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Meat eaters! Why do you eat other animals? (pg. 26)
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| Fledz |
| quote: | Originally posted by Lews
If my opinion was based solely on animal rights, for me the whole issue of eating meat would then just be entirely personal. Some people care and don't eat meat, some people don't care and eat it.
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| quote: | Originally posted by astroboy
Fair enough.
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No it's not. Don't let him get out of it so easily.
I'm going to go out on a limb and say that most of us do care about how animals are killed. We demand free range chickens, we ensure cattle are killed humanely as well as all other animals, we have animal groups designed to jail people who are cruel to animals, we try and minimise the suffering of all animals.
We don't need to though. There's no consequences to us not being humane to animals because we are a predator and they are our prey, and yet we still make sure we have some standards about how meat is created and distributed.
So in other words, most people do care and do still eat meat. You're just too stuck in a loop to realise that. |
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| pkcRAISTLIN |
| yeah, what fledz said. lews' insinuation that people who eat meat don't care about animals is ing bull hence my previous response. |
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| Clovis |
| Because steak is really ing good sometimes. |
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| lücid |
| quote: | Originally posted by Clovis
Because steak is really ing good sometimes. |
god Clovis you're so ing selfish! :mad: |
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| astroboy |
| quote: | Originally posted by Fledz
No it's not. Don't let him get out of it so easily.
I'm going to go out on a limb and say that most of us do care about how animals are killed. We demand free range chickens, we ensure cattle are killed humanely as well as all other animals, we have animal groups designed to jail people who are cruel to animals, we try and minimise the suffering of all animals.
We don't need to though. There's no consequences to us not being humane to animals because we are a predator and they are our prey, and yet we still make sure we have some standards about how meat is created and distributed.
So in other words, most people do care and do still eat meat. You're just too stuck in a loop to realise that. |
From my experience vegans anthropomorphise animals' experiences to the point of assigning them human psychological traits making the keeping of pets unethical - or the keeping of bees for the collection of honey. So by the word "care" he means something entirely different to you or I. Under his definition of care (that is to a ridiculous degree) it's true, I don't care. |
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| Gauss |
| quote: | Originally posted by Fledz
No it's not. Don't let him get out of it so easily.
I'm going to go out on a limb and say that most of us do care about how animals are killed. We demand free range chickens, we ensure cattle are killed humanely as well as all other animals, we have animal groups designed to jail people who are cruel to animals, we try and minimise the suffering of all animals.
We don't need to though. There's no consequences to us not being humane to animals because we are a predator and they are our prey, and yet we still make sure we have some standards about how meat is created and distributed.
So in other words, most people do care and do still eat meat. You're just too stuck in a loop to realise that. |
I like most of your posts.  And I don't think it has anything to do with my subjectiveness because you're Croatian. |
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| Fledz |
| quote: | Originally posted by Gauss
I like most of your posts. And I don't think it has anything to do with my subjectiveness because you're Croatian. |
When I was little I always kept saying I would be the President of Croatia. When it eventually happens, I expect your vote :tongue2
Though if that were to ever happen, the types of radical changes that I would want to make would probably result in me being assassinated within the first term :stongue: |
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| Arbiter |
| quote: | Originally posted by Fledz
I'm going to go out on a limb and say that most of us do care about how animals are killed. We demand free range chickens, we ensure cattle are killed humanely as well as all other animals, we have animal groups designed to jail people who are cruel to animals, we try and minimise the suffering of all animals.
We don't need to though. There's no consequences to us not being humane to animals because we are a predator and they are our prey, and yet we still make sure we have some standards about how meat is created and distributed.
So in other words, most people do care and do still eat meat. You're just too stuck in a loop to realise that. |
Meh, I just want my meat delivered in the highest quality, most economically efficient manner; in other words, I want the best meat for the lowest price. Why would I care if this entails animals suffering? I don't even care if it entails human suffering, I enjoy my sweatshop-manufactured property just fine, thanks.
I believe in the non-discrimination principle: there's no more inherent value to the life of my neighbor than there is to the lives of each individual bacterium I snuff out when I wash my hands. But, as astroboy pointed out, I have an incentive to permit my neighbor to continue to live since such restraint within our society contributes to its prosperity and yields a net benefit for all members. On the other hand, declining to wash my hands provides no such benefit, nor does caring about what animals might die or suffer in the process of my obtaining a good meal.
I agree with Lews to the extent that it is selfish on my part. Why would I want to be otherwise? I am evolved to be selfish because selfish organisms are superior to unselfish organisms. I must dissent from his characterization of this behavior as "lazy," however. There is no merit to expending more resources than necessary to produce the desired result, and declining to waste such resources cannot accurately be described as laziness. A more accurate charaterization would be efficient. |
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| Moral Hazard |
| quote: | Originally posted by astroboy
[color=limegreen]Innuit and Chukcha peoples eat more meat than any Westerner. They have almost no vegies in their diet.. all they eat is seal, walrus, whale and fish, the fat of the first three being particularly prized. They have low obesity, low blood cholesterol (with a high level of "good" cholesterol) and very low rates of the diseases you mentioned (heart disease and strokes in particular were almost unheard of in these communities until they started eating processed foods). |
Do you think that the low rates of heart disease may have anything to do with their low life expectancy (60-66 years), which would have been even shorter prior to the availability of processed food? |
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| MrJiveBoJingles |
| quote: | Originally posted by Arbiter
Meh, I just want my meat delivered in the highest quality, most economically efficient manner; in other words, I want the best meat for the lowest price. Why would I care if this entails animals suffering? I don't even care if it entails human suffering, I enjoy my sweatshop-manufactured property just fine, thanks. |
That may work for you, but a few people have a certain inconvenient, efficiency-hampering trait called empathy.
:p |
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| Moral Hazard |
| quote: | Originally posted by Fledz
That's a book, not a journal. The beauty of peer reviewed journals is the fact that they aren't published until approved by other scientists. |
You're right, it is a book. Perhaps you would prefer to read the 32 peer reviewed journal articals that came from the study instead.... I read both. Predictably, I found the journal articles more informative, as they omit Campbell's conjecture and opinion; however, the data is the same and the conclusions are ultimately the same... the book is more accessable for most though. |
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| Moral Hazard |
| quote: | Originally posted by astroboy
I'd say you're hard pressed to find vitamins A, B12 and D3 (not related substances and analogues like beta carotene, but the real biolavailable ) without meat. It can be done with supplements/pills if that's your thing. I prefer to eat as naturally as possible and try to avoid taking pills or other artificial products... but that aside. |
You can get all the B12 you need by not washing your veggies or eating a handful of soil every 5 years.... not that I would. BTW, for anyone who intends to go vegan... your liver stores B12 for 5 years, so you won't need to take b12 supplements for 5 years... and only if you actually go full on vegan. |
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