Originally posted by hardcore trancer
Are you suggesting that the people should not potest? Peotesting is our democractic right, If anything the cops are the ones breaking the law by not allowing the people to express themselves.
i'm all for peaceful protests following the law
US/Can govt seems to think otherwise
Nrg2Nfinit
oh no... my 500 dollar hipster glasses!
LOL
jon jon
more fun stuff
Elendil
quote:
Originally posted by ChemEnhanced
The students got exactly what they deserve. They were told to move or they would get pepper sprayed. The police only pepper sprayed the students that were blocking the pathway and not all of the students protesting. Just because people are protesting "peacefully" doesn't give them the right to disobey without consequence. It is much safer for the police officers to move the students when they have been pepper sprayed then it is when they haven't. If anything the cops help prevented the situation from escalating.
Told to move or be pepper sprayed? Why not simply "move or be arrested". I mean, isn't pepper spraying someone reserved for taking down violent or otherwise unruly individuals, rather than simply something you threaten with without proper physical justification?
I mean, how could spraying a bunch of students sitting down actually prevent a situation from escalating? When was the last time that someone committed an unnecessary violent act on you - say, punching you in the face - and actually prevented the situation from escalating?
I'm all for busting out the tasers, batons and whatever else is necessary if the officer is in danger or if the scenario generally warrants it, but I can't possibly see how this is one of those occasions.
pkcRAISTLIN
quote:
Originally posted by Elendil
Actually, it is pretty brutal. Not really from the perspective of the damage inflicted; that's fairly minor. However, It's brutal for me to watch a person in an unchallengeable position of authority blatantly operating outside of his mandate,
what do you mean 'outside its mandate'? police forces have been lawfully (and unlawfully) used as tools of public order for as long as police forces have existed. hell, marx will tell you the police are an instrument of the ruling class. if these people were real radicals they shouldn't be surprised by the outcome.
quote:
Originally posted by jon jon
these protestors were creative/ peaceful and the law allows that...
to the best of my knowledge no country's freedom of assembly laws allow people to protest whenever they want, however they want, and for as long as they want.
pkcRAISTLIN
quote:
Originally posted by GGM
lol
pluuuuuuus 1
aw come on GGM, i thought we had a reasonable and rational discussion earlier and found some common ground? can't be serious and not mock the hippies all the time!
ChemEnhanced
the protesters had a choice....move or get pepper sprayed. They made their decision so they have no one to blame but themselves.
Orko
The day people stop being surprised by police violence, is the day the country has gone to . I am happy I see people here and on the internet that are appalled by the violence against protesters.
The cops, nor bystanders were in danger. There was no reason to use a WEAPON.
If you like police brutality, go live in the Sudan.
Nick Cenik
quote:
Originally posted by Elendil
Told to move or be pepper sprayed? Why not simply "move or be arrested". I mean, isn't pepper spraying someone reserved for taking down violent or otherwise unruly individuals, rather than simply something you threaten with without proper physical justification?
I mean, how could spraying a bunch of students sitting down actually prevent a situation from escalating? When was the last time that someone committed an unnecessary violent act on you - say, punching you in the face - and actually prevented the situation from escalating?
I'm all for busting out the tasers, batons and whatever else is necessary if the officer is in danger or if the scenario generally warrants it, but I can't possibly see how this is one of those occasions.
quote:
Originally posted by Orko
The day people stop being surprised by police violence, is the day the country has gone to . I am happy I see people here and on the internet that are appalled by the violence against protesters.
The cops, nor bystanders were in danger. There was no reason to use a WEAPON.
+1.
Elendil
quote:
Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN
what do you mean 'outside its mandate'? police forces have been lawfully (and unlawfully) used as tools of public order for as long as police forces have existed. hell, marx will tell you the police are an instrument of the ruling class. if these people were real radicals they shouldn't be surprised by the outcome.
They are not adjudicators with a mandate to distribute punishment for infractions of justice. That is the duty of judges, who decide punishment in a court of law. The job of the police is to keep the peace and protect the citizenry, detaining unlawful individuals to be presented before a judge.
In this case, I cannot see how maintaining the peace required pepper spray to the face. These individuals looked anything but dangerous, and simply arresting them would have been more than adequate. Just because this isn't how it plays out does not mean it is to be accepted.
quote:
to the best of my knowledge no country's freedom of assembly laws allow people to protest whenever they want, however they want, and for as long as they want.
I'm not disagreeing with the fact that these individuals may have deserved to be arrested. I'm simply stating that the distribution of punishment, in essence on site adjudication, didn't seem to be justified given the nature of their "unlawful" behavior. Then again, having to move a couple steps around someone sitting on a park path is pretty frightening...
Yohan
quote:
Originally posted by Elendil
They are not adjudicators with a mandate to distribute punishment for infractions of justice. That is the duty of judges, who decide punishment in a court of law. The job of the police is to keep the peace and protect the citizenry, detaining unlawful individuals to be presented before a judge.
In this case, I cannot see how maintaining the peace required pepper spray to the face. These individuals looked anything but dangerous, and simply arresting them would have been more than adequate. Just because this isn't how it plays out does not mean it is to be accepted.
I'm not disagreeing with the fact that these individuals may have deserved to be arrested. I'm simply stating that the distribution of punishment, in essence on site adjudication, didn't seem to be justified given the nature of their "unlawful" behavior. Then again, having to move a couple steps around someone sitting on a park path is pretty frightening...
what we don't know is whether these police have been authorized prior to incident to use pepper spray. possibly, if these guys are specifically trained riot police
Judge Brown, however, said their freedom of speech could be conveyed without the use of tents or overnight stays.
“Protesters have ample means left to express their message, including continued use of the park (but no structures or “midnight hours”), and other Torontonians can resume their use of the park,” he wrote in the 54-page ruling.
The protesters are simply breaking the law, Judge Brown said in his decision.
“The Charter does not permit the protesters to take over public space without asking, exclude the rest of the public from enjoying their traditional use of that space, and then contend that they are under no obligation to leave.”
