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GM declares bankruptcy (pg. 23)
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| spc |
| quote: | Originally posted by EddieZilker
I answered your questions with questions which demonstrated a feasible knowledge of the topic you raised in an effort to ascertain how well your position was qualified. Your position is currently unqualified and therefore you are refusing to recognize the validity of said questions.
Again, not a straw-man logical fallacy, more mediocre conjecture, and more evasion.
Strike two. |
This guy is winning the argument. |
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| elFreak |
| guido beats vol 3. |
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| spc |
| I never got around to making Volume 2 yet :( |
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| elFreak |
doombots posts are volume 2.
get on it:p |
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| EddieZilker |
| quote: | Originally posted by DOOMBOT| quote: | | Originally posted by DOOMBOT Either you'd like to explain why you believe recessions and depressions to have come about or not. It's quite simple. I'll leave the rest of the thread to you, until you can answer that simple question. |
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I have already, in providing a Socratic method of argument, demonstrated why I believe the depression of our current economic condition has come about. That you failed to recognize the questions I posed as valid and have refused to answer them three times, demonstrates sufficiently to me that you have no valid point to make in support of your poorly informed position.
Strike three. |
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| gehzumteufel |
| quote: | Originally posted by Lebezniatnikov
Sorry, I got carried away with my edit above, so I'm re-posting it here since the conversation kept moving.
Another con of the American system? Recessions make it even worse.
http://healthaffairs.org/blog/2009/...ricans-by-2010/
edit: show me another country with 300+ million people that has 20% without access to health care.
hint: not China -
http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/2...nt_11141889.htm
But you know what the real kicker is?
Our "ideal" government contribution to healthcare mimics what is actually happening in India(!) where over 700 million (!!!) people have NO access to health care whatsoever! And even China seems to realize that their current government contribution is too low to grant access to the entire population, and has upped coverage made available by the state. Just another example of the US falling behind China in innovation. |
Wouldn't the Chinese system be carrying out the very incomplete, but already voiced view of a two-tiered system that I was talking about? Correct me if I am wrong, but that is what I get from the Xinhua article.
I am by no means saying our system is fantastic, as it has an insane amount of room for improvement, but the system in the UK and Canada isn't any better either. |
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| gehzumteufel |
| quote: | Originally posted by DOOMBOT
I understand your concern but you have to realize why the cost for your care is so high to begin with. The fact of the matter is, medical care is very monopolized right now, which is driving the costs of the service and medicines so high. If there was a lot more competition and capital being used where people want it and need it, you would see the costs of these services and medicines go down. |
Are you really this deluded? While I don't disagree that the US government has stifled competition, if a whole industry is colluding with each other to everyone over, you think that prices will go down? You bet your ass they won't. |
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| winston |
| quote: | Originally posted by elFreak
maybe because all of these other countries immigration policies are more friendly than those from the united snakes? Notice the people killing themselves to get there and their geographical proximity to the united states. What a stupid argument, if people from Greenland want to come here they can take a plane.
The peso will be worth more than the us dollar in a few years, so mexicans will not risk their lives to be drug mules to a population that can no longer afford them. |
well said, elfreak.
'entitlement' is what is ruining the US and other western nations. However, I am a keen believer of 'democracy' (republican or democrat or what have you) and the U.S leads the way in this road to democracy against totalitarianism and communism. China is a country only fit for it's inhabitants, and even Europe with it's robust economy and vibrant tourist attractions (at least in some areas), it still lacks in comparison to certain aspects of the US culture (science and technology). No country is better than another, and in times like these investors have 'more options' (instead of choosing the obvious, as it has been seen for the past decades, the united states.) |
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| DOOMBOT |
| quote: | Originally posted by Krypton
BUSINESS CYCLES. They occur with or without government involvement. |
I absolutely agree with you. My point is the worst ones we have ever seen have been due to government involvement. The Panic of 1819, The Depression of 1920, The Great Depression, The Dot Com Boom, The Housing Boom, for examples. The only ones that ended quickly though, were the Panic of 1819 and the Depression of 1920, for example, because the government essentially backed off and let the market correct itself. The reason why The Great Depression lasted so long, for example, was because of the manipulation of interest rates and constant "bailouts" and of course other government involvement. If the government doesn't quit it with the bailouts and expansion of money in our economy with everything that is going on right now, we are headed right into the same thing or even worse. |
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| DOOMBOT |
| quote: | Originally posted by gehzumteufel
Are you really this deluded? While I don't disagree that the US government has stifled competition, if a whole industry is colluding with each other to everyone over, you think that prices will go down? You bet your ass they won't. |
But this is where you are backwards. Industries are colluding right now and have been for some time because of all the laws which have been passed and government involvement in the market place. Look at GM! They are going to be making cars in ways that the government sees fit, not what the consumer demands! In a free market you have the opposite we have today. You have businesses that are forced to meet consumer demand or go right out of business. The power is in the hand of the consumer because their wealth isn't being spread around due to political interest. |
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| Kinezi |
| quote: | Originally posted by Krypton
You said Halliburton is going to replace GM. FAIL. |
Okay, I fail you win, but that does not mean you are not an , look at the you pull off in this thread. |
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| gehzumteufel |
| quote: | Originally posted by DOOMBOT
But this is where you are backwards. Industries are colluding right now and have been for some time because of all the laws which have been passed and government involvement in the market place. Look at GM! They are going to be making cars in ways that the government sees fit, not what the consumer demands! In a free market you have the opposite we have today. You have businesses that are forced to meet consumer demand or go right out of business. The power is in the hand of the consumer because their wealth isn't being spread around due to political interest. |
GM and Chrysler are exceptions not the rule. The health insurance industry is NOT going to get any better if the government all of a sudden lets all the controls go. It will get way worse. |
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