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Edm Genres? (pg. 34)
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| Xenocreator_PG_ |
| aboriginal tapping stick. old skool stylez! |
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| Aramis |
| quote: | Originally posted by tiesto14
YOu really are a reject...
It is a FACT that Hip-Hop is a culture....Rap is just part of that culture...Hip-Hop itself is not a genre...go do a Google search u twat. |
I'll have to assume that you are trying to say subculture. Don't forget to buy the endorsed merchandise, sucker :rolleyes: |
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| Hydarnes |
Lei,
As I expected, this debate has deteriorated into a definition war. I guess I’m going to have to be as explicit as I can be.
| quote: | Granted you can rap without background music, but it doesn't sound good. Rap is not music! It's a style of vocals that's inserted to hip-hop. Just like vocals isn't music, rap by it self isn't music. What is know as rap music is hip-hop with rap in it, just like trance with vocals...
No one said rap as a singing techinque should be EDM. Just like no one would say vocals in trance alone are great trance music... |
I'm going to be real simple about this, okay?:
Rap is A STYLE OF MUSIC. Just because there are two entities to "rapping" (with and without music), it shouldn't be very hard to notice that I'm specifically referring to the kind with background rhythmic accompaniment. The kind described in most dictionaries:
www.dictionary.com:
"rap music
n : genre of African-American music of the 1980s and 1990s in which rhyming lyrics are chanted to a musical accompaniment; several forms of rap have emerged [syn: rap, hip-hop]"
So now that we have established what "Rap" is, let us turn our attention to your multitudinous fallacies with regard to "hip-hop".
Of course, you would still like us to believe that Hip-Hop is a “musical” style, when it has been finally established that it is in fact NOT SO. It can only be regarded as "music" in the sense that it includes "Rap" in its culture. It is NOT MUSIC.
Let us see what our good ol' dictionary has to say on the matter:
"hip-hop
n.
A popular urban youth culture, closely associated with rap music and with the style and fashions of African-American inner-city residents.
Rap music."
| quote: | | You're arguments have to do with culture and subject of the music. And people claim that hip-hop is more than music and it's a way of life. Ok... it's still part music right? And the music part of it is definately EDM: |
What can I say, you’re wrong. Stating this with zeal isn’t going to make it so.
It’s quite unbelievable to me, that even in the face of overwhelming evidence screaming the very fact that this position is FLAT WRONG, some of you are actually continuing to fake a case about rap being “EDM”. TRANCE (for instance) REQUIRES ELECTRONIC ACCOMPANIMENT, RAP DOES NOT! ONE IS EDM, THE OTHER IS NOT. How many times do I have to state this before it sinks in?
Electronic sounds and synths do not characterize “rap”, THE RAPPING DOES. If Rap music can happen WITHOUT electronic accompaniment, then I’m afraid it CANNOT LOGICALLY be regarded as a REAL FORM OF EDM. That’s it! Fume all you want about it, but don’t try to sell us any more rubbish about it being EDM in the same sense as Trance, House and Techno.
Paranoik,
| quote: | | Thing is, rock isn't EDM because there is a solid musical base apart for electronic sounds and synthesizers. When they are used they are a bonus and not the "consistent" part of the sound that makes it rock. Rap is EDM because apart for the vocals, everything is electronic sounds and synthesizers. Maybe the vocals are the most important thing in a rap track, but it does rely on the electronics, as if you remove the electronic parts on it you get a lot less than if you remove the electronic parts on a rock track. |
False. Rap is produced by both electronic accompaniment as well as traditional instruments. Electronic sounds or synths have nothing to do with the life of Rap. It can continue without it. Obviously this can’t happen with any of the other EDM styles.
Starglider,
| quote: | You have delivered exactly zero proof.
Kindly provide the following:
Evidence of rap music that isn't electronically produced and sequenced.
Try to avoid pointless obfuscation. |
Happily!:
The Roots
K-OS
DL Incognito
Immortal Technique
Wyclef
All of these artists perform rap WITHOUT electronic sounds or synthesizers.
How many more do you need before you start realizing that you ain’t got a leg to stand on?
Ishkur,
| quote: | What ing evidence? You haven't given any! The only thing you've said after 80 bazillion pages is that the music isn't what you want it to be because you don't like it. That's been your argument the entire time. If you have an objective stipulation that can explain this, by all means...
PROVE IT |
Sheer baloney and you know it. The only individuals here esteeming prejudice and preference over hard logical facts are those that would deceive themselves into thinking that somehow rap falls into a perfectly harmonious category vis-à-vis the other EDM styles.
Using such huge hyperbolic font isn’t going to save you either. It only demonstrates your desperation.
| quote: | *sigh* you can't even remember your own arguments.
Earlier, in ONE post, you said: "that Rap and Hip-Hop DO NOT rely on electronic instruments to keep the musical style going. You can just as easily replace the background “electronic sounds” that are often used with instruments "
And then, in that same post, you said "Surprise! So do Trance, House and Techno sometimes use instruments!!" |
ROFL! What grammatical butchery you’ve volunteered to accomplish! How do you so effortlessly pull what I say out of context? Tell me, how on earth does me saying that rap doesn’t rely on electronic instruments HAVE ANYTHING to do with trance, house and techno NOT requiring electronic production? My subsequent statement was only saying that Trance house and Techno sometimes use instruments IN ADDITION to the electronics. IT WAS NOT SAYING, as you would deceptively have everyone believe, that Trance house and techno don’t rely on electronic production…..
| quote: | | Music that relies entirely on electronic instruments is electronic. I've said that since day 1. You pull the plug, the music stops. End of story, and this argument, which you lost umpteen pages ago. |
THANK YOU! Pull the plug, and you’ve still got rap. I had a little faith in there that you’d finally come around to admitting that Rap isn’t EDM. End of discussion! |
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| tiesto14 |
| quote: | Originally posted by Aramis
I'll have to assume that you are trying to say subculture. Don't forget to buy the endorsed merchandise, sucker :rolleyes: |
no it's a culture!
WHy would i buy anything?
Don;t u have to go watch Lleyton Hewitt fail miserably then stick it to your joey? |
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| Earthsnail |
| quote: | Originally posted by Hydarnes
But many of those styles are fused. Like Ambient Trance, then there's Progressive Trance and Euphoric Trance. :p Euphoric and ambient are probably interchangeable, and it's my fav style of Trance.
P.S. Umm...Don't include hip-hop, it's not EDM, it's related to rap. |
wtf...hip hop is edm...what do you think they make those beats with? All of that is EDM, hip hop has a lot to do with break beat too |
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| auranaut |
| quote: | Originally posted by Hydarnes
False. Rap is produced by both electronic accompaniment as well as traditional instruments. Electronic sounds or synths have nothing to do with the life of Rap. It can continue without it. Obviously this can’t happen with any of the other EDM styles.
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No, it can't go on without it. You're still ignoring the fact that rap, or whatever we're calling it now, is a variation of breaks and/or electro, which in turn is a sub-genre of EDM. Turntablism has always been a very big part of it, and guess what the music on the records is? Electronic. Even studio recorded rap albums are electronic. Just because whatever 50 Cent or Jay-Z music videos you watch don't focus on the electronic part, doesn't mean it isn't there. |
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| starglider |
| quote: | Originally posted by Hydarnes
Rap is A STYLE OF MUSIC. Just because there are two entities to "rapping" (with and without music), it shouldn't be very hard to notice that I'm specifically referring to the kind with background rhythmic accompaniment. |
Here you state we are considering rapping with musical accompiment, i.e., rap music.
| quote: | Originally posted by Hydarnes
TRANCE (for instance) REQUIRES ELECTRONIC ACCOMPANIMENT, RAP DOES NOT! ONE IS EDM, THE OTHER IS NOT. How many times do I have to state this before it sinks in? |
If we are referring to rap with "background rhythmic accompaniment" (your quote), then quite clearly rap does require electronic accompaniment.
| quote: | Originally posted by Hydarnes
Electronic sounds and synths do not characterize “rap”, THE RAPPING DOES. If Rap music can happen WITHOUT electronic accompaniment, then I’m afraid it CANNOT LOGICALLY be regarded as a REAL FORM OF EDM. |
You're contradicting yourself. As seen above, we are talking about rap with background rhythmic accompaniment. Rap is electronically produced and sequenced. This is a characteristic of rap.
| quote: | Originally posted by Hydarnes
False. Rap is produced by both electronic accompaniment as well as traditional instruments. |
Which traditional instruments are used in rap production? Which artists produce rap which relies solely on traditional instruments and is not sequenced?
| quote: | Originally posted by Hydarnes
THANK YOU! Pull the plug, and you’ve still got rap. I had a little faith in there that you’d finally come around to admitting that Rap isn’t EDM. End of discussion! |
No. Pull the plug and the music stops. It is electronically produced. Pull the plug and you have nothing but a person rapping -- an important form of expression -- but not rap music... as you established above. I quote you again:
"...it shouldn't be very hard to notice that I'm specifically referring to the kind with background rhythmic accompaniment."
Distinction noted. |
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| Hydarnes |
ROFL! I just gave you all a list of rap artists that perform WITHOUT electronic sounds or synths. What more is it going to take?
You guys are hilarious!
Okay Starglider, just give it up already...For your sake. |
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| auranaut |
| quote: | Originally posted by starglider
No. Pull the plug and the music stops. It is electronically produced. Pull the plug and you have nothing but a person rapping -- an important form of expression -- but not rap music... as you established above. |
Exactly. Rapping without instrumental accompaniment... I mean, does that even exist? Rapping slash MCing was just an idea to get the crowd going to the *BEATS* of the *DJ*, which is *ELECTRO* or *BREAKS*. |
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| Hydarnes |
| quote: | Originally posted by Earthsnail
wtf...hip hop is edm...what do you think they make those beats with? All of that is EDM, hip hop has a lot to do with break beat too |
And lo, another misinformed person joins the fray! :stongue: |
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| starglider |
| quote: | Originally posted by Hydarnes
ROFL! I just gave you all a list of rap artists that perform WITHOUT electronic sounds or synths. What more is it going to take?
You guys are hilarious! |
They may use live instrumentation, but they are still electronically sequenced, and they DO use electronically produced instrumentation to a certain extent. Give me an example of an album produced entirely without electronic production and/or sequencing. Or, failing that, address my points above. |
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| Hydarnes |
| quote: | Originally posted by auranaut
Exactly. Rapping without instrumental accompaniment... I mean, does that even exist? Rapping slash MCing was just an idea to get the crowd going to the *BEATS* of the *DJ*, which is *ELECTRO* or *BREAKS*. |
I'm not sure. But we do know that rap with traditional instruments (and without electronic sounds or synthesizers) does exist. |
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