it" even though I have no idea how someone cannot think such tracks as "3579 KM", "Lullaby" or "Astra" by Kalafut & Fygle, "Affinity (Thrillseekers Dub)" by Hydra, "Sweetest Dreams (Ferry Corsten Remix)" by Corderoy, or almost any of Mark Otten's tracks are not "Spiritual" or "Euphoric", or any of those feelings they emit (are Unworldy and I the only people who thinks this way of this in this music? or does this stuff just sound this way for the hell of it?), or is this stuff just all "fluffy garbage" as some people seem to think of it as just because it's not that mean, deep, super hypnotic or funky (it's quite deep stuff to me though). I'm not trying to get everything "my way" rather what I try to do on this forum is enlighten people on this aspect of the music that is there in the sound and feel of it, and I hope to meet others who appreciate it as this as well. If I never get anywhere ever on this and it's simply a lost cause, then i'll either find another forum or stop participating in these forums all together. I've been into this stuff for years, but I was always hesitant to actually sign up and participate in this stuff, considering my difference in how I view this music and experience it. I'm not a partier, clubber or any of those things, I am just someone whose enjoyed this stuff for a long time and haven't given up on it yet, but i've evolved a bit sure. Thats it...goodnight. |
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| DJ Intrigue |
| quote: | Originally posted by isoterra
see... i'm really not seeing that. sure, some of the LISTENERS may take it too seriously and base their lives around the emotions triggered by that kind of music but that isn't the fault of the music itself. i personally can't see anything remotely tryhard about music which not only uses really basic musical & technical composition techniques, but revolves around a done-to-death formula with little variation.
the way see it, trance is simply music that can both make you dance, and give you a euphoric rush. none of this spiritual bs... there's really nothing ethereal nor spiritual about an alternating major/minor chord sequence and a off big supersaw riff/snareroll buildup/whatever. thus i'm really not down with the whole view that it takes itself too seriously.
mind saying that, i'm on about a specific type of 'trance'. namely the energetic driving ~140bpm sort with the big breakdowns, big riffs & big buildups... the kind i produce. maybe you're on about the less in-your-face asot/gdjb/mcproggy type.. which i can't really speak for so well. |
But it does take itself too seriously. I mean, come on, you honestly don't see the enormous amount of cocksucking the trance dj's get and how they are worshipped on the highest pedestals like they are some sort of religous profit and can do no wrong? You honestly don't see how sap-happy many (not all, of course) trance listeners get when they talk about all of this "so-called" spiritual and out-of-body euphoria, almost as if they are a little bit too wrapped up and feel the need to over-emphasize their emotions because wow, it's trance, the music from another world? You honestly don't see how trance gets so involved with this aspect that less emphasis is placed on the actual music and innovation, but rather placed upon what it does, or what it is supposed to do or not do (like SYSTEM-J said)?
The other dance genres don't act like this, nor do they try to act all high and mighty either like they are trying to hard to do something or force you to feel a certain way like above. Trance does this, and in my perception, it is very apparent, especially after reading many of the posts on here and on other dance music message boards. I just think that trance has become its own worst enemy and has also become gimmicky to an extent because of this.
I personally dislike trance, mainly because I value different things in the music I listen to other than what is found in the trance genres. So, it's all about house/techno/downtempo for me. However, house is more casual and laid-back with emphasis on chilling and having a good time, rather than the constant "must have that fast-paced euphoric rush, must feel like I'm flying in space" seriousness of trance.
Again, that's just me, so read into it what you want. |
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| Axolotyl |
| quote: | Originally posted by SYSTEM-J
That doesn't answer the question at all.
Techno. House. Jungle. Hardcore. All of these we define by the sounds. Why is it that trance is increasingly being fought over because of whether or not it "entrances"? Why must trance fulfill certain vague criteria that have nothing to do with the instruments, effects or techniques used? Why is minimal techno or ambient house not entrancing? |
Well I wasnt trying to answer your question, just blurting out my over inflated opinion like everyone else in this thread.
All good EDM is based around musical innoation and thes ones you've listed obviosly have iconic sounds that define them aswell as techniques that define the genre. What I'm talking about is synthesis exploration. Trance used to be very heavy synthetic music, in your face, raw and futuristic sounding. It still innovates in sound to some small degree, but for the most part I think its rested on a handfull of popular and well polished techniques that work well in a commercial sense.
Personally I dont give a about wether it 'entrances' or 'uplifts' or 'hypnotises'. Only if the track takes me on a journey through a multitude of sonic landscapes woven together well. If it the synths talk to me, then I'm happy. The ammount of trance tunes that do that these days are in the minority. |
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| Spirit5 |
I'm not a part of the club scene so I don't go and experience this type of stuff. I am merely coming from this on my own basis, as having this music being a theraputic thing for me at least and wanting to share it with others. I see it as a story, and I find a story within the music, and I wish to share that story with other people. No different than making someone a card or making someone some cookies. I know stupid analogy but as rock does stuff for certain people, new age music does, christian music does, gospel, r&b whatever, trance does certain things for listeners to.
Some people appreciate different vibes, different feels. If yours is just chilling and having a good time, sure, but I like that with trance to. I just sit there and listen to a good trance tune and lay back and just forget about stressful stuff and all that stuff.
Music affects people in different ways, and we all should just realize that. If music had no affect, then it would just be sounds with no meaning, and that takes the human element out of it. One of the things I've liked about trance versus techno, is trance seems to have a much more "human" element to it, even though it is quite "other worldy" in it's scope, it's feel, it's sounds. But it brings warmth, it brings the sense that it's more than just a beat with sounds, it's got an actual human warmth, it's got emotion in it. I don't see anything wrong with that, if only there were more trance that had natural emotion, rather than theatrics, and that is what I talked about in some of my earlier posts.
I wish it was less about this big gigantic euphoric rush, rather a more gentle, almost melancholy feel, as with some of Chicane's old stuff, Kalafut & Fygle's stuff, Hydroid's, some of Alucard's stuff, some of Probspot's, Mark Otten's, some of Micro de Govia's...almost like Ulrich Schnauss but faster, more dancey. That would be perfect... |
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| SYSTEM-J |
| For 's sake man- learn how to use paragraphs! |
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| stealthman |
"95% of Trance is Cheesy Bollocks"
I somehow agree to that statement, the classics never die. Go old-school. :p |
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