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Kosovo - Independent Coutry...WTF?!?! (pg. 12)
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| afterhrsgurl |
| quote: | Originally posted by jsibilin
so Tito was a bad guy?? |
i would say NO but depends on which nationalist you ask lol |
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| zokissima |
| quote: | Originally posted by DJ Robben
i don't claim to know anything about this whole ordeal. Truthfully, i've never been to serbia, haven't really paid much attention to the region in a long long time.
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Thus your opinion, as much as you have a right to it, is kind of irrelevant. Not meaning to be rude or anything, but without any previous knowlege, how can you possibly have an idea?
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But i have lived in a country just pluck full of violence and hate crimes.
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I certainly hope you don't mean the United Kingdom...because that is incomparable. |
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| zokissima |
| quote: | Originally posted by Special K
- there were large scale massacres of non-communist croatians as well as anti-communists of other ethnic groups and if you were a catholic living in the former yugoslavia then life wasnt pretty for you.
good times. |
1) Dude, seriously, you just HAD to make it a Serb/Croatian thing didn't you? If we're at it, why don't we discuss what happened exactly before the close of WWII...you know...those times the Croats were allied with the Nazis and all...good times right. rolleyes:
2) What you stated above is skewed at best. But really, REALLY, should be kept out of this discussion, as that's where things just get ugly :) |
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| EvilTree |
| quote: | Originally posted by zokissima
I understand what you mean exactly. But I do not think that if a certain people or culture hold on to a specific land for the duration of their existence that they lose claim to that land... |
The thing is, Serbia didn't have much of a 'hold' on Kosovo, considering Kosovo had much autonomy under Yugo, and the fact that Serbs are quite outnumbered by Albanians.
If there is one Serb left on Kosovo, does that still mean Serbia has a 'hold' on Kosovo? Realistically?
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Yes, but your initial reaction was one of anger, by your own words, thus you have an idea of the anger felt by all Serbs now, and why. If Quebec were to have actually separated? Canada may have found itself in a very different position than one it holds how, and may find itself on the face of some serious social and economic problems further down the road, perhaps not even within our generation. |
happens. Learn to deal with it, or perish as society.
Am I going to be happy if Quebec separated? Of course not, and I'd do my best to ensure Quebec is isolated politically and economically from Canada, but life goes on.
| quote: | | I guess what I'm trying to say is that even if you disregard historical relevance, and stay strictly objective, this is not a good thing for anyone involved. This will only further segregate people, and create even more hatred and ultimately death for everyone involved. Declaring independance just because you happen to be a majority may seem like a 'democratic' movement, but really is just slow murder to the civilians involved, at least in this region, where historical precedent must be considered. |
I fail to see how Albanians weren't segregated from Serbia in Kosovo.
As for death and destruction, Yugoslavia separated and all the nations don't quite go off and killing each other. I realize Serbia and Kosovo isn't quite the same thing, but recognizing that the world won't let people go off and kill each other (at least, not in Europe) means I really doubt there will be another round of former Yugoslavia conflict again |
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| Ania_xox |
| quote: | Originally posted by DJ Robben
Wow, a little on the i've just sat on a hand grenade side isn't it?.
He's stating his opinion, and you call him disgusting?
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I went off. Post-communist transitions are a HUGE soft spot for me. I'm still really pissed at his moronic comment.
I am extremely annoyed by people who have this whole "sit back and judge" mindframe on these kinds of topics. You don't know and you won't know. You can read all the articles you want, watch every news channel so that your brain can piece together "unbiased" information so that you can become "well-informed" on a certain topic. That kind of information serves to create political opinions on general things.
Even if you are aware of the "bad that goes down" within a war torn area of the world - i.e. you've seen videos or pictures or heard accounts from primary sources such as civilians - your brain can't even FATHOM what it would be like to be in those situations. You don't have the mental capacity to understand it.
Yes, we all have the right to pass judgement and to state our opinions - but have some ing respect for the gravity of the situation you are judging. That kind of infuriates me. |
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| rabbitjoker |
| quote: | Originally posted by EvilTree
PS: RJ, dude. What's up with you man? Your posts need to be more clear, esp. in sensitive thread like this |
Ok, more clear. More clear:
With the collapse of Yugoslavia, most of the population migration was entirely involuntary - people were simply trying to escape the ensuing war and turmoil; old powers trying to hold on, new factions trying to create states, international influence, etc. The composition of the entire area has changed drastically (and continues to change) from the old communist days.
The Balkan region has been plagued with nationalistic violence, murder and genocide since the fall of communism (many would argue even longer) and every country in the region has had it's fair share savage leaders (and death of innocents). It's not isolated to one country, one religion, one people - they don't call it a powder keg for nothing.
Clear enough? |
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| Special K |
| quote: | Originally posted by zokissima
1) Dude, seriously, you just HAD to make it a Serb/Croatian thing didn't you?
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Im sorry but I fail to see how you derived that from what I said.
Someone brought up something to the effect of Tito being a good ruler of the area. I gave a different take on that. If you like my take on it then thats fine. If you choose to disagree with me than thats fine as well. |
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| jsibilin |
| quote: | Originally posted by zokissima
1) Dude, seriously, you just HAD to make it a Serb/Croatian thing didn't you? If we're at it, why don't we discuss what happened exactly before the close of WWII...you know...those times the Croats were allied with the Nazis and all...good times right. rolleyes:
2) What you stated above is skewed at best. But really, REALLY, should be kept out of this discussion, as that's where things just get ugly :) |
my grandfather was a german tank officer although he didn't like to tell any war stories, he liked to think of himself as a nazi spy because he new german & russian. From what my relatives and grandparents have told me ,, during those times of war, u either joined forces or faced the consequences.. u really had no choice..
I just hope ppl that are at risk find the opportunity to escape and flee the country! |
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| afterhrsgurl |
| quote: | Originally posted by Special K
Im sorry but I fail to see how you derived that from what I said.
Someone brought up something to the effect of Tito being a good ruler of the area. I gave a different take on that. If you like my take on it then thats fine. If you choose to disagree with me than thats fine as well. |
you must be one hardcore nationalist..oni najvise mrze titu :stongue: |
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| rabbitjoker |
| quote: | Originally posted by Ania_xox
You can read all the articles you want, watch every news channel so that your brain can piece together "unbiased" information so that you can become "well-informed" on a certain topic. That kind of information serves to create political opinions on general things. |
Get over yourself. |
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| Superstring |
| quote: | Originally posted by malek
I'm pretty sure Russia will recognize Kosovo in return of the recognition of South Ossetia and Abkhazia. |
This is the stupidest thing I've read in this thread.
If you do not know about the politics of the region (in this case, Eastern Europe), do not post crap.
To clarify: Russia will not go quietly without a fight on this. The reason? Russia is facing it's own separatist movement. If you notice, the ONLY countries supporting this thing are countries which do NOT face significant internal struggles.
Russia wants to stay an empire (and rightly so). If you let everyone form a country, you have chaos. In that respect, they are correct. |
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| EvilTree |
| quote: | Originally posted by Ania_xox
I went off. Post-communist transitions are a HUGE soft spot for me. I'm still really pissed at his moronic comment.
I am extremely annoyed by people who have this whole "sit back and judge" mindframe on these kinds of topics. You don't know and you won't know. You can read all the articles you want, watch every news channel so that your brain can piece together "unbiased" information so that you can become "well-informed" on a certain topic. That kind of information serves to create political opinions on general things.
Even if you are aware of the "bad that goes down" within a war torn area of the world - i.e. you've seen videos or pictures or heard accounts from primary sources such as civilians - your brain can't even FATHOM what it would be like to be in those situations. You don't have the mental capacity to understand it.
Yes, we all have the right to pass judgement and to state our opinions - but have some ing respect for the gravity of the situation you are judging. That kind of infuriates me. |
So, I can't have an opinion unless I experience it?
I'd argue that as someone who isn't emotionally attached to the issue, that my opinions aren't narrow and biased and looking at one issue only, and have more broader picture. (that is, if I actually take the time to learn about the issue) |
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