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Please post a sample of a bad Tiesto mix (pg. 17)
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| A.J. |
| quote: | | 1) That, above all other genres, trance fans are the most ignorant, so they don't really care or know what they like so long as it sounds pretty, which all trance is apt to doing by default. |
* Whatever helps you sleep at night........
:stongue: :stongue: :stongue: :stongue: :stongue:
*You probably have a valid point when referring to most trance fans* |
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| Aiwendil |
| quote: | Originally posted by montana
kent, i have them, and no, i'm not going to give them to you. now do ta a favour and shutup and go back to your site and continue mocking us because we are never getting the plot. who cares. these threads always end up a head to head battle between the 4 usuals (and on occasion unwordly). oh and radagast, i must say, i did really like you better when you wasn't ripping of everything ishkur ever wrote and thought it was cool listening to 4 strings and atb because they were your favourite dj's |
no |
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| Clovis86 |
| quote: | Originally posted by Aiwendil
no |
ok |
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| Ishkur |
| quote: | Originally posted by Pio
No, I've just been defending personal, subjective appreciation based on context and circumstances over your absolute universal truisms.
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And you can't do that, since under your relativism you must respect my view of things, and under my absolutism, I don't have to respect yours.
Everything is equal under the eyes of non-committal authority. Everyone is right all the time!
| quote: | Originally posted by Pio
Selectah! Most trance DJs don't do it, but it's theoretically possible, especially when the DJ goes beyond trance.
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We're not talking about woulda coulda shoulda. Leave theory out of this. We're talking about what they DO, and what they DON'T DO.
And what is it, exactly, that they do? Nothing. Not a thing. At least nothing that warrants adulation and praise usually reserved for the second coming.
| quote: | Originally posted by Pio
No, but that's why he plays techier in Colombia (a country with a huge techno scene) and funkier in a private party in Prague....adapting to circumstance and context.
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No he doesn't. Now you're just out and out lying. He played the exact same TiC set in 50 different locations. He doesn't even carry enough records for spontaneous improvisation.
Hey, If these trance DJs are such great crowd readers, how come none of them have been able to "conquer" America? Each one of them has come forth embarking on a North American tour saying they will be the one to finall break through, and each of them in turn--Oakie, Pvd, Tiesto, they all fall flat. Why is that? ....why can't they figure out America if they're supposed to be these genius crowd readers? Can't they figure out what the American people want?
You are free to think up any reason you want, but here's my theory: America has a much much MUCH lower tolerance for bull than Europe. They do not put up with much; euro disney circus sideshows from Europe are a ing joke to the US music industry. They do not suffer fools, twits, or ego-driven dutchtards. Either bring something of actual substance to the table, or off.
But that's just one theory. You may have many more to account for this gross inadequacy.
| quote: | Originally posted by Pio
Are you saying that because I prefer Swedish house mafia electro-house than trance these days?
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No, I'm saying that it took you several years to finally get tired of the anthems and move on, when it should have taken you a few months, tops.
| quote: | Originally posted by Pio
The social construct of the scale has been historically different in the West than the East. Why is that a fact if not for the relative context of the humanistic experiences in the different regions?
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That has to do with aparatus' employed and environment. Not culture.
| quote: | Originally posted by Pio
As I said before, I always thought that a rolling bassline was a bassline that moved forward rhythmically faster than the quarter note kick, effectively having a rolling effect. But i haven't read about the term from any authoritative source, so enlighten me if I'm wrong.
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Since everything's sequenced to 4/4 timing, saying something moves forward faster in dance music (especially in trance...and ESPECIALLY Gouryella) is meaningless. Unless you're talking about basslines that are in 6/4 against a 4/4 groove, which I believe there are some actual jungle tracks that do this. And Jazz. But no trance that I know of, though I believe BT tried a triplet once, and it was a turd. Rolling bassline actually refers to its texture, feel and quality, not musical notation, which is probably why it isn't a scientific term, and there is no actual source for it.
Go listen to Rawthang - Beautiful Morning. One of the most delicious rolling basslines I've ever heard.
Hell, gn my music guide, in the jungle section, there is a genre called Darkstep. It has eight samples. All eight of those are rolling basslines.
| quote: | Originally posted by Pio
They were "mimicking" American music, but the outcome of their interpretation didn't turn out exactly as autoctonous American music. Come on, Bangalter's productions don't sound American! The influences are obvious...but the product is cheesy Euro fun. It's the heart and soul of the music, something that cannot be judged according to any absolute value.
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If Bangalter was truly reaching into his french heritage to co-opt American music, you would've heard mandolins, french horns, and accordians everywhere. No. He was a Parisian intellectual, and they are so snooty they are too snooty even for France. Which is why it is part of his (and theirs) particular character, to snub their own culture to go join someone elses. In a manner of speaking. He was recrafting American funk music in his own style. Stop giving so much credit to France. Jesus tapdancing Christ.
There are wonderful exceptions.....but I wouldn't trust white people with making any amount of funk or cultivating a culture of funk. They just don't get it. As I see you don't either.
Sorry, but I don't buy it. French house rules, actually, for the fact that it's not euro. That's why Daft Punk are more popular stateside than Dutch trance, and they've barely tried to be.
| quote: | Originally posted by Pio
cultural aesthetics, which include environment and exposure.
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You're redefining your premise now. Stop that.
| quote: | Originally posted by Pio
At what time did monkeys become human?
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They didn't.
| quote: | Originally posted by Pio
And I've never lied about Dutch trance being cheese or not. Of course it is! It is Gouda! |
But it pretends its not, and that's what's so damn offensive about it.
Own up to your stupid shortcomings, trancecrackers. It's the only way. |
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| SYSTEM-J |
| quote: | Originally posted by Ishkur
You are free to think up any reason you want, but here's my theory: America has a much much MUCH lower tolerance for bull than Europe. They do not put up with much; euro disney circus sideshows from Europe are a ing joke to the US music industry. They do not suffer fools, twits, or ego-driven dutchtards. Either bring something of actual substance to the table, or off.
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Oh this . You're just pulling vitiolic theory out of your ass to keep up some momentum here. Lower tolerance for bull? Your whole ing continent is controlled by men in board rooms. You actually think trance is marketed as an excuse to its popularity, and you come out and tell us that America has no tolerance for this bull? I could ing sell my dog's breathing patterns to the US if I gave it a good looking person to front the show and slapped it on some billboards. |
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| Ishkur |
| quote: | Originally posted by SYSTEM-J
Oh this . You're just pulling vitiolic theory out of your ass to keep up some momentum here. Lower tolerance for bull? Your whole ing continent is controlled by men in board rooms. You actually think trance is marketed as an excuse to its popularity, and you come out and tell us that America has no tolerance for this bull? I could ing sell my dog's breathing patterns to the US if I gave it a good looking person to front the show and slapped it on some billboards. |
America took one look at Dutch Trance and collectively said "You have got to be ing kidding me. Fiddy Cent is ing Mozart compared to these crackers."
And that's good enough for me. |
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| A.J. |
| You've got to be joking. |
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| SYSTEM-J |
You're ing white, Ishkur. You're Canadian. Stop saying "cracker" as if you have some superior sense of rhythm.
You keep insisting that this is for giggles, but I can't seem to go anywhere on the Internet without finding you cutting and pasting one of your rants there. You don't adapt for anyone, you just keep repeating the same and turning all comic if it threatens to go off the rails. I used to enjoy sparring with you, but you don't have a laugh. It looks more and more like your rants, arguments and soapboxes are just some Internet-wide ego-masturbating crusade. You don't ing care what the other side is saying, you just care that people are hearing what you're saying.
Do you even realise how far you've gone? If you're out to win this argument, you're burning down your own side as fast as you're building it, and if you're just out to " up" then the only people buying it are as mindless as the trancecrackers you spend so much time stomping on. You won't change history with your snarky ramblings, and you're rapidly running out of laughs too. Give it a rest for once, Jesus H Christ. |
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| A.J. |
^ ^ ^
By the way, you are just inviting another reply from Ishkur with that comment.
If he really does aggravate you so much, then I think this best course of action would be to simply stop reading and stop giving him attention.
Personally, I enjoy the contributions of Ishkur onto this website. I disagree with many of his assertions, but at least he is introducing a little bit of intellectual debate onto tranceaddict (if such a thing is even possible amongst all the ignorant trancecrackers :stongue: ;) ) |
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| SYSTEM-J |
| It was intellectual debate three years ago. Unless it's some incredibly deep analogy of epic trance's formulaeic structure that motivates his gob-e repeats of faded old arguments, it's not intelligent any more. It's 15 pages of one guy telling himself how ing good at this Internet Debate lark he is. Is TA an ego trip? |
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| A.J. |
| quote: | Originally posted by SYSTEM-J
Is TA an ego trip? |
You may have a point there. |
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| Pio |
| quote: | Originally posted by Ishkur
And you can't do that, since under your relativism you must respect my view of things, and under my absolutism, I don't have to respect yours.
Everything is equal under the eyes of non-committal authority. Everyone is right all the time! |
Fair enough. I respect your views and that's why I've been an avid reader of your site and guide for years. It doesn't mean that I have to agree on everything you say though, since I think your dogmatism is extremely flawed.
| quote: | We're not talking about woulda coulda shoulda. Leave theory out of this. We're talking about what they DO, and what they DON'T DO.
And what is it, exactly, that they do? Nothing. Not a thing. At least nothing that warrants adulation and praise usually reserved for the second coming.
No he doesn't. Now you're just out and out lying. He played the exact same TiC set in 50 different locations. He doesn't even carry enough records for spontaneous improvisation. |
He has enough tracks to do this. Didn't you see the tracklist I posted? That's not your typical Tiësto set, not even from the last two months.
He sure doesn't do it as often and hasn't done it at all the last few times I've seen him spin...but Tiësto has typically stood out from Ferry and Armin and the bunch for precisely being unpredictable. I don't care if you think I'm lying, but this is truly my personal appreciation.
| quote: | | Hey, If these trance DJs are such great crowd readers, how come none of them have been able to "conquer" America? Each one of them has come forth embarking on a North American tour saying they will be the one to finall break through, and each of them in turn--Oakie, Pvd, Tiesto, they all fall flat. Why is that? ....why can't they figure out America if they're supposed to be these genius crowd readers? Can't they figure out what the American people want? |
They've all made millions in America. Actually, I can't enjoy myself at all at a superstar dj night at a club in any major American city these days precisely because the fame of these guys has gotten too big for even the superclubs of cities like NYC or Miami. Those parties are full of ginos and other clueless people that take their shirts off and ruin the atmosphere for everybody else. And worst of all, people are paying $50 for a 3 hour set in a party they have to wait 2 hours in line to get into. A year ago or so I saw PvD play in a midsized club in Amsterdam and I only had to pay about 15 euro to get in, and the club wasn't packed at all. In fact, it was very comfortable and people were just minding their own business dancing to the music. That sort of situation would be unimaginable in New York, or in my homeland Puerto Rico. PvD is doing a stadium party for 10,000 people in a month and the billboards advertising the event are visible all over the island, an American colony.
| quote: | You are free to think up any reason you want, but here's my theory: America has a much much MUCH lower tolerance for bull than Europe. They do not put up with much; euro disney circus sideshows from Europe are a ing joke to the US music industry. They do not suffer fools, twits, or ego-driven dutchtards. Either bring something of actual substance to the table, or off.
But that's just one theory. You may have many more to account for this gross inadequacy. |
Their videos might not be playing in American MTV, but read above. America is still a goldmine for the trance cracker exploiters.
| quote: | | That has to do with aparatus' employed and environment. Not culture. |
The instruments are a product of a particular culture. Your theory would be laughed at by any respectable musicologist and historian in academia.
| quote: | Since everything's sequenced to 4/4 timing, saying something moves forward faster in dance music (especially in trance...and ESPECIALLY Gouryella) is meaningless. Unless you're talking about basslines that are in 6/4 against a 4/4 groove, which I believe there are some actual jungle tracks that do this. And Jazz. But no trance that I know of, though I believe BT tried a triplet once, and it was a turd. Rolling bassline actually refers to its texture, feel and quality, not musical notation, which is probably why it isn't a scientific term, and there is no actual source for it.
Go listen to Rawthang - Beautiful Morning. One of the most delicious rolling basslines I've ever heard.
Hell, gn my music guide, in the jungle section, there is a genre called Darkstep. It has eight samples. All eight of those are rolling basslines. |
Oh darkstep, of course. Dieselboy is probably the DJ I've seen the most in my life. But a very common factor in darkstep is the half-step bassline (with a few deviations), so that's what you mean with rolling bassline. Alright, that makes sense. I always thought of it and heard the term applied in a much more general way.
| quote: | | If Bangalter was truly reaching into his french heritage to co-opt American music, you would've heard mandolins, french horns, and accordians everywhere. No. He was a Parisian intellectual, and they are so snooty they are too snooty even for France. Which is why it is part of his (and theirs) particular character, to snub their own culture to go join someone elses. In a manner of speaking. He was recrafting American funk music in his own style. Stop giving so much credit to France. Jesus tapdancing Christ. |
I'm not saying that Bangalter was reaching into his heritage at all. But the outcome of what he produced in the process of "recrafting American funk music in his own style" had a natural French essence, just like the outcome of the music made by impressionist composers while recrafting oriental music at the turn of the 19th century.
| quote: | | There are wonderful exceptions.....but I wouldn't trust white people with making any amount of funk or cultivating a culture of funk. They just don't get it. As I see you don't either. |
I'm Latin American. Flavor can't be rationalized, and I wouldn't trust much white people rationalizing any music with soul or flavor.
| quote: | | You're redefining your premise now. Stop that. |
No I'm not. This is going nowhere.
| quote: | But it pretends its not, and that's what's so damn offensive about it.
Own up to your stupid shortcomings, trancecrackers. It's the only way. |
But I don't pretend it is, that's what matters to me. |
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