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Cars you Love (pg. 43)
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| zoogla |
| quote: | Originally posted by Leif
You're saying this based on a launch control issue? |
no, i'm saying this based on the fact that the car is japanese. |
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| biznology |
well launch control isnt something that should be used everyday, or even every year by anyone remotely concerned with the well being of their automobiles. would you be disappointed if your camry broke after you power-braked the autobox to peel out and then something broke?
i know it's a 'feature' but even on most ferrari's its not something that someone can just get in the car and do. (there are usually specific toggles, or combos of switches to turn on the feature)
yes, it provides the absolute quickest way to get to 60, but you WILL NOT need that in 90% of events over the cars life. even in most racing situations you do not need full acceleration off the line. if you are going to drag race, you can't expect a stock gtr to do much of that without breaking anyways.
oh and clarkson warmed to it on the track, that video clip was when he was driving through traffic| |
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| gehzumteufel |
| quote: | Originally posted by biznology
yes, it provides the absolute quickest way to get to 60, but you WILL NOT need that in 90% of events over the cars life. even in most racing situations you do not need full acceleration off the line. if you are going to drag race, you can't expect a stock gtr to do much of that without breaking anyways. |
I would agree if launch control was not a feature that is used as a selling point. Also, you could easily argue that if you wanted to do some spirited driving while you are out driving around that you would want to disable the traction control. They basically tell you that you can't disable traction control or else you will ruin your tranny. Which is a crock of . If that ruins your tranny, then there are larger problems that Nissan has. Disabling traction control should not damage it. |
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| Utencil |
Ferrari Scuderia
Porsche Carrera GT
The GTR is indeed a great car and not a big "fail". As with any new revolutionary car there are always "bugs" to work out the first model year. Launch control will not be an option next year and I expect the V-spec to be a monster.
There's so much uproar over Nissan's warranty denials b/c of so-called driver "abuse", but many other manufacturers have done the same. One painful reminder is what happened to my now sold Porsche 996 TT. A number of the 996 Turbos, especially the early years (01-02), had the 2nd gear pop-out which Porsche SHOULD automatically have fixed under warranty. Many claims were denied, however, based upon the Type I & II overrevs. To make a long story short, Porsche considered high Type I and II numbers a sign of driver abuse and it was up to the owner to repair the 2nd gear popout which involves taking out the transmission and replacing the synchros. I was lucky to find a local independent shop that "rebuild” the transmission for almost 6K...the dealer were asking close to 15K to replace the damn thing. Of course these numbers have nothing to do with driver “abuse” and are a design flaw, but you know how it is….this is nothing new to Nissan… |
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| gehzumteufel |
| quote: | Originally posted by Utencil
Ferrari Scuderia
Porsche Carrera GT
The GTR is indeed a great car and not a big "fail". As with any new revolutionary car there are always "bugs" to work out the first model year. Launch control will not be an option next year and I expect the V-spec to be a monster.
There's so much uproar over Nissan's warranty denials b/c of so-called driver "abuse", but many other manufacturers have done the same. One painful reminder is what happened to my now sold Porsche 996 TT. A number of the 996 Turbos, especially the early years (01-02), had the 2nd gear pop-out which Porsche SHOULD automatically have fixed under warranty. Many claims were denied, however, based upon the Type I & II overrevs. To make a long story short, Porsche considered high Type I and II numbers a sign of driver abuse and it was up to the owner to repair the 2nd gear popout which involves taking out the transmission and replacing the synchros. I was lucky to find a local independent shop that "rebuild” the transmission for almost 6K...the dealer were asking close to 15K to replace the damn thing. Of course these numbers have nothing to do with driver “abuse” and are a design flaw, but you know how it is….this is nothing new to Nissan… |
But people who generally buy a Porsche or Ferrari are a totally different demographic than that of the Nissan customer. Generally someone who is buying either of those two marks have the money to do most, if not all, the maintenance without blinking.
And this is new to Nissan as a brand, but not the higher performance automobile market as a whole. |
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| biznology |
| quote: | Originally posted by gehzumteufel
I would agree if launch control was not a feature that is used as a selling point. Also, you could easily argue that if you wanted to do some spirited driving while you are out driving around that you would want to disable the traction control. They basically tell you that you can't disable traction control or else you will ruin your tranny. Which is a crock of . If that ruins your tranny, then there are larger problems that Nissan has. Disabling traction control should not damage it. |
yes, but top speed is occasionally a selling point, how often does anyone ever actually get to use that? especially on a supercar?
launch control and traction control are two totally different things. one is a passive system with little or no stress on any mechanical bits, the other is likely the single most stressful thing you could do to an auto system. *yes* it shouldn't be a selling feature, but its unlikely that someone in the market for a GTR would be put off by a lack of 'launch control', or a lack of it as a main feature|
(and in japan, you cannot disable traction control, or any of the safety features unless you are on a track) |
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| biznology |
| quote: | Originally posted by gehzumteufel
But people who generally buy a Porsche or Ferrari are a totally different demographic than that of the Nissan customer. Generally someone who is buying either of those two marks have the money to do most, if not all, the maintenance without blinking.
And this is new to Nissan as a brand, but not the higher performance automobile market as a whole. |
yes the GTR is cheaper, but its in the same realm. with limited numbers and jacked up dealer prices it really isn't far removed from porsche numbers - it isnt a sentra SER |
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| gehzumteufel |
| quote: | Originally posted by biznology
yes the GTR is cheaper, but its in the same realm. with limited numbers and jacked up dealer prices it really isn't far removed from porsche numbers - it isnt a sentra SER |
Agreed.
| quote: | Originally posted by biznology
yes, but top speed is occasionally a selling point, how often does anyone ever actually get to use that? especially on a supercar?
launch control and traction control are two totally different things. one is a passive system with little or no stress on any mechanical bits, the other is likely the single most stressful thing you could do to an auto system. *yes* it shouldn't be a selling feature, but its unlikely that someone in the market for a GTR would be put off by a lack of 'launch control', or a lack of it as a main feature|
(and in japan, you cannot disable traction control, or any of the safety features unless you are on a track) |
To get to launch control, you must disable traction control. Or more specifically named "VDC" or Vehicle Dynamic Control. BY DISABLING THIS you void your warranty if you disable it too many times. Yes that is right. DISABLING the traction control, aka VDC in this instance, VOIDS your warranty. If it were just enabling launch control being voiding warranty when used too many times, ok, but that is not the case here. |
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| pmoisse |
Having some datalogging capacity in performance cars shouldn't be that surprising.
Hell, enough warranty claims have likley been voided because people get excited doing hard launches in their Subaru STi's and snap axles.
Regardless of the launch control being a selling feature or not, if you knowingly do something against the terms and conditions of the warranty of the car, you shouldn't be covered. Simple.
As for the thought that disabling the traction control kills the diffs and tranny, it's probably more scare than anything. Given how these things all have to work together and the forces involved, letting the system work as it's supposed to is probably for the best. |
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| biznology |
| quote: | Originally posted by gehzumteufel
...
To get to launch control, you must disable traction control. Or more specifically named "VDC" or Vehicle Dynamic Control. BY DISABLING THIS you void your warranty if you disable it too many times. Yes that is right. DISABLING the traction control, aka VDC in this instance, VOIDS your warranty. If it were just enabling launch control being voiding warranty when used too many times, ok, but that is not the case here. |
yes, but most people that are getting a GTR arent buying it on the assumption that their warranty will be covering any and all problems in the future - esp with all the hooning most intend on doing.
there are lots of things that one can do to a car to void the warranty, just like with electronics. i get that the issue is with the warranty but if you get a GTR you should likely factor in the fact you WILL have to pay to get it fixed, new tires, etc. the engines and transmissions are hand built (or at least custom built to each other's specs, on each car) this isnt the same as a hyundai sonata. you can get in a tizzy about this, but its pretty common place in a world of liability that one choice could negate your warranty, especially in a car that is 80% computers| |
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| gehzumteufel |
| quote: | Originally posted by pmoisse
Having some datalogging capacity in performance cars shouldn't be that surprising.
Hell, enough warranty claims have likley been voided because people get excited doing hard launches in their Subaru STi's and snap axles.
Regardless of the launch control being a selling feature or not, if you knowingly do something against the terms and conditions of the warranty of the car, you shouldn't be covered. Simple.
As for the thought that disabling the traction control kills the diffs and tranny, it's probably more scare than anything. Given how these things all have to work together and the forces involved, letting the system work as it's supposed to is probably for the best. |
Disabling traction control has its advantages. They are all rooted in the fact that some places have dry climates and some of those users are quite handy at understanding their cars. Being ed for disabling it is just plain ed. Disabling it does not mean you are doing things that void the warranty even if it is likely. They are basically saying that you can't use your car as you wish as long as it is not abused if you want the warranty. |
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| gehzumteufel |
| quote: | Originally posted by biznology
yes, but most people that are getting a GTR arent buying it on the assumption that their warranty will be covering any and all problems in the future - esp with all the hooning most intend on doing.
there are lots of things that one can do to a car to void the warranty, just like with electronics. i get that the issue is with the warranty but if you get a GTR you should likely factor in the fact you WILL have to pay to get it fixed, new tires, etc. the engines and transmissions are hand built (or at least custom built to each other's specs, on each car) this isnt the same as a hyundai sonata. you can get in a tizzy about this, but its pretty common place in a world of liability that one choice could negate your warranty, especially in a car that is 80% computers| |
But just the mere fact that disabling traction control a few times, even if you aren't abusing it, voids your warranty is ridiculous.
"Hey man, you are buying this car, and as long as you never change anything, leave all things enabled, and drive it like a grandma you can keep your warranty. Otherwise, if you disable any systems, even if it is possible without anything special, you don't abuse it, etc, your warranty is void. sorry man, your ed."
If that is ok with you, then what is the point of a warranty? |
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