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Religious debate on Jews/Passion of the Christ (pg. 19)
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| tranceaholic |
| anuneventrade: i wonder what u believe in..u seem so against religion, and in one post u r not atheist..whats ur belifs...others: it is understandable that u r atheists but i dont understand why u seem obsessed to be against religion,making fun of religion,attacking it,making fun of religious people so on n so on,whats wrong with havin faith,values and beliving in a higher power n goal,seems fine to me..i am not asking u to believe in it, i am just askin u to have some respect..and like someone said begin ur post with i think,we cant prove to a 100% the existance of god,u cannot prove to a 100% that he doesnt exist,u guys act that all u say is written in stone..to sum up show some respect to others and dont be so cocky..i can think of millions of ways for witty comebacks against atheists but i do respect ur opinion and so i wouldnt..thank u, rant over.. |
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| anuneventrade |
| quote: | Originally posted by tranceaholic
anuneventrade: i wonder what u believe in..u seem so against religion, and in one post u r not atheist..whats ur belifs...others: it is understandable that u r atheists but i dont understand why u seem obsessed to be against religion,making fun of religion,attacking it,making fun of religious people so on n so on,whats wrong with havin faith,values and beliving in a higher power n goal,seems fine to me..i am not asking u to believe in it, i am just askin u to have some respect..and like someone said begin ur post with i think,we cant prove to a 100% the existance of god,u cannot prove to a 100% that he doesnt exist,u guys act that all u say is written in stone..to sum up show some respect to others and dont be so cocky..i can think of millions of ways for witty comebacks against atheists but i do respect ur opinion and so i wouldnt..thank u, rant over.. |
I'm not against religion in the least. However, I think that if an individual wants to present an argument, they need to at least give the basis of their argument, with the facts relevant to it. My sarcastic comments are simply to those that are contradictory with their claims, and to those that make absurd statements. I have a problem with certain religions. :D
| quote: | Originally posted by squirrelly
I think there were many people in history that were wiser than others that were mistakenly given the title of the son of God, or God's messenger (aka Jesus, Krishna, Buddha among others). By speaking of peace and being wiser than their years, they were given a "Godly" appearance since most were not highly educated during their times.
I think Jesus was a real person. Was he the son of God? No. Did he come back to life? No. Do I believe in God? I believe there is a higher being.
This is the extreemely briefed version of my belief system. Perhaps I will get more into it when I am more awake and less stressed. :) |
| quote: | Originally posted by squirrelly
There is a higher being that guides us through life. There is no form, nor temple/church that you must go to in order to "prove" your belief. It is in everything and is everywhere. Through your decisions in life you have Karma. Life is to educate yourself and to be filled with joy. Once this life has ended I will move on to another to be educated further until my soul has completed it's course, and finds ultimate peace.
I know I am protected and I feel calm with my beliefs.
But I also give props to any other person's religious preference, or non preference. I don't think it's fair to try and force your particular belief upon others. If someone doesn't agree with what I think, fine, that's great. :) |
| quote: | Originally posted by squirrelly
I believe he was an actual person, but not the son of God. His "rising" after his death seems ficticious to me. I don't understand what sort of significance there might be with someone rising after three days only to die/disappear again.
I think that he, along with others throughout history (as aforementioned, Krishna, Buddha, etc..) were quite intelligent people, and considering the education levels that were among commoners at the time, their "revalations" seemed extraordinary. Humans lived among earth for a long time before someone came along and said "Thou shalt not kill". Was it really necessary to have it "etched in stone" so to speak? Do we really have such a low confidence in our own species that we think that without the verbalization of such a "commandment" we wouldn't be able through instinct to not kill?
The bible is missing quite a few years of Jesus' life, (I think from ages 18-32 or something of the sort) and that irks me.
I don't believe in this nonsense of Noah's arc etc etc. I just think it was used as a fairy tale to tell little children in an attempt to get them to not sin.
The bible, imho, is blown out of proportion.
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| quote: | Originally posted by squirrelly
Maharshi: That bliss of the Self is always with you, and you will find it for yourself, if you would seek it earnestly. The cause of your misery is not in the life outside you, it is in you as the ego. You impose limitations on yourself and then make a vain struggle to transcend them. All unhappiness is due to the ego; with it comes all your trouble. What does it avail you to attribute to the happenings in life the cause of misery which is really within you? What happiness can you get from things extraneous to yourself? When you get it, how long will it last?
If you would deny the ego and scorch it by ignoring it, you would be free. If you accept it, it will impose limitations on you and throw you into a vain struggle to transcend them. To be the Self that you really are is the only means to realise the bliss that is ever yours.
Sri Ramana Maharshi: There is no reaching the Self. If Self were to be reached, it would mean that the Self is not here and now, and it is yet to be obtained. What is got afresh will also be lost. So it will be impermanent. What is not permanent is not worth striving for. So I say the Self is not reached. You are the Self, you are already that.
The fact is, you are ignorant of your blissful state. Ignorance supervenes and draws a veil over the pure Self which is bliss. Attempts are directed only to remove this veil of ignorance which is merely wrong knowledge. The wrong knowledge is the false identification of the Self with the body and the mind. This false identification must go, and then the Self alone remains.
Therefore, realisation is for everyone; realisation makes no difference between the aspirants. This very doubt, whether you can realise, and the notion ?I have not realised? are themselves the obstacles. Be free from these obstacles also.
Sri Ramana Maharshi: Existence is the same as happiness and happiness is the same as being. The word mukti (liberation or freedom) is so provoking. Why should one seek it? One believes that there is bondage and therefore seeks liberation. But the fact is that there is no bondage but only liberation. Why call it by a name and seek it?
Question: What happens to a person after death?
Maharshi: Engage yourself in the living present. The future will take care of itself. Do not worry about the future. The state before creation and the process of creation are dealt with in the scriptures in order that you may know the present. Because you say you are born, therefore they say, yes, and add that God created you.
But do you see God or anything else in your sleep? If God is real, why does he not shine forth in your sleep also? You always are, you are the same now as you were in sleep. You are not different from that one in sleep. But why should there be differences in the feelings or experiences of the two states?
Did you ask, while asleep, questions regarding your birth? Did you then ask ?Where do I go after death?? Why think of all these questions now in the waking state? Let what is born think of its birth and the remedy, its cause and ultimate results.
Question: Why do religions speak of Gods, heaven, hell, etc.?
Sri Ramana Maharshi: Only to make the people realise that they are on a par with this world and that the Self alone is real. The religions are according to the view-point of the seeker.
Words of Wisdom: Sri Ramana Maharshi: Know your self before you seek to decide about the nature of God and the world |
I took the liberty of finding my posts just for you ;) |
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| WhoaNellie1487 |
| quote: | Originally posted by trancepixie17
** I feel somewhat embarrassed, but I could not afford to stay in band because it was about 500 flat right then and there. I play the drums and can totally relate to financial needs. My parents are divorced and my dad has a pretty nice relaxed income, but my mom's is not equivalent. Also, when I do go to church I may not put much in but that's because they ask every week.;) |
I'm sorry to hear that. :( I really hope things start to work out for you.
But yeah, I understand. I don't always give.. I never gave to the churchs I went to because they never really helped me grow in God. I was to busy trying to avoid their little groups. :/ |
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| WhoaNellie1487 |
| quote: | Originally posted by tathi
no one here with a rational brain can apprehend your convoluted and naive sense of logic |
That was uncalled for. But,no skin off my nose. I'm not naive. |
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| WhoaNellie1487 |
| quote: | I find it ridiculous that you keep repeating that youre faith consists of the reasons of what happened in your life, and yet you're unwilling to give examples in a debate. Granted, you said someone could PM you. But then, they can't discuss what you have PMd back in the discussion, which makes the PMing you completely irrelevant, because this discussion is based on more than just two people.
I'm not laughing at the topic. I just chose to mix some sarcasm into my posts, because I don't approve of giving money to the church instead of directly to charities. I see so much money get wasted on meaningless and useless crap that the church "needs". Now, don't even bother to tell me that I wouldn't know condsidering I'm not Christian/Catholic/etc, because my mother is quite religious and very active in her church. Considering most polish people are quite devoute, all of our friends are also extreemists when it comes to religion. Believe you me, they strongly disapprove of the fact that our beliefs are different, but that's fine with me. I will not be brought down by criticism. |
Nope,it's not irrelevant. People still get their answer.
I don't really care if you approve or not, I don't need your approval to do it or not. But,let me just say this..If people didn't give tithes, many people would be dead right about now,and many more people would be suffering. That tithe money goes to good causes.
Well if you don't like criticism,why are you criticizing others?
"Do unto others as you'd have them do to you." You should know that by now.
| quote: | | Regardless, all of your posts make regards to your "personal life" rather that concrete examples/evidence. For the sake of the DEBATE, you're going to have to do better than that. |
Well,if you want to know.You'll PM me,now won't you? |
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| albertoR |
| quote: | Originally posted by anuneventrade
Please give an example of what scientist said such a thing please. I would like a direct quote. |
back what up, no scientist said it, im saying it.
| quote: | | Originally posted by anuneventrade You say that we shouldn't attack someone's beliefs, and yet your are doing it right here.... quite contradictory. Do you personally know what an atheist thinks/believes? No, because you are not one. So don't attempt to make such a claim as that without having any sort of knowledge to back it up. |
Dont make presumptions my friend, i am agnostic however I was bapized and had my first communion in the catholic church. It wasnt until recently about 2 years ago that i lost faith, but i wont get into why.
ok so lets say i dont know what an atheist belives in. why dont you enlighten me. talk about making claims without back up.
Edit. Oh yeah one more thing; i find it funny that you consider religion as something that brainwashes the minds when some of you come here with a philosopher's ideals and state them as if they are true. Hypocritical isnt it. I guess the bible brainwashes as much as your philosopher's novels brainwash you. |
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| anuneventrade |
| quote: | Originally posted by albertoR
back what up, no scientist said it, im saying it. |
Nevermind. Flew over your head.
| quote: | | Dont make presumptions my friend, i am agnostic however I was bapized and had my first communion in the catholic church. It wasnt until recently about 2 years ago that i lost faith, but i wont get into why. |
So you personally believe there's nothing to look forward to other than a coffin and maggots? :rolleyes:
| quote: | | ok so lets say i dont know what an atheist belives in. why dont you enlighten me. talk about making claims without back up. |
At what point and time did I say I was an atheist? In fact, I think I even went out of my way to say I wasn't one. However, I do have close friends that are atheists, and they don't see maggots in their future.
| quote: | | Edit. Oh yeah one more thing; i find it funny that you consider religion as something that brainwashes the minds when some of you come here with a philosopher's ideals and state them as if they are true. Hypocritical isnt it. I guess the bible brainwashes as much as your philosopher's novels brainwash you. |
Never said that either. |
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| albertoR |
| last one wasnt directed at you m8.. |
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| DigiNut |
| quote: | Originally posted by albertoR
Edit. Oh yeah one more thing; i find it funny that you consider religion as something that brainwashes the minds when some of you come here with a philosopher's ideals and state them as if they are true. Hypocritical isnt it. I guess the bible brainwashes as much as your philosopher's novels brainwash you. |
Justification? Example?
Also, "losing faith" doesn't exactly make you an agnostic. It just makes you more secular than the average Christian. To be agnostic you must actively look at the evidence and say, there's no way to tell if there is any God, or any afterlife, or any other supernatural elements, so I'm not going to assume that there is. |
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| WhoaNellie1487 |
| quote: | Originally posted by DigiNut
Justification? Example?
Also, "losing faith" doesn't exactly make you an agnostic. It just makes you more secular than the average Christian. To be agnostic you must actively look at the evidence and say, there's no way to tell if there is any God, or any afterlife, or any other supernatural elements, so I'm not going to assume that there is. |
News flash, If you don't have faith in God you aren't a Christian. Christian means Christ like,so how can you be Christ like if you don't even believe He's real?
Agnostic means you don't believe in anything. Anyway,this person is agnostic,what makes you think you know more about being agnostic than him/her? Also,you aren't even a Christian, what makes you think you know so much? Because you don't,it's obvious when I read your posts. |
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| DigiNut |
| quote: | Originally posted by WhoaNellie1487
News flash, If you don't have faith in God you aren't a Christian. Christian means Christ like,so how can you be Christ like if you don't even believe He's real?
Agnostic means you don't believe in anything. Anyway,this person is agnostic,what makes you think you know more about being agnostic than him/her? Also,you aren't even a Christian, what makes you think you know so much? Because you don't,it's obvious when I read your posts. |
Dear ing lord, do you ALWAYS have to post your 2 cents of ignorance EVERYWHERE!!??
| quote: | ag·nos·tic (P)
n.
1. One who believes that it is impossible to know whether there is a God.
2. One who is skeptical about the existence of God but does not profess true atheism. |
That's a DICTIONARY DEFINITION and corresponds to EXACTLY WHAT I JUST DESCRIBED. If someone "doesn't believe in anything" then they're a nihilist, not an agnostic. For christ's sake, people on this very forum have TOLD YOU THAT at LEAST 10 times and you STILL DON'T GET IT!
And I'm sorry if I don't really give a what YOU think I know, because everything you post is so distorted and downright ignorant that I'd be embarrassed if you actually agreed with me on something!
Please, STOP POSTING. I can't even use ignore because your posts piss everybody off so much that they end up being quoted. Read a god damn science textbook. Look something up in the dictionary. Do SOME KIND OF RESEARCH instead of posting this CRAP!
Man... I need to learn how to be like these people and not feel embarrassed no matter how much of a complete ass of myself I make. How do they do it!? How do they keep making themselves look more and more ignorant and still come back for more no matter how many times they get knocked down!? |
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| WhoaNellie1487 |
| quote: | Originally posted by DigiNut
[FONT=Tahoma][COLOR=#99CCEE]Dear ing lord, do you ALWAYS have to post your 2 cents of ignorance EVERYWHERE!!?? |
It's not ignorance, just because It doesn't match up with your opinion doesn't make it ignorance.
| quote: | | That's a DICTIONARY DEFINITION and corresponds to EXACTLY WHAT I JUST DESCRIBED. If someone "doesn't believe in anything" then they're a nihilist, not an agnostic. For christ's sake, people on this very forum have TOLD YOU THAT at LEAST 10 times and you STILL DON'T GET IT! |
I have several agnostic friends, they don't believe in jack squat, and I'd believe them over you any day.
| quote: | | And I'm sorry if I don't really give a what YOU think I know, because everything you post is so distorted and downright ignorant that I'd be embarrassed if you actually agreed with me on something! |
You're not sorry,so don't apologize. It's not distorted or ignorant,you are just mondo intolerant. Just because I don't agree with you doesn't make my opinion incorrect, or ignorant. Get the picture?
| quote: | | Please, STOP POSTING. I can't even use ignore because your posts piss everybody off so much that they end up being quoted. Read a god damn science textbook. Look something up in the dictionary. Do SOME KIND OF RESEARCH instead of posting this CRAP! |
I have the freedom to post as much,or as little as I please. But it's your fault if you don't ignore my posts. If you don't like them,then just don't reply. It's THAT simple, really. The only person that's really irritated by me,is you. So you really need to quit generalizing. I've done my research.
| quote: | | Man... I need to learn how to be like these people and not feel embarrassed no matter how much of a complete ass of myself I make. How do they do it!? How do they keep making themselves look more and more ignorant and still come back for more no matter how many times they get knocked down!? |
The only person knocking anyone down would be you. I don't go around insulting others, I stick to the debate. |
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