Originally posted by Lews
I'm not pro-Israel and I'm not pro-Palestine. I wish they would both get along together peacefully.
OMG, so am I! Except I'm anti-Israel and anti-Palestine, and would rather see them come up with a third secular country where Palestinians and Israelis could coexist with one less problem to care about (namely, religion).
Which I think pretty much amounts to the same thing you said :p
aNYthing
quote:
Originally posted by Lews
No nation that did the same would be justified, in my opinion. Israel, Russia, U.S.A., Germany, Australia, whatever. Any country that attacks an aid convoy deserves to be condemned for that.
Often in these situations (involving Israel and Palestine) Israel claims what you just did. That anyone else would be justified, but people are just picking on Israel. Maybe that's true, maybe that's not. I don't know all the facts, so I'm not going to judge. I was probably a bit over the top saying Israel is insane, but I feel that sometimes they do go a bit overboard.
I'm not pro-Israel and I'm not pro-Palestine. I wish they would both get along together peacefully.
Lews, so do I - I mourn loss of innocent lives on either side and I think Israel is no angel. I was very dismayed at Israel's use of illegal weapons in a conflict few years ago. Yet, I think this incedent was a clear provocation to destabilize situation. There was hardly any other purpose behind it.
It's one thing if the idiots on flotilla were standing around with rose bouquettes, waiting for IDF - but they were waiting with weapons. They wanted it to turn out this way - and they succeeded. Israel took a literal troll bait. No matter how it turned out - it was a no win situation for Israel.
The so-called humanitarians had number of alternatives to get aid to Gaza. They chose most provocative and most confrontational route. I don't condone use of force against civilians. However, I do understand use of force against idiots that knew what was coming if they pursued this path. It's not like they weren't warned. They had an option to turn around and they had an option to dock. They had number of other options - they chose the one that would result in exactly the outcome they were hoping to achieve. In that, they succeeded.
It's unfortunate but I even understand Iran when they arrest and put on trial 3 american idiots who tresspassed into their borders. You know the consequences and if you take the risk - you have to bear the brunt of the outcome.
Imagine you get pulled over by a cop - what do you think would happen if you charged him with a baseball bat or a knife? What if cop warned you and you ignored the warnings?What jury would convict the cop of wrongful doing, given these circumstances?
Let's be real here.
Lews
quote:
Originally posted by Lira
Thanks :)
OMG, so am I! Except I'm anti-Israel and anti-Palestine, and would rather see them come up with a third secular country where Palestinians and Israelis could coexist with one less problem to care about (namely, religion).
Which I think pretty much amounts to the same thing you said :p
Pretty much :p
Marcus Summers
quote:
Originally posted by aNYthing
It's unfortunate but I even understand Iran when they arrest and put on trial 3 american idiots who tresspassed into their borders. You know the consequences and if you take the risk - you have to bear the brunt of the outcome.
3 American spies, you mean.
Matt Es
aNYthing
quote:
Originally posted by Marcus Summers
3 American spies, you mean.
whatever. You trespass the border, you deserve to get arrested - regardless of your intentions. Benign or otherwise. Everything else is secondary.
Why does everyone make it so complicated - if it says "DO NOT ENTER" - THAT MEANS "DO NOT MOTHERING ENTER" End of story. You enter, you deserve the 40 lbs of ass rape that's headed your way.
aNYthing
quote:
Originally posted by Comrade Stalin
I applaud any attempt to end the prison state that is the Gaza Strip. Wasn't Hamas voted into power? Oh, that's right, democracy only works if the people vote the "right" way.
Comrade Stalin, what exactly do you mean by "democracy"? AFAIK, in Soviet Russia democracy votes for you.
Lira
quote:
Originally posted by aNYthing
whatever. You trespass the border, you deserve to get arrested - regardless of your intentions. Benign or otherwise. Everything else is secondary.
Why does everyone make it so complicated - if it says "DO NOT ENTER" - THAT MEANS "DO NOT MOTHERING ENTER" End of story. You enter, you deserve the 40 lbs of ass rape that's headed your way.
Agreed, but there is something else here: there's a mothering "country" locked in there (mind the quotation marks). If South Africa closed its ports to all ships carrying goods for Lesotho, and some people decided to make their way through so they could reach those marooned in a land surrounded by a (potential) enemy, there would be a very similar commotion.
Abercrombie
Another Israeli mistake: don't bring paint ball guns to reason with armed "peacefull" protesters that want to kill you.
It must have been the Canadian human shield who tought them to club the soldiers like seal pups.
aNYthing
quote:
Originally posted by fayraree
Well, for some reason the rest of the planet is condemning it. Just sayin'.
Please point me to a time when the rest of the planet actually stuck up for Jews. Oh, that's right. I forgot. We killed your "savior". Our bad. Some fairy tale written 2000 years ago is an accurate historical representation of the facts and ZOMG, Jesus was real. Not only that, mofo didn't need water skiis - he could walk on the bitch, barefooted.
He also brought back from the dead other zombies, beside himself. Not only that, any kunt that can turn water to wine is an instant party favorite. No wonder so many got pissed off when he was crucified. Oh wait, he's as real as Santa or Easter Bunny. Damn. Oh well, still good enough for a reason to hate the Jews.
Keep on hatin' on.
Jake Benson
Hay guys I have an idea. Let's dress up a bunch of Muslim fighters as "peace activist" and bypass all Israeli laws by floating ships into Gaza. But we're peaceful activists so when Israel invade our blatant disrespect for their laws we'll just stab them, start fights, and then act like we're victims again YAY!
Seriously you guys think these were peace activists? Look at the ing videos. These were not peaceful activists. What do you expect Israeli soldiers to do when they get beat and stabbed? Just stand there? If this were the US invading a "peaceful" ship "sending aid" after it said no it has to go through the US first, they'd ing bomb the out of those ships if not everyone up on it.
Hey, let's try this in other countries. Let's take a ship to RUSSIA to give "aid" to some minority group. At the same time let's film ourselves saying "We'll overcome Russia we're warriors YARRRRR!" Nevermind the Russian laws that state that supplies have to go through CUSTOMS first for inspection. Because we're "activists" so we can go wherever we want and bypass laws, and especially stab any Russians that come on the ship without expecting any ramifications whatsoever.
No. It doesn't work that way.
aNYthing
quote:
Originally posted by Lira
Agreed, but there is something else here: there's a mothering "country" locked in there (mind the quotation marks). If South Africa closed its ports to all ships carrying goods for Lesotho, and some people decided to make their way through so they could reach those marooned in a land surrounded by a (potential) enemy, there would be a very similar commotion.
Lira, that's blantantly incorrect and ignorant. They were given an option to have the aid delivered to Gaza - but not themselves. They chose not to take that as an option.
If I decided to put a gang of idiots and take them to your country's shore and declare ourselves humanitarians - what chance do I stand of sending whatever I brought along with me past your border patrol if my intent was to provide humanitarian aid to a group your government has classifed (and has proven itself) as hostile to the government? Seriously.
Of all people, I'd imagine you would see the difference here.
Again, using the same analogy - they were NOT STANDING AROUND with camcorders and flower bouquettes and some Peanut Butter & Jelly sandwiches, waiting for IDF. They did not turn around, they did not dock, they took no other option offered via peaceful means.
They had a point either provoke or de-legimatise Israeli government. Let's not debate the blokade here - they did not say "our intention is to break the blockade". They said - "we want to bring aid to Gaza". They were given the means to get aid to Gaza - they found that insufficient. What other outcome did you or anyone else expect? Especially after attacking the IDF that has warned them?
Let it sink in - they were warned, they knew what they were doing. Everyone else wants to ignore the rest, they just want to focus on a result.
If you don't want burns, don't stick your hand in a fire. If you stick your hand in a fire, don't be surprised to get burned.
It is AS SIMPLE as that. Look at bigger picture, I know you're capable of that.
