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Palestinian-Israeli Conflict Thread (pg. 5)
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| shaolin_Z |
Wow, I'm absolutely disgusted by the fanaticism, depravity, and savagery of a good number of the settlers in Hebron.  |
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| Q5echo |
Hebron has been witness to many savage and terrible things in recent history.
i believe it started here:
| quote: | For some time, the 800 Jews in Hebron lived in peace with their tens of thousands of Arab neighbors. But on the night of August 23, 1929, the tension simmering within this cauldron of nationalities bubbled over, and for 3 days, Hebron turned into a city of terror and murder. By the time the massacres ended, 67 Jews lay dead and the survivors were relocated to Jerusalem, leaving Hebron barren of Jews for the first time in hundreds of years.
The summer of 1929 was one of unrest in Palestine. Jewish-Arab tensions were spurred on by the agitation of the mufti in Jerusalem. Just one day prior to the start of the Hebron massacre, three Jews and three Arabs were killed in Jerusalem when fighting broke out after a Muslim prayer service on the Temple Mount. Arabs spread false rumors throughout their communities, saying that Jews were carrying out "wholesale killings of Arabs." Meanwhile, Jewish immigrants were arriving in Palestine in increasing numbers, further exacerbating the Jewish-Arab conflict.
Hebron had, until this time, been outwardly peaceful, although tension hid below the surface. The Sephardi Jewish community in Hebron had lived quietly with its Arab neighbors for centuries. The Sephardi Jews (Jews who were originally from Spain, North Africa and Arab countries) spoke Arabic and had a cultural connection to their Arab neighbors. In the mid-1800s, Ashkenazi (native European) Jews started moving to Hebron and, in 1925, the Slobodka Yeshiva, officially the Yeshiva of Hevron, Knesset Yisrael-Slobodka, was opened. Yeshiva students lived separately from the Sephardi community, and from the Arab population. Due to this isolation, the Arabs viewed them with suspicion and hatred, and identified them as Zionist immigrants. Despite the general suspicion, however, one yeshiva student, Dov Cohen, still recalled being on "very good" terms with the Arab neighbors. He remembered yeshiva boys taking long walks late at night on the outskirts of the city, and not feeling afraid, even though only one British policeman guarded the entire city.
On Friday, August 23, 1929, that tranquility was lost. Arab youths started throwing rocks at the yeshiva students. That afternoon, one student, Shmuel Rosenholtz, went to the yeshiva alone. Arab rioters later broke in and killed him, and that was only the beginning.
Friday night, Rabbi Ya’acov Slonim’s son invited any fearful Jews to stay in his house. The rabbi was highly regarded in the community, and he had a gun. Many Jews took him up on this offer, and many Jews were eventually murdered there.
As early as 8:00 a.m. on Saturday, the Jewish Sabbath, Arabs began to gather en masse. They came in mobs, armed with clubs, knives and axes. While the women and children threw stones, the men ransacked Jewish houses and destroyed Jewish property. With only a single police officer in Hebron, the Arabs entered Jewish courtyards with no opposition.
Rabbi Slonim, who had tried to shelter the Jewish population, was approached by the rioters and offered a deal. If all the Ashkenazi yeshiva students were given over to the Arabs, the rioters would spare the lives of the Sephardi community. Rabbi Slonim refused to turn over the students and was killed on the spot. In the end, 12 Sephardi Jews and 55 Ashkenazi Jews were murdered.
A few Arabs did try to help the Jews. Nineteen Arab families saved dozens, maybe even hundreds of Jews. Zmira Mani wrote about an Arab named Abu Id Zaitoun who brought his brother and son to rescue her and her family. The Arab family protected the Manis with their swords, hid them in a cellar along with other Jews who they had saved, and found a policeman to escort them safely to the police station at Beit Romano.
The police station turned into a shelter for the Jews that morning of August 24. It also became a synagogue as the Orthodox Jews gathered there and said their morning prayers. As they finished praying, they began to hear noises outside the building. Thousands of Arabs descended from Har Hebron, shouting "Kill the Jews!" in Arabic. They even tried to break down the doors of the station.
The Jews were besieged in Beit Romano for three days. Each night, ten men were allowed to leave to attend a funeral in Hebron’s ancient Jewish cemetery for the murdered Jews of the day.
When the massacre finally ended, the surviving Jews were forced to leave their home city and resettled in Jerusalem. Some Jewish families tried to move back to Hebron, but were removed by the British authorities in 1936 at the start of the Arab revolt. In 1948, the War of Independence granted Israel statehood, but further cut the Jews off from Hebron, a city that was captured by King Abdullah's Arab Legion and ultimately annexed to Jordan.
When Jews finally gained control of the city in 1967, a small number of massacre survivors again tried to reclaim their old houses. Then defense minister Moshe Dayan supposedly told the survivors that if they returned, they would be arrested, and that they should be patient while the government worked out a solution to get their houses back. Years later, settlers moved to parts of Hebron without the permission of the government, but for those massacre survivors still seeking their original homes, that solution never came. |
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| shaolin_Z |
That's a nice little obscure peice of propaganda you edited in to your post there, conveniently ommiting the source, again, which isn't a surprise eigther coming from you. Did you write it yourself? :eek:
Want to debate the issue and levels of responsibility? Then please address all the sourced material I've posted, particularly on Zionist ideology and it's necessity for ethnic cleansing of the Palestinians from their own lands, well before the state of Israel was even established, their utter disregard for the Geneva Convensions, UN Resolutions, countless human rights vilations, state santiontioned terrorism, illegal military occupation, and illegal expansion. But ofcourse you're not going to do that, because the facts kind of destroy your position, and also reveal it's repuslive nature. Instead, we'll just see more deliberate avoidance, denial, ignorance, and unsourced propaganda posted by you. Ofcourse the fact that Palestinians are the ones who've lived there for centuries, are the ones being occupied, displaced, herded, imprisoned, and slaughtered by foreign immigrants illegaly settling on their land is completely irrelevant right? The amount of double-think and double-speak you engage in is truly astounding. But is that really such a surprise coming from a NeoCon? |
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| Q5echo |
| quote: | Originally posted by shaolin_Z
That's a nice little obscure peice of propaganda you edited in to your post there, conveniently ommiting the source, again, which isn't a surprise eigther coming from you. Did you write it yourself? :eek:
Want to debate the issue and levels of responsibility? Then please address all the sourced material I've posted, particularly on Zionist ideology and it's necessity for ethnic cleansing of the Palestinians from their own lands, well before the state of Israel was even established, their utter disregard for the Geneva Convensions, UN Resolutions, countless human rights vilations, state santiontioned terrorism, illegal military occupation, and illegal expansion. But ofcourse you're not going to do that, because the facts kind of destroy your position, and also reveal it's repuslive nature. Instead, we'll just see more deliberate avoidance, denial, ignorance, and unsourced propaganda posted by you. Ofcourse the fact that Palestinians are the ones who've lived there for centuries, are the ones being occupied, displaced, herded, imprisoned, and slaughtered by foreign immigrants illegaly settling on their land is completely irrelevant right? The amount of double-think and double-speak you engage in is truly astounding. But is that really such a surprise coming from a NeoCon? |
give me a frikken break dude. propaganda? :rolleyes:
is there anything in that article i posted about massacre in Hebron that you wouldn't use wikipedia to refute? try.
you brought up Hebron with absolutely ZERO context and and when i bring some your now crying PROPAGANDIST?!!!!!!
please enlighten us ad nauseum again with the same Anti-Zionist history lessons found on the previous pages |
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| shaolin_Z |
Hey look what I found! Since you obviously weren't going to source it yourself, I had to go find it:
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...y/hebron29.html
Hmmm, a Zionist Organization, AICE (American-Israeli Cooperative Enterprise) to be more specific. There same degenrates leaches that lobby in the US, at the expense of the American people, to use our tax dollars, resources, and vito status in the UN to illegaly maintain and expand their military occupation. Wow, what an unbiased source you have there Q. No wonder you left it out :rolleyes:. |
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| Q5echo |
| quote: | Originally posted by shaolin_Z
Hey look what I found! Since you obviously weren't going to source it yourself, I had to go find it:
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...y/hebron29.html
Hmmm, a Zionist Organization, AICE (American-Israeli Cooperative Enterprise) to be more specific. There same degenrates leaches that lobby in the US, at the expense of the American people, to use our tax dollars, resources, and vito status in the UN to illegaly maintain and expand their military occupation. Wow, what an unbiased source you have there Q. No wonder you left it out :rolleyes:. |
you got me the Hebron massacre never happened:rolleyes:
NOTHING TO SEE HERE FOLKS. SHAOLINZ WANTS ALL CONTEXT AND HISTORY THE HEBRON MASSACRE TO BE SQUASHED FROM MEMORY. MOVE ALONG.
please tell us your version of the Hebron massacre Z. since you, in your infinite wisdom brought it up. i think we would all like to see it. |
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| shaolin_Z |
| quote: | Originally posted by Q5echo
you brought up Hebron with absolutely ZERO context |
It's not my fault you don't read or watch anything I post. Take note of the Iron Wall documentary posted on the last page.  |
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| Q5echo |
| quote: | Originally posted by shaolin_Z
It's not my fault you don't read or watch anything I post. Take note of the Iron Wall documentary posted on the last page. |
seriously, i can't sit here and watch a 57 min long movie on the history of Zionism. i'm at work. |
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| shaolin_Z |
| quote: | Originally posted by Q5echo
you got me the Hebron massacre never happened:rolleyes:
NOTHING TO SEE HERE FOLKS. SHAOLINZ WANTS ALL CONTEXT AND HISTORY THE HEBRON MASSACRE TO BE SQUASHED FROM MEMORY. MOVE ALONG.
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It's funny you should say that when you haven't addressed any of the historical context I brought up, or the historical quotes on ethnic cleansing/transfer of the indegenous population by prominent Zionists, including the founding father Herzl. That's kind of pertinent to the issue.
| quote: | Originally posted by Q5echo
please tell us your version of the Hebron massacre Z. since you, in your infinite wisdom brought it up. i think we would all like to see it. |
Oh I will, as soon as you address this:
| quote: | Originally posted by shaolin_Z
Want to debate the issue and levels of responsibility? Then please address all the sourced material I've posted, particularly on Zionist ideology and it's necessity for ethnic cleansing of the Palestinians from their own lands, well before the state of Israel was even established, their utter disregard for the Geneva Convensions, UN Resolutions, countless human rights vilations, state santiontioned terrorism, illegal military occupation, and illegal expansion...
...
Ofcourse the fact that Palestinians are the ones who've lived there for centuries, are the ones being occupied, displaced, herded, imprisoned, and slaughtered by foreign immigrants illegaly settling on their land is completely irrelevant right? |
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| Q5echo |
| quote: | Originally posted by shaolin_Z
Oh I will, as soon as you address this: |
i don't refute any of it. i do fail to see the point in re-gurgitating the same zionist dialogue of the late 19th century as a means to discredit the current situation.
i'm curious. we know that you hate Zionism, but for all intents and purposes, it's over. where do you go from here, now? |
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| Fir3start3r |
| quote: | Originally posted by shaolin_Z
It's not my fault you don't read or watch anything I post. Take note of the Iron Wall documentary posted on the last page. |
...and it's not ours that you expect us to watch and read pages and pages of text and hours of video, yet you tell us nothing of your own thoughts...
Are you just trying to baffle us with bullshi-t?
Rather than vomiting on the board, how about a little more of YOUR perspective and using this stuff as footnotes to support your OWN argument rather than hiding behind someone else's?
Honestly, who has time for all that?? :conf:
Essay writing 101, take what you need from the million page essay and present it so we can follow your logic.
I know I'd appreciate it more and sure others would too.
You do yourself a disservice with too much information; honestly ;) |
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| shaolin_Z |
| quote: | Originally posted by Q5echo
NOTHING TO SEE HERE FOLKS. SHAOLINZ WANTS ALL CONTEXT AND HISTORY THE HEBRON MASSACRE TO BE SQUASHED FROM MEMORY. MOVE ALONG. |
And no, you're wrong again, as usuall. You and your assumptions. I said the article was propaganda, not that the 1929 Hebron Massace where 67 Jews were killed didn't happen. It leaves out alot of relevant information and background, painting a very particular picture to for a first time reader who is unware of the event and other details surronding it that are conveniently ommited. Nice try Q. I'm still waiting for your response, an actuall response as opposed to your standard sidestepping with obfuscations and empty rhetoric . |
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