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So much for unlimited internet ! (pg. 39)
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| Orko |
| quote: | Originally posted by CAKE
and then BEll/Rogers will up the rates of how much they charge to rent their lines to these unlimited providers, and we'll see how true they are to their clinets then. Its not cheap to lay fiberoptic cable across canada. |
The above article states that the cost per line is a regulated figure, so they cannot just raise their prices to the independent re-sellers. |
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| CAKE |
| quote: | Originally posted by Orko
The above article states that the cost per line is a regulated figure, so they cannot just raise their prices to the independent re-sellers. |
There is always a way, and im sure they’ll start looking for one if it start costing the big guys customers and revenue because of strain on the network, how about they don’t renew the contract someone like techsavy has when it runs out ? what then ? or add a charge for delivery, maintenance, system access.... do you really think Rogers and Bell are just watch as someone who is costing them money is using their network to do so ? |
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| Orko |
| quote: | Originally posted by CAKE
There is always a way, and im sure they’ll start looking for one if it start costing the big guys customers and revenue because of strain on the network, how about they don’t renew the contract someone like techsavy has when it runs out ? what then ? or add a charge for delivery, maintenance, system access.... do you really think Rogers and Bell are just watch as someone who is costing them money is using their network to do so ? |
You do know what regulated means right? They cannot just add charges on their own whim. They would have to prove their cost of operations went up, in order to have any extra fees approved.
The line fee is setup, so that all costs are covered for Bell/Rogers to deliver to the ISP, and they get a small profit on each subscriber. So if you are with Tecksavvy, Bell still earns a profit with each subscriber.
Again, their agreement with the CRTC states, that for Bell/Rogers to operate as an ISP they must rent out their lines. They cannot, not renew a contract if the independents have played within the rules and met all contractual obligations.
I understand what you are trying to say, but what you have said is not really possible the way you describe it. |
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| zyklon-jay |
| quote: | Originally posted by CAKE
and then BEll/Rogers will up the rates of how much they charge to rent their lines to these unlimited providers, and we'll see how true they are to their clinets then. Its not cheap to lay fiberoptic cable across canada. |
what about our tax dollars that went into that infrastructure?
let me guess, you work for one of providers, best guess is in "customer service". |
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| CAKE |
| quote: | Originally posted by zyklon-jay
what about our tax dollars that went into that infrastructure?
let me guess, you work for one of providers, best guess is in "customer service". |
Yes I do work for one of the providers, there will always be providers who try to under cut the BIG guys and offer a lower price for similar service. That’s great we need that out there gives people choice to see what other providers have to offer. Not everyone has to be on Bell or Rogers
but..
Similar thing is happening with cell providers. As in an article out this week in the Financial Post, its been 2 years since wireless providers have come on the market with the Wind & Mobility unlimited voice & data plans. They make up 3% of the market place. |
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| CAKE |
| quote: | Originally posted by Orko
You do know what regulated means right? They cannot just add charges on their own whim. They would have to prove their cost of operations went up, in order to have any extra fees approved.
The line fee is setup, so that all costs are covered for Bell/Rogers to deliver to the ISP, and they get a small profit on each subscriber. So if you are with Tecksavvy, Bell still earns a profit with each subscriber.
Again, their agreement with the CRTC states, that for Bell/Rogers to operate as an ISP they must rent out their lines. They cannot, not renew a contract if the independents have played within the rules and met all contractual obligations.
I understand what you are trying to say, but what you have said is not really possible the way you describe it. |
yeah i know know :P |
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| Orko |
| quote: | Originally posted by CAKE
Similar thing is happening with cell providers. As in an article out this week in the Financial Post, its been 2 years since wireless providers have come on the market with the Wind & Mobility unlimited voice & data plans. They make up 3% of the market place. |
If the new guys can stay alive for another few years, that rate will greatly change.
Before the new carriers came in, the big Telcos tried to get as many of their subscribers on to long, costly contracts with massive cancellation fees.
As those contracts come due (as mine will in Feb) I think a lot of people will start to switch over. I can save $50 a month (!) by switching to Wind/Moblicity. |
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| LightsOut |
| quote: | Originally posted by CAKE
Similar thing is happening with cell providers. As in an article out this week in the Financial Post, its been 2 years since wireless providers have come on the market with the Wind & Mobility unlimited voice & data plans. They make up 3% of the market place. |
The problem with these smaller providers is that they were suppose to come in a provide competition to the big boys.
But, when you look at their plans and compare them to Rogers/Bell/Telus, usually they're all around the same price, or just slightly cheaper. The only difference is that you can go month to month instead of locking into a 3 year. But, that's a double edged sword because you won't be getting your hardware subsidized.
I have yet to see a single new carrier seriously undercut the big boys, in terms of price-point and included features. Until someone steps up to the plate and does that, we'll continue to pay through the roof here. |
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| ChemEnhanced |
| quote: | Originally posted by LightsOut
The problem with these smaller providers is that they were suppose to come in a provide competition to the big boys.
But, when you look at their plans and compare them to Rogers/Bell/Telus, usually they're all around the same price, or just slightly cheaper. The only difference is that you can go month to month instead of locking into a 3 year. But, that's a double edged sword because you won't be getting your hardware subsidized.
I have yet to see a single new carrier seriously undercut the big boys, in terms of price-point and included features. Until someone steps up to the plate and does that, we'll continue to pay through the roof here. |
and why would any of them want to seriously undercut the big boys? In the end profit margins are the be all and end all when it comes to any business. I'm sure they've had their number crunchers figure out what price point maximizes their profits. |
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| LightsOut |
Then why open the market up in the first place? Might as well just have three carriers then, if the new guys aren't going to do anything differently.
If Wind and Mobilicity really are sitting at just 3% market share, surely undercutting the big boys would result in a much higher share increase.
I think that 3% is probably accurate. And it's not surprising. Like I said, you can look at any Wind/Mobilicity/Koodo plan and you can find an almost identical plan from Bell/Rogers/Telus. The wireless market in Canada was made open for competition so this Oligopoly would cease to exist and consumers would benefit as wireless rates fell. A few years into this experiment, and all plans/features/pricing amongst all carriers are still almost identical and Canadians continue to pay some of the highest rates for cellular service and features in the World. |
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| CAKE |
| quote: | Originally posted by Orko
If the new guys can stay alive for another few years, that rate will greatly change.
Before the new carriers came in, the big Telcos tried to get as many of their subscribers on to long, costly contracts with massive cancellation fees.
As those contracts come due (as mine will in Feb) I think a lot of people will start to switch over. I can save $50 a month (!) by switching to Wind/Moblicity. |
People will always switch and shop around, about 5% of customers switch providers with in their 3 yr term to always get the new customer deals and cheap hardware not matter what is offered to stay. Bell and Rogers has always offered no term price plans just like koodo/wind, the only time a contract is put in place is when a customer wants subsidized hardware as they offer top of line devices that can run $400-$800, so the no contract thing has been around for years. Also a lot adults don’t care about a monthly cost difference of $5-$20 when they know they have 24/7 support, onsite techs, retail stores not a stand in the mall, handset replacement programs, benefits of having a discount because of multiple produces etc.
These companies are here to appeal to customers who care most about the bottom dollar amount just like McDonalds has $1.39 value menu. Go to the Keg and tell them that McDonalds is under cutting them. Certain Canadians also prefer brand because Rogers/Bell are Canadian based companies that employ Canadians and keep our up the economy. Also there are the sub brands Bell/TELUS and Rogers/Fido/chattar that compete with the value brands.
And these are just a few points about residential not even going to start with corporations that have contracts 50 000 lines …
Competition will always be around |
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| Orko |
| quote: | Originally posted by CAKE
People will always switch and shop around, about 5% of customers switch providers with in their 3 yr term to always get the new customer deals and cheap hardware not matter what is offered to stay. Bell and Rogers has always offered no term price plans just like koodo/wind, the only time a contract is put in place is when a customer wants subsidized hardware as they offer top of line devices that can run $400-$800, so the no contract thing has been around for years. Also a lot adults don’t care about a monthly cost difference of $5-$20 when they know they have 24/7 support, onsite techs, retail stores not a stand in the mall, handset replacement programs, benefits of having a discount because of multiple produces etc.
These companies are here to appeal to customers who care most about the bottom dollar amount just like McDonalds has $1.39 value menu. Go to the Keg and tell them that McDonalds is under cutting them. Certain Canadians also prefer brand because Rogers/Bell are Canadian based companies that employ Canadians and keep our up the economy. Also there are the sub brands Bell/TELUS and Rogers/Fido/chattar that compete with the value brands.
And these are just a few points about residential not even going to start with corporations that have contracts 50 000 lines …
Competition will always be around |
So much false information in this post, it is crazy.
Let see:
- as a consumer, you do not get onsite techs, nor is there an SLA. You didn't state there was an SLA, but claiming there are onsite techs, implies there is an SLA.
- retail stores are not owned by Rogers or bell, they are contracted out. Most of the time when you go in, they refer you to 'corporate' which is somebody on the phone.
- Moblicity, Wind and Public mobile are Canadian companies.
- Adults certainly do care about $5-20, especially when it is per month, over multiple contracts for family members.
- Comparing telco providers to keg vs mcdonalds? HAHA. If you wanted a better comparison, it would be mom&pop burger place vs mcdonalds. The quality is the same, the coverage is different.
- Bell and Telus are not subsidiaries of each other. They are totally different companies that rent each other's infrastructure.
Man your response is like talking to a Rogers customer sales rep...oh wait... |
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