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Liberals to form Coalition with NDP
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| feelgood |
Pfft.. no more injecting money into an ailing economy.. please!
Source: http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2008...tion-talks.html
Liberal MPs are expected to receive on Monday the outline of a Liberal-NDP coalition agreement that would see the two parties replace the minority Conservative government.
Details of the agreement were being fleshed out Sunday night.
Under the proposed deal, the NDP would hold 25 per cent of cabinet positions while the positions of finance minister, treasury board president and deputy prime minister would be held by Liberals.
The deal would reportedly last 30 months.
The Bloc Québécois would not officially be a part of the coalition, but the new government's survival would depend on its support.
Liberal Leader Stéphane Dion has shown the outline of an agreement between his party and the New Democratic Party to Liberal leadership candidates Michael Ignatieff, Dominic LeBlanc and Bob Rae.
The Liberal caucus is meeting Monday and will discuss the proposed agreement.
What remains unclear is who would lead the coalition.
"The real obstacle to this deal going through is still within the Liberal party," CBC's Keith Boag reported, adding the deal is being negotiated by Dion, who believes he has the right to be prime minister.
But it's unclear whether the party wants him to continue, and the leadership candidates met Sunday evening to discuss the matter, Boag said.
The National Post reported that a deal has been worked out that would make Ignatieff, who has the support of a majority of Liberal MPs, the prime minister in a Liberal-led coalition, with Rae being named to a senior post.
But it in an interview with CTV's Canada AM, Rae said there was no discussion at the meeting among the leadership candidates that someone other than Dion would lead the coalition.
However, Prime Minister Stephen Harper could still block coalition efforts by proroguing Parliament, that is, suspending it without dissolving it. That would mean his government could not be defeated in the current session of the House of Commons.
NDP working with Bloc long before financial update: Tories
Harper, who was first elected in a minority government in 2006, won a strengthened minority government in October.
Opposition parties say they have lost confidence in Harper's government after Thursday's economic update by Finance Minister Jim Flaherty failed to provide a stimulus package for Canadians.
Since then, the Liberals have been in negotiations to form a coalition with the NDP, and the concessions made by the Conservatives over the weekend have done nothing to change the parties' view that Harper must go.
On Sunday, Flaherty said the government would deliver the budget on Jan. 27, about a month before one is normally tabled in the House of Commons.
Shortly after his announcement, Transport Minister John Baird said the minority government won't try to eliminate federal civil servants' right to strike over the next couple of years, as pledged in last week's economic update.
On Saturday, Baird also announced the government had shelved its contentious plan to eliminate political party subsidies that are based on the number of votes received during elections.
Parliament is due to vote on a Liberal no-confidence motion on Dec. 8. If the Conservatives lose, the opposition parties could be invited by the Gov. Gen. Michaëlle Jean to form a government.
The Conservatives, meanwhile, have released details of a secretly recorded NDP caucus meeting they say was held in the form of a conference call on Saturday.
The Tories say they released a portion of the transcript on Sunday because it shows the NDP was working very closely with the Bloc long before last Thursday's economic update to replace the government.
"Let's just say we have strategies," NDP Leader Jack Layton said during the call. "This whole thing would not have happened if the moves hadn't been made with the Bloc to lock them in early because you couldn't put three people together in … three hours. The first part was done a long time ago. I won't go into details."
NDP deputy leader Thomas Mulcair said at a news conference that nothing in the NDP-BQ talks is any different than the contingency planning Stephen Harper himself engaged in with the two parties during the last Liberal minority in 2004.
He said the meeting, the co-ordinates of which were inadvertently given to a Tory, were illegally recorded and broadcast.
In a news release, the party said that according to their legal advice, any reasonable person given inadvertant access to the call should have understood that they were not authorized to record it. The party said any possession of the recording could be an offence under the Criminal Code and should be handed over to the RCMP in any investigation. |
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| ChemEnhanced |
This whole thing is going to get really messy before things get straightened out.
The last thing the Liberals want right now is another election and a coalition with the NDP right now scares me. The Liberals need to find a new leader before this happens. |
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| Moral Hazard |
Harper tried to play politics with the economy and bury the opposition parties by removing their funding... the opposition reacted by moving to oust the cons but had to play politics by saying it was due to the lack of stimulus. Harper panics, hits the hold button to buy time and then offers to repeal the cut in party funding... probably thinking that by doing so it will get the opposition to abandon the non-confidence motion while also illustrating that they really only cared about the funding cuts... now the opposition has to decide whether to keep pushing for a stimulus package (as to avoid showing that the funding was the real reason they wanted to vote down the economic statement), back down (and expose their true reasons), or follow through with the threat... I imagine they will make their decision based on opinion polls this week.
Petty politics on both sides of the house have gotten us into a game of political chicken in Ottawa. Who's going to blink? So far it looks like the Cons are more likely to give in; however, a week is a long time in politics. Truthfully, the best thing that could happen right now would be for Harper to porogue parliament until January... give everyone a chance to cool down and figure out a way both sides can back down with a minimal loss of face. |
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| Orko |
All because the conservatives have not pushed a 'stimulus package', one that is not even needed. This just shows you how poorly the other parties would have run the country in a tough economic period.
First they get upset that we might run a deficit. Then the CPC says, no, we can balance the books, and will not give out a stimulus package. So then the opposition gets upset that there is no package, and there fore no deficit.
Their beef about party funding is a legitimate one, but , shut up about the packages. Respect the election, and your citizens, and allow the government to govern!
We are not even in a rescission yet, and our banking/mortgage sector is solid, from the strict regulation that was always in place. Our markets, and government worked properly when they needed to. Canada is suffering because other countries screwed up, not because of our own problems.
| quote: | Canada's GDP edges up 0.3%
Canada's gross domestic product posted a slight gain in the third quarter of this year, rising 0.3 per cent, with most of the increase coming in July, Statistics Canada reported Monday.
Economic activity edged up 0.1 per cent in September following a decline in August.
The quarterly growth amounted to an annualized rate of 1.3 per cent, while the U.S. economy posted a decline of 0.5 per cent.
Production of goods rebounded in the third quarter following four consecutive quarterly declines, the agency said. The increase was led by the mining sector, notably support activities for oil and gas extraction, as well as construction.
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http://www.cbc.ca/money/story/2008/...ee.html?ref=rss |
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| exstasie |
| quote: | Originally posted by Orko
All because the conservatives have not pushed a 'stimulus package', one that is not even needed. This just shows you how poorly the other parties would have run the country in a tough economic period.
First they get upset that we might run a deficit. Then the CPC says, no, we can balance the books, and will not give out a stimulus package. So then the opposition gets upset that there is no package, and there fore no deficit.
Their beef about party funding is a legitimate one, but , shut up about the packages. Respect the election, and your citizens, and allow the government to govern!
We are not even in a rescission yet, and our banking/mortgage sector is solid, from the strict regulation that was always in place. Our markets, and government worked properly when they needed to. Canada is suffering because other countries screwed up, not because of our own problems. |
+1 +1 +1!
We are not in the same kind of financial issues as the United States, and pushing a stimulus package will creates significant long term issues.
There has been countless evidence that we aren't in the same kind of situation as the US. Positive GDP growth while the US has seen a negative growth. Our banks are making a $$. RBC made a profit if $1.1 Billion I believe in the 3rd Quarter.
We don't have anywhere near the same kind of housing forclosure rate as in the United States.
There is no need for a stimulus package right now. Majority of our Job losses are based on the investments that these firms have made in the US.
I'm scared of what the Liberals/NDP will do this country and specifically Western Canada...were screwed!
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| Spam |
This won't happen because the Liberals will NOT agree on who gets to be leader of said coalition anyway. There's still tons of in-fighting within the Liberal caucus, and they sure as hell don't want DION as PM. So with that out of the way...
"Stimulus" packages don't work. They give the money to said companies, then those companies piss their money away (the reason they got into their mess in the first place) and no improvements are seen. Look at the first bundle of money the States handed out to their banks (instead of, you know, the people who gave the government that money in the first place... taxpayers?), it's gone now, and the market has been continuing to crash since they announced it. HMMMMMMMMM.
Am I the ONLY person in the world that read about all the government attempts to fix the economy during past recessions and depressions only to see those attempts fail? We go over like 3 main low-points in our economy in High School history, the only economic crisis that was fixed by a government was fixed by a government led by a man named Adolph Hitler... Government, realistically, has very little power over the economy. And the Liberals and New Democratic Liberals want to piss our tax-dollars away on car companies that are in trouble because of their own poor business models?
If they really wanted to help the long-term economy. They'd stop access to easy credit (which, luckily, our Canadian system has been better at than the American and Euro systems, which is why we aren't in the same mess they are, our mess is more a trickle-down from theirs). The great depression was sparked by the realization that a large % of credit owed to companies would not be paid because they were letting every idiot with a job purchase on credit. When the payments stopped... BAM economy crashed... Sound familiar? Why don't people ever learn?
THIS particular crash was started when the Clinton Democrats started to force mortgage companies and banks to give out mortgages to low-income families, all in the name of equality. A few years down the road, those low-income families realize "Hey, we can't afford this" and the payments stop... BAM economy crashes!
People blame the Republicans for not implementing any oversight or regulation. But it was the ing DEMOCRATS who got them into this mess to begin with. Liberal ideology got the ball rolling, and now a Canadian group of Liberals think they're going to get us out by throwing OUR tax dollars into the black hole called the North American car industry? If they REALLY wanted to help out displaced auto-workers, they'd be working with Toyota and Honda to purchase and retrofit the shut-down NA factories and start producing the cars the population is ACTUALLY buying.
The people are sheep, and these politicians are the lions with a shepherd's cane. The best thing the government can do with the economy is leave things the alone and let it correct itself. This mess is just the economy clearing up a government clog in it's arteries. It'll sort itself out within the year and things will be hunky-dory all over again. |
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| exstasie |
| quote: | Originally posted by Spam
This won't happen because the Liberals will NOT agree on who gets to be leader of said coalition anyway. There's still tons of in-fighting within the Liberal caucus, and they sure as hell don't want DION as PM. So with that out of the way...
"Stimulus" packages don't work. They give the money to said companies, then those companies piss their money away (the reason they got into their mess in the first place) and no improvements are seen. Look at the first bundle of money the States handed out to their banks (instead of, you know, the people who gave the government that money in the first place... taxpayers?), it's gone now, and the market has been continuing to crash since they announced it. HMMMMMMMMM.
Am I the ONLY person in the world that read about all the government attempts to fix the economy during past recessions and depressions only to see those attempts fail? We go over like 3 main low-points in our economy in High School history, the only economic crisis that was fixed by a government was fixed by a government led by a man named Adolph Hitler... Government, realistically, has very little power over the economy. And the Liberals and New Democratic Liberals want to piss our tax-dollars away on car companies that are in trouble because of their own poor business models?
If they really wanted to help the long-term economy. They'd stop access to easy credit (which, luckily, our Canadian system has been better at than the American and Euro systems, which is why we aren't in the same mess they are, our mess is more a trickle-down from theirs). The great depression was sparked by the realization that a large % of credit owed to companies would not be paid because they were letting every idiot with a job purchase on credit. When the payments stopped... BAM economy crashed... Sound familiar? Why don't people ever learn?
THIS particular crash was started when the Clinton Democrats started to force mortgage companies and banks to give out mortgages to low-income families, all in the name of equality. A few years down the road, those low-income families realize "Hey, we can't afford this" and the payments stop... BAM economy crashes!
People blame the Republicans for not implementing any oversight or regulation. But it was the ing DEMOCRATS who got them into this mess to begin with. Liberal ideology got the ball rolling, and now a Canadian group of Liberals think they're going to get us out by throwing OUR tax dollars into the black hole called the North American car industry? If they REALLY wanted to help out displaced auto-workers, they'd be working with Toyota and Honda to purchase and retrofit the shut-down NA factories and start producing the cars the population is ACTUALLY buying.
The people are sheep, and these politicians are the lions with a shepherd's cane. The best thing the government can do with the economy is leave things the alone and let it correct itself. This mess is just the economy clearing up a government clog in it's arteries. It'll sort itself out within the year and things will be hunky-dory all over again. |
Dion will lead coalition
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/serv...y/National/home
Save us!
Can someone also tell me on why we should be voting at all? This shows that voting is absolutely pointless.
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| Yohan |
| quote: | Originally posted by exstasie
Can someone also tell me on why we should be voting at all? This shows that voting is absolutely pointless.
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this scenario is an exception, not regular occurance |
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| exstasie |
| quote: | Originally posted by Yohan
this scenario is an exception, not regular occurance |
Yeah, you are right that its definitely an exception, but it still doesn't instill any confidence into the practise of voting.
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| ChemEnhanced |
| quote: | Originally posted by exstasie
Can someone also tell me on why we should be voting at all? This shows that voting is absolutely pointless.
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The only thing this shows is how affective a minority Government actually is. Canadians have to figure out who they want to run the country and give them a majority government. The problem is Canadians are too lazy to get off their asses and actually vote. Another election now would solve nothing except maybe even less people showing up at the polls. |
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| Moral Hazard |
| quote: | Originally posted by ChemEnhanced
Another election now would solve nothing except maybe even less people showing up at the polls. |
I'd be fine with that provided it's the right people that don't show up. People bitch about low voter turn out, not me... our problem isn't low turn out... it's that too many people have the franchise. |
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| ChemEnhanced |
| quote: | Originally posted by Moral Hazard
I'd be fine with that provided it's the right people that don't show up. People bitch about low voter turn out, not me... our problem isn't low turn out... it's that too many people have the franchise. |
Unfortunately, I think there would still be a large amount of the wrong people not voting. Even I would consider not voting as a protest vote. |
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