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GM declares bankruptcy (pg. 4)
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| Moongoose |
Go to France (or any european country for that matter, but since its french made...) and take a drive in a Citroen C6. Then talk to me about ride quality :) You could throw this one off a cliff and it would still be comfortable enough that there woudnt be any spillage from your champagne flute. As for safety buy a Volvo. You cant destroy those things with a nuke.
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| Domesticated |
| quote: | Originally posted by The17sss
Some are, but they get a worse rap then they deserve. I've seen the death boxes people in other countries drive and I'll take American over a good portion of them. I have a Ford F-150 with the full size 4 door cab for a few years now and I've never had a problem with it... sturdy as hell and rides better than any car I've ever had. |
:wtf:
You are a prime example of what I'm talking about.
You obviously live in the city and work a white-collar job, so WHY, WHY, WHY do you need to drive a two tonne truck? People like you piss me off to no end. As far as I'm concerned, Hummers, F-150s, Cadillacs and all SUVs should be taken off people who don't truly need them for work, to move a large family, to tow a boat or to drive off road (i.e 95% of the people who drive those kinds of cars). You are a classless retard. |
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| ziptnf |
| quote: | Originally posted by Domesticated
:wtf:
You are a prime example of what I'm talking about.
You obviously live in the city and work a white-collar job, so WHY, WHY, WHY do you need to drive a two tonne truck? People like you piss me off to no end. As far as I'm concerned, Hummers, F-150s, Cadillacs and all SUVs should be taken off people who don't truly need them for work, to move a large family, to tow a boat or to drive off road (i.e 95% of the people who drive those kinds of cars). You are a classless retard. |
Just playing Devil's Advocate here, but who says he doesn't use it for his hobbies and ? Not everybody always has to move, but I'm sure he's the first person his friends call when they need to move furniture or help tow something. Trucks like F-150's are pretty useful, I doubt he uses his truck for purposes it was built for ALL the time, but I'm sure he could sometimes use it. I doubt you could help move your friend's apartment in an old beat up Acura. |
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| miamitranceman |
FYI, the best selling vehicle in the US in the month of March '09 was...the new Ford Fusion and it's hybrid variant. Yes, it sold more than Honda and Toyota.
The new Chevy Malibu has consistently won best in class over the Camry and Accord.
The new Cadillac CTS was Motor Trend Car of the Year in '08. The "V" variant (556 hp) just won a comparison test against an M5 in Motor Trend as well.
The Corvette continues to be the best bang for the buck in terms of sports car value. The new Camaro is an all around ratings winner in RS and SS forms.
There's more but you get the picture. Being able to cut the fat and focus on their positives will help them claw back in a few years.
But to say they're now and not worth saving is just ridiculous.
As for SUVs/pickups...yes they're a lot of people driving them that don't need that size or power, and GM paid the price for investing too much in them in at the turn of the century. But they're learning and will come back stronger for it. |
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| dj_alfi |
| quote: | Originally posted by The17sss
LOL. when has the government owning and running ANYTHING ever amounted to "win"? |
The Norwegian gvt has been running alot of oil drilling and I can't really say they have been doing a terrible job at it.
| quote: | | (see your local post office, social security office, DMV, Dept. of Social Services, public school system,..........). |
How is this in any way related to your argument.
You make a list of public services and ask if any of them are profitable? They're not supposed to be, you rtard. |
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| ziptnf |
| quote: | Originally posted by dj_alfi
How is this in any way related to your argument.
You make a list of public services and ask if any of them are profitable? They're not supposed to be, you rtard. |
I think his point is that the American government can't pump enough money into these programs, so they suck. Public School systems in America are light years behind the likes of China, Japan, and most other countries. The DMV... well if you've ever been to one, you understand. 15 year old computers and data software, poor methods of organizing things, etc. If we weren't so far in debt, we could probably afford better equipment and in government funded public services. |
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| The17sss |
| quote: | Originally posted by ziptnf
I think his point is that the American government can't pump enough money into these programs, so they suck. Public School systems in America are light years behind the likes of China, Japan, and most other countries. The DMV... well if you've ever been to one, you understand. 15 year old computers and data software, poor methods of organizing things, etc. If we weren't so far in debt, we could probably afford better equipment and in government funded public services. |
Correct... and to take it even a step further, lets use the example of the post office. First of all, the post office isn't public service Dj Alfi "you turd", it's a business operated by the government. It needs to make a profit to meet payroll, do marketing and advertising, etc. The never perform their service as well as FedEx, or DHL, or UPS and this is seen by the thousands of customers they continue to lose each year. So what is their answer to fixing the poor management and operation? Raise the price on stamps constantly to make up for the lost revanue... instead of purging the dead weight and ushering in a different management style and new innovation. If you go into there, or the DMV, Social Security Office, etc. you will see a bunch of unmotivated people who don't like their job and do a poor job at it. State government jobs for job security and benefits. Similar private sector business models (to the post office) are just run better. |
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| The17sss |
| quote: | Originally posted by Domesticated
:wtf:
You are a prime example of what I'm talking about.
You obviously live in the city and work a white-collar job, so WHY, WHY, WHY do you need to drive a two tonne truck? People like you piss me off to no end. As far as I'm concerned, Hummers, F-150s, Cadillacs and all SUVs should be taken off people who don't truly need them for work, to move a large family, to tow a boat or to drive off road (i.e 95% of the people who drive those kinds of cars). You are a classless retard. |
I don't need to... I want to, I enjoy it, and I should not have my choice of vehicles limited by some government bureacracy. It's a common aspect of freedom that's overlooked... you should check into it sometime. Do you think people want to buy and drive the types of cars that are about to be forced on them? no... which is why they are being forced by CAFE standards thanks to Obama.
I spend a ton of time in my car because of what I do for work, and I love having a car with a lot of space inside and strong enough where I don't even sweat the thought of getting into an accident. When I moved from FL to NC it was an invaluable tool, and when I have to drive around the mountains of NC on certain projects in winter time, the 4 wheel drive factor is a necessity. What do you think will happen when we're forced to drive those little lawn mowers around? Traffic deaths are going to skyrocket. God your thick. Usually you're comments are money but you're just an idiot with this one. |
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| Moongoose |
| quote: | Originally posted by The17sss
What do you think will happen when we're forced to drive those little lawn mowers around? Traffic deaths are going to skyrocket. God your thick. Usually you're comments are money but you're just an idiot with this one. |
Well, if youre driving a three tonne truck and the other guy that hits you is driving a three tonne truck youre not going to be that better off as if youre driving a tiny european hatchback and the other guy is driving a tiny european hatchback :) |
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| gehzumteufel |
| quote: | Originally posted by The17sss
strong enough where I don't even sweat the thought of getting into an accident. |
I absolutely despise this mentality. Why? Everyone that says this drives a truck or SUV. And then we end up with nasty fatalities when these types get into accidents with people like me in smaller cars. And then we are the ones that are the problem because we don't drive a car that was 5.5k lbs and 9ft off the ground.
You gotta change your mindset on this. If everyone drove smaller cars for the most part, there would be no need for this. You can't wait for people to change though. You have to be an example of this change.
*edit: changed "because we drove" to "because we don't drive" |
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| The17sss |
| quote: | Originally posted by gehzumteufel
I absolutely despise this mentality. Why? Everyone that says this drives a truck or SUV. And then we end up with nasty fatalities when these types get into accidents with people like me in smaller cars. And then we are the ones that are the problem because we drove a car that was 5.5k lbs and 9ft off the ground.
You gotta change your mindset on this. If everyone drove smaller cars for the most part, there would be no need for this. You can't wait for people to change though. You have to be an example of this change. |
Don't give me that "you have to be an example of change" stuff. So what if I say my vehicle is more safe? It's true. And I don't buy a car solely for that reason, it's just an added great bonus to driving the car I want to drive. People buying and driving large SUV's doesn't by fiat make them drive more recklessly and/or faster thereby causing more nasty fatalities. If 2 smart cars collide head on at 30 mph, and 2 Escalades collide at 30 mph, you're telling me there's no difference? lol. In fact, CNBC points out this inconvenient fact for you:
| quote: | | "The key to better mileage is lighter-weight cars -- in which people die more often in traffic accidents. Since CAFE passed in 1975, smaller cars have killed almost 50,000 more people than otherwise would have died on the roads, the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration," (which is an arm of our government). |
And that was in 2002! Are you getting that? 50,000 more people have died that otherwise wouldn't because of driving boxes in the spirit of getting higher gas mileage (and how many of them I wonder have those cars to 'save the environment'?). It's not like all the large cars/SUV's will disappear either... there will always be a mix of vehicles on the road. But sorry man, but you're simply more safe in an SUV than in a Mini Cooper or Smart Car, as much as you don't want to admit it. Continued:
| quote: | | CAFE kills up to 3,900 extra people each year, a study by Harvard and the Brookings Institution states.It finds that for every 100 pounds less that an auto weighs, up to 780 more people die in traffic accidents in a year. |
http://www.cnbc.com/id/30850102
See what I'm saying? Interesting- CAFE standards lead to about 3,900 extra deaths per year... almost as much as our soldiers during 6 years in Iraq... and they are being forced even more strict on us in the near future. That's an unintended consequence of a liberal policy for ya. |
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| gehzumteufel |
| quote: | Originally posted by The17sss
blah blah |
You missed it man. Totally. By like 100 miles. SUV v small car = owned. Which is what I said. Re-read my post. ;) |
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