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Keyed tunes for Harmonic mixers (pg. 83)
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| Ryan_Guppy |
Did an example of a harmonic mix using three tracks at once , all have percussion that work together (simular) and are in key :
tracks are
sash ! equador
da hool meet her at the love parade
faithless insomnia
its just a little example to show the value of mixing in key and mixing tracks with simular percussion .
download link :
http://www.sendspace.com/file/ew3d9o |
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| Nemesis44 |
I hate Sendspace so much. Never seem to be able to download anythng there
Nem |
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| Ryan_Guppy |
Hi try this link , ive uploaded it to putfile aswell :
[[ LINK REMOVED ]]
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| Nemesis44 |
Interesting work there, was this Ableton are did you do it for real?
Either way, a nice bit of creativity for sure.
Yes generally it is in key, the only problem that happens on the odd ocasion is with faithless and Ecuador in the second breakdown due to the melodies of the two tracks being rooted in different scales.
Also the drums in Da Hool can be a real bugger as they are actually tuned too.
Thanks for sharing though. I would say that you have definately grasped the idea and are coming out with some real intersting stuff, even if your choice of tunes where a little old.
Cheers
Nem |
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| Ryan_Guppy |
did another example of mixing in key and mixing tracks with simular precussion
im into older trance/house stuff at the mo , hence why the tracks are older .
its Robert miles "children" with bbe "seven days and one week"
both tracks are playing the whole time apart from the children intro bit
link :
http://www.sendspace.com/file/pc63g1
any comments appreciated.its not meant to be a bootleg or anything , just showing how well tracks can fit together when taking time over choosing the right ones to mix together . |
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| Neo95gt |
OK so I've read almost the entire thread but I have a few questions.
Just so I have this right, using the Camelot system you want to:
Mix/blend songs with the same number or +/- 1 number.
Ex. Currnet tune is a 3a, you would want to play a 2, 3 or 4 for a good harmonic sounding mix.
You can also quickly drop songs in that have a +4 number or a -3 number.
Ex. Current tune is a 6a, drop a 3a or a 10a. (do you get a different "feel" going up or down?)
Is this correct? Are there any other plus or minus rules? I thought I read somewhere that you can quickly drop in a track that is +6 than the current track? Are there any other combinations I should be aware of?
Also, can the numbers be used as a guide to hype up the crowd? Meaning, if you are currently playing a track that is 6a, by mixing into a 7a, does this give off more energy? And in vice versa, if the current track you are playing is a 6a and you mix into a 5a, does this bring the crowd down?
What I am trying to say, can the 1-12 camelot system be used as a hype meter, meaning, is 1 a low key harmony and 12 is an uber hyped up track?
Hopefully you get what I'm saying and thanks for any help! |
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| xtr3m |
Sorry guys for replying that late.
It's indeed John Digweed's. |
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| Beatflux |
| quote: | Originally posted by Neo95gt
OK so I've read almost the entire thread but I have a few questions.
Just so I have this right, using the Camelot system you want to:
Mix/blend songs with the same number or +/- 1 number.
Ex. Currnet tune is a 3a, you would want to play a 2, 3 or 4 for a good harmonic sounding mix.
You can also quickly drop songs in that have a +4 number or a -3 number.
Ex. Current tune is a 6a, drop a 3a or a 10a. (do you get a different "feel" going up or down?)
Is this correct? Are there any other plus or minus rules? I thought I read somewhere that you can quickly drop in a track that is +6 than the current track? Are there any other combinations I should be aware of?
Also, can the numbers be used as a guide to hype up the crowd? Meaning, if you are currently playing a track that is 6a, by mixing into a 7a, does this give off more energy? And in vice versa, if the current track you are playing is a 6a and you mix into a 5a, does this bring the crowd down?
What I am trying to say, can the 1-12 camelot system be used as a hype meter, meaning, is 1 a low key harmony and 12 is an uber hyped up track?
Hopefully you get what I'm saying and thanks for any help! |
The camelot system is based off of the circle of fifths, and when you go around the circle you are essential playing keys that are higher and higher in pitch so when you go from 6a to 7a you are technically playing one of the notes one half-step higher.
I've never heard of +4 or -3.
The standard rules are : +- 1, letter change, or +2+7 for a harmonic boost with separated melodies |
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| Nemesis44 |
| quote: | Originally posted by Beatflux
I've never heard of +4 or -3.
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Yeah the +4 -3 also works.
Basically if you take an open guitar chord (for simplicity) and look at the other notes at work you will find that the root note is repeated and there are one or two other options in there other than the 5th.
Camelot generally will tell you that there 4th and 5th are the only way to go, but there are plenty of other ideas that can be experimented with that will give of individual and unique results depending on how you mix them.
This is something that contradicts the people who think that it's mixing by numbers, you can take it much further than that and it is really a question of trial and error and you judging what really works. You can flip around your record box quite drastically and can usually find a route to play what needs to be played quite easily, if not straight away then after then next track.
You also get a lot of 'no' sayers who say that it's not needed for their genre who can become quite snobby about it. Bottom line is that if you listen to their sets, if you are hamonically inclined your ears will be screaming for them to stop. I digress...
To answer Neo95gt,
Yes you can use keys to dictate energy levels to a certain degree for sure. The quick swap modulation mix is the most obvious i.e. going from a 12a to a 7a (C#m to a Dm). But you would have to do a quick mix, other wise keys would clash quite seriously.
It's sort of like a lot of old rock n' roll tracks that would lift the last chorus by one note to give the song a big finale.
Naturally, good track selection also plays a part, just the change of key in itself will not ensure a rise of energy but that's another story.
Cheers
Nem |
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| Beatflux |
| quote: | Originally posted by Nemesis44
Yeah the +4 -3 also works.
Basically if you take an open guitar chord (for simplicity) and look at the other notes at work you will find that the root note is repeated and there are one or two other options in there other than the 5th.
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I gave +4 and -3 a try and the transitions just sounded dissonant to me. I looked at the circle of fifths to try and make sense of your explanation, and adding to the fact that I'm not very well versed in guitar theory made it hard to understand. I am more familiar with piano. |
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| Nemesis44 |
| quote: | Originally posted by Beatflux
I gave +4 and -3 a try and the transitions just sounded dissonant to me. I looked at the circle of fifths to try and make sense of your explanation, and adding to the fact that I'm not very well versed in guitar theory made it hard to understand. I am more familiar with piano. |
Granted.
I tend to mix with quick changes in this case to give a lift etc rather than have two tracks playing alongside eachother.
The main difference would be that you would find that you don't have to eq out the higher end stuff due to clashing unlike if you were just going up one step on the chromatic scale.
If you look at the construction of an open E-minor going from the lowest note up it goes E,B,E,G,B,E
By that logic you could in theory play an Em 9a with a Gm 6a. Naturally if you had a track in 6a that was too busy it would sound rough, as I'm sure you know, whilst the root note would sound fine, it would potentially have notes in the scale of G minor that don't go with notes in Em.
It does work but it's more a question of how you apply it. Bass notes can often sound strange when thrown together even if it's 4ths and 5ths. If you have ever played a chord on a bass guitar you would know what I mean (Doesn't seem to happen with piano so might depend on the sound itself). It's technically correct but doesn't always sound good. In other words, the octave of the note can play a part.
Cheers
Nem |
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| chris harrington |
ok So i started doing this for a while and gave up (not sure why) but i want to start again. i have to things to ask:
1. i just went to mixshare to look up some keys. how accurate are the keys on there usually? can i pretty much trust it?
2. can someone finish this for me? i have done my best to figure it out but i dont know anything about keys/note names or whatever its called haha. Thanks
1A - G#m
2A - D#m
3A - A#m
4A - Fm
5A - Cm
6A - GM
7A - Dm
8A - Am
9A - Em
10A - Bm
11A - F#m
12A - C#m
1B -
2B -
3B -
4B - G#
5B -
6B - A#
7B -
8B -
9B -
10B -
11B -
12B -
Thanks guys
Chris |
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