|
Palestinian-Israeli Conflict Thread
|
View this Thread in Original format
| Lira |
This is an important video, but hasn't the Palestinian condition already been discussed in other threads? Why post another thread instead of replying to an old one?
Just asking... unless there are no replies at all, I'm not merging this before I get an answer. |
|
|
| Lilith |
| oh-uh its the internet cops! :eek: |
|
|
| Subey |
| quote: | Originally posted by Lilith
oh-uh its the internet cops! :eek: |
A natural first reaction, that I had as well. So I set up a stickam meeting in order to clarify. Turns out that it's an experiment he's doing for part of a sociology course.
Apparently he's trying to simulate a police state, whose ultimate purpose is to see if we *rebel*.
Personally I'm not going to play along per se. Instead i'm going to sit on my porch stoop, and mutter things like, "My life fades. The vision dims. All that remains are memories. I remember a time of chaos. The time before The Seven came... Ruined dreams. This wasted land." |
|
|
| Q5echo |
| quote: | Originally posted by Lira
This is an important video, |
yeah, it's important to show how the entire Arab world continues to use the Palestinian plight for selfish, nearsighted, political posturing followed only by complete abandonment for decades. real important stuff. |
|
|
| Subey |
| quote: | Originally posted by Q5echo
yeah, it's important to show how the entire Arab world continues to use the Palestinian plight for selfish, nearsighted, political posturing followed only by complete abandonment for decades. real important stuff. |
It's a human issue. As soon as you move it to an arena of Arab vs Whomever then you have done exactly that, moved it to an arena.
Then your comments are reduced to mere pennant waving. Go team Go! |
|
|
| Magnetonium |
This is what I've been trying to say for ages - people ignore and dont believe in such a thing as Palestinian people suffering. These children are growing up dehumanized, as the video says. Its a psychological trauma of great proportions. Israelis are creating more problems to themselves - and you can see why so many innocent civilian Palestinians, many children have died from IDF aggression.
On other Palestinian threads, I was rudely ridiculed for talking about this, thanks for bringing up the video. I know there are soome other good ones, like Death In Gaza the documentary. Lets compare the living conditions between
Israelis and Palestinians, shall we? And its the Israelis that control how much money comes to these people. IDF has broken basic Geneva Protocols too many times against innocent civilians.
| quote: | Originally posted by Q5echo
yeah, it's important to show how the entire Arab world continues to use the Palestinian plight for selfish, nearsighted, political posturing followed only by complete abandonment for decades. real important stuff. |
Yeah, to you no matter how much the suffering of millions of Palestian people is, its all important for you to have a good life at the cost of oppression and humuliation of people occupied around the world - look even at Iraq. How come you claim that value of human life is not important? You're very ignorant. Its sad.
Its not the Arab world showing this video, but a Western reporter who, when arriving there was shocked at the terrible living conditions - you cant see these in the video??? You are very heartless!!! Arab didnt abandon Palestinians, they fought for the Palestinian cause and their own goals as well. The never abandoned Palestinians. Its Israel who is almighty here that prevents these people to live decent lives. Americans give billions of dollars to Israel every year - and how much of that goes to Palestinian people? What about the millions of people who were illegally displaced by Israell from their own lands since 1948?
Israel tightly controls the Palestinian finances. Palestinians, because they have no infrastructure - mostly kept that way by Israel - are entirely dependent on outside world. And Israel does seize Palestinian property, banks, people whenever it feels like it. It should give Palestinians independence so that they can build their own lives, their own state - how much is that to ask for? Israel is whats preventing these people from becoming financially independent from Israel, because Israel does not give enough financial and econmical support to these people. Since 2000, they have placed an economic embargo in Palestinians. It had a horrible effect on ordinary people, because the terrorists dont get funding from Israel - why do Israelis decide to take it all upon the people?
|
|
|
| Q5echo |
| quote: | Originally posted by Subey
It's a human issue. As soon as you move it to an arena of Arab vs Whomever then you have done exactly that, moved it to an arena.
Then your comments are reduced to mere pennant waving. Go team Go! |
ok. thats nice but the ENTIRE ARAB WORLD has completly ignored the human issue in favor of an irrational cult of death and victimhood in the name of those poor children in the video. not much one can do really until that mindset is overcome by something else a little more constructive...or somebody nukes Israel.
...either way the Palestinians would continue to live in the same manner. nothing i've seen at any time would convince a rational person otherwise.
go victimhood!:rolleyes: |
|
|
| Magnetonium |
| quote: | Originally posted by Q5echo
ok. thats nice but the ENTIRE ARAB WORLD has completly ignored the human issue in favor of an irrational cult of death and victimhood in the name of those poor children in the video. not much one can do really until that mindset is overcome by something else a little more constructive...or somebody nukes Israel.
...either way the Palestinians would continue to live in the same manner. nothing i've seen at any time would convince a rational person otherwise.
go victimhood!:rolleyes: |
Thats actually because Israel defeated Arab states several times to force them to accept Palestinian suffering. All they can do now is to show the videos to people around the world of how Israel treats its Palestinian subjects. Ad this video is done by a western reporter, just like Death In Gaza and many others. |
|
|
| Yoepus |
| quote: | Originally posted by Magnetonium
Thats actually because Israel defeated Arab states several times to force them to accept Palestinian suffering. All they can do now is to show the videos to people around the world of how Israel treats its Palestinian subjects. Ad this video is done by a western reporter, just like Death In Gaza and many others. |
Immediately after the 1967 war Israel wanted to exchange all its captured territory with a peace treaty with its neighbors. Returning Gaza and Sinai to Egypt, the West Bank to Jordan, and the Golan Heights to Syria.
Of course, none of the Arab parties showed up at the tables, because understandably had they negotiated even such a generous peace treaty as this they would have had their governments shooken up; therein lies the problem.
During the 1978 peace treaty, Israel basically pleaded with Egypt to take back Gaza. But of course, Egypt refused preffering to leave the Palestinians in a state of destitute which it could continually have against Israel.
Sure the conditions there are horrible now. However, how were they in 1978, in 1984? Not as bad. Yet people rose up and created terror. Today, it is despicable and there is less terror. So I wouldn't necessarily connect the conditions people live in to terror.
Afterall, if this were true most of the third world would have suicide bombings ever other minute.
Its not that us Israelis don't understand the conditions exist or that the Palestinians don't have the best circumstances. However, until the Palestinians realize they can never win, they will perpetuate themselves into even worse and worse misery.
I believe only by accepting Israel, but understanding they have lost, will they be able to move on. However, they refuse to recognize they are a defeated people; and therein stems the problem. |
|
|
| Fir3start3r |
| quote: | Originally posted by Magnetonium
This is what I've been trying to say for ages - people ignore and dont believe in such a thing as Palestinian people suffering. These children are growing up dehumanized, as the video says. Its a psychological trauma of great proportions. Israelis are creating more problems to themselves - and you can see why so many innocent civilian Palestinians, many children have died from IDF aggression.
On other Palestinian threads, I was rudely ridiculed for talking about this, thanks for bringing up the video. I know there are soome other good ones, like Death In Gaza the documentary. Lets compare the living conditions between
Israelis and Palestinians, shall we? And its the Israelis that control how much money comes to these people. IDF has broken basic Geneva Protocols too many times against innocent civilians.
Yeah, to you no matter how much the suffering of millions of Palestian people is, its all important for you to have a good life at the cost of oppression and humuliation of people occupied around the world - look even at Iraq. How come you claim that value of human life is not important? You're very ignorant. Its sad.
Its not the Arab world showing this video, but a Western reporter who, when arriving there was shocked at the terrible living conditions - you cant see these in the video??? You are very heartless!!! Arab didnt abandon Palestinians, they fought for the Palestinian cause and their own goals as well. The never abandoned Palestinians. Its Israel who is almighty here that prevents these people to live decent lives. Americans give billions of dollars to Israel every year - and how much of that goes to Palestinian people? What about the millions of people who were illegally displaced by Israell from their own lands since 1948?
Israel tightly controls the Palestinian finances. Palestinians, because they have no infrastructure - mostly kept that way by Israel - are entirely dependent on outside world. And Israel does seize Palestinian property, banks, people whenever it feels like it. It should give Palestinians independence so that they can build their own lives, their own state - how much is that to ask for? Israel is whats preventing these people from becoming financially independent from Israel, because Israel does not give enough financial and econmical support to these people. Since 2000, they have placed an economic embargo in Palestinians. It had a horrible effect on ordinary people, because the terrorists dont get funding from Israel - why do Israelis decide to take it all upon the people?
|
I'm sure none of it has to do with rockets flying over the border either?
Let's not kid ourselves, Israel has tried a few times to bend over backwards only to get screwed by radicals (I'm not pointing out the Palestinians per say here so watch it) that Palestine can't seem, or want to control.
I'm sure if Israel wanted, it could totally ignore everybody around them just fine; they have everything already!
There's nothing within thousands of miles and they're doing it all with just 8,5501 sq mi...
While it is tragic to point out the kids, what exactly has Palestine done to change their situation other than point to Israel?
Do we just throw personal responsibility out the window when it's just easier to blame someone else?
It's today's societal hamartia and it's certainly reflected here IMHO.
Sorry if this sounds harsh for some of you, but I can't feel sorry for people who can't, and obviously won't, help themselves, especially when it comes to their own children.
I'm sure some of you are rolling your eyes right about now, probably thinking, "Just how dumb are you? You obviously don't understand..." etc. and I say back, "Get a spine and think of the children first".
This situation isn't new and they've failed to do ANYTHING to change it.
In fact, it's be ISRAEL who has been trying.
Just before their recent retaliation they were on the verge of a landmark deal with Palestine and what happens? Rockets and the kidnapping of soldiers. What the hell are they thinking??
I'll see if I can find the article relating to the deal they almost had, I know I've posted it before but I have to jet...
We'll continue this later... |
|
|
| Q5echo |
| quote: | Originally posted by Magnetonium
Thats actually because Israel defeated Arab states several times to force them to accept Palestinian suffering. All they can do now is to show the videos to people around the world of how Israel treats its Palestinian subjects. |
thanx for the history lesson but i'm i'm quite sure they can do more than that.
wtf? |
|
|
|
|
