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A Plea for Religion (pg. 7)
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| Redd |
| quote: | Originally posted by srussell0018
I agree that certain interpretations of them do.
Edit: And therein lies the point. The books themselves do not command anything. People's wills do. People choose to follow the scriptures. People choose to act violently. It's not the words written on paper that causes this. It's either people's interpretations of them, or it's people using them as justification for what they already have a predisposition to do (as Eddie has been explaining). |
Yes but they choose to do so because they've been brainwashed to think what's in the books is the truth and all that. |
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| Redd |
| quote: | Originally posted by DJ Itchy
Touche. (Sort of) Nevertheless, my comment is still on point. Such a waste of words. Why use ten when one will do? |
Your point is we are using too many words? Eddie never uses many words. |
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| EddieZilker |
| quote: | Originally posted by Redd
What I believe is that these selfish needs you're talking about often come from being raised believing there is a god. Take the tribe setting I mentioned earlier; the chief has an agenda and it involves taking land from a neighboring tribe. He tells his tribe that their god will kill their babies if they don't conquer this land for him. The tribe then see it as their selfish needs to do exactly that. If they didn't think their babies were in danger, they most likely wouldn't do what he said.
I might be total ape wrong here though, psychology isn't my strongest field. I've heard good things about that book before, maybe I'll get to in some day. |
I was going to reply to this but it seems like you understand my points and I'm pretty sure I understand yours. If I can think of anything to say, I will, but I'm content to leave it here. |
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| srussell0018 |
| quote: | Originally posted by Redd
Yes but they choose to do so because they've been brainwashed to think what's in the books is the truth and all that. |
I was raised Catholic. I don't want to kill anybody. If what you're saying is true, all people of all religions should all have the same interpretation of their holy texts. If not, then it has to be something at least partly intrinsically motivated, and not commanded to them by their religion. |
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| Redd |
| quote: | Originally posted by srussell0018
I was raised Catholic. I don't want to kill anybody. If what you're saying is true, all people of all religions should all have the same interpretation of their holy texts. If not, then it has to be something at least partly intrinsically motivated, and not commanded to them by their religion. |
I never meant to suggest that everyone raised a christian or muslim or whatever wants to kill people. And I don't see how what I wrote would mean everyone should have the same interpretation. People are different, and most people won't do these things. |
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| srussell0018 |
| quote: | Originally posted by Redd
I never meant to suggest that everyone raised a christian or muslim or whatever wants to kill people. And I don't see how what I wrote would mean everyone should have the same interpretation. People are different, and most people won't do these things. |
You're right. You're dancing around the points that go against what you're trying to say lol. The vast majority of religious people don't kill anyone in the name of their religion. The vast majority of people in general don't kill anyone for any reason. What's the common denominator? There are some people who kill people without any religious motivations at all. Suggesting that none of the suicide bombers would kill people had it not been for their interpretation of a religion is quite the hypothetical.
Ultimately the point you're trying to make (I think) is that religions makes people, or at least motivate people to commit heinous acts. The reality of it (again, I think) is that people commit heinous acts of their own volition, and justify it with religion. Their misguided justification doesn't necessarily have anything to do with the actual teachings of those religions. |
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| Redd |
| quote: | Originally posted by srussell0018
You're right. You're dancing around the points that go against what you're trying to say lol. The vast majority of religious people don't kill anyone in the name of their religion. The vast majority of people in general don't kill anyone for any reason. What's the common denominator? There are some people who kill people without any religious motivations at all. Suggesting that none of the suicide bombers would kill people had it not been for their interpretation of a religion is quite the hypothetical.
Ultimately the point you're trying to make (I think) is that religious makes people, or at least motivates people to commit heinous acts. The reality of it (again, I think) is that people commit heinous acts of their own volition, and justify it with religion. Their misguided justification doesn't necessarily have anything to do with the actual teachings of those religions. |
If I'm dancing I'm not doing it on purpose.
No not necessarily, but it happens, when it could have been avoided. Sure, there are people who would have done whatever they do regardless of what their justification is. But, as long as there are people who wouldn't have done it without religion, my point still stands.
Man I suck at getting across my points in English. Chances are I'm just as bad in Norwegian. Oh how I want to be good at this. |
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| srussell0018 |
| quote: | Originally posted by Redd
No not necessarily, but it happens, when it could have been avoided. Sure, there are people who would have done whatever they do regardless of what their justification is. But, as long as there are people who wouldn't have done it without religion, my point still stands.
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Some people kill for political motivations. Do you suggest we abolish politics because some people use it as a justification for murder?
How about abolishing the diamond trade? It is responsible for far more deaths than religion after all. |
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| Redd |
| quote: | Originally posted by srussell0018
Some people kill for political motivations. Do you suggest we abolish politics because some people use it as a justification for murder?
How about abolishing the diamond trade? It is responsible for far more deaths than religion after all. |
We need politics to keep the society going. I don't think we need religion (see prior posts on how religion was needed before but not any more to the same extent).
Definitely for abolishing the diamond trade. The only diamonds we need in industry etc. we can manufacture. |
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| Redd |
HANG ON WAS THAT A TRICK QUESTION?
Ok here is my counter! Yes abolish it as it works now. The way it's run is clearly ed up. The countries obviously need the money it accumulates, but that industry is rotten to the core. |
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| Redd |
| What I don't understand here is how Nou is getting shat on by everyone when he posts, when his posts are vastly better than mine :conf: |
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