"In Brief: This claim is based on a story published in an Italian newspaper Corriere Della Sera. But has the former Italian president really joined the truth movement? Not according to this translation:
“As I’ve been told, tomorrow or the day after tomorrow (interview appeared on 30 november 07) the most important chain of newspaper of our country should give the proof, with an exceptional scoop, that the video (which in reality is an audio tape, NdR) in which appear Osama, leader of “the great and powerful movement of islamic revenge Al Quaeda” - God bless him! - and in which are formulated threats to our ex president Berlusconi, is nothing more than a fake realized inside Mediaset studios (the huge television group owned by Berlusconi) in Milan and sent to arabic television Al Jazeera.
The trap was organized to create solidarity for Berlusconi, which is having lot of problem related for the tangle between RAI and Mediaset. From sources near to Palazzo Chigi, the nevralgic center of italian intelligence, we know that the video is fake because Osama admits that he was the mind behind the attacks against the twin towers, while all the democratic parties in Europe and USA know very well that the attack was organised by CIA and Mossad, whit the help of sionistic world, just to accuse arab countries and induce occident to intervein both in Iraq and Afghanistan. This is why nobody in parlament gave solidarity to Berlusconi, which is the author of the fake video" "
It's apparent that Cossiga was being sarcastic about the perceived tendency of the fevered Italian Left to blame everything on Berlusconi, Americans and so-called "Zionist" bogeymen.
But, Cossiga himself admits he is not a conspiracy theorist, see this article published in the Italian newspaper La Stampa.
He affirms, "I refuse the conspiracy theory, which is a smart and sometimes sincere contrafaction of reality caused by the fear of that (reality)".
And also: "Rembering how "open" american society is, I think it's very unlikely, I may say impossible, that 9/11 was an inside job".
The conclusions are apparent and obvious:
(1) Francesco Cossiga has a sense of humor
(2) He like ourselves, enjoys taking pokes at unhinged, nutbar conspiracy cranks
(3) Francesco Cossiga by his own empathic admission, definitely does not believe 9/11 was that tiresome cliche, "an inside job"
(4) The hoax peddled by the Alex Jones front [site] is a deliberate, Yellow Journalistic, sensationalistic, Tabloid fabrication
(5) Truther cultists are daft, lack a sense of humor; are ignorant and have no idea when they are being sent up, scorned, ridiculed and mocked
(6) Ignorant conspiracy devotees frequently poleaxe themselves by not fact-checking and posting articles which, far from supporting their crazy conspiracy schemes, make fun of or, completely demolish their irrational fantasies
see what happens when you just regurgitate anything and everything you read without first giving it its due attention?
{b.s.e.}
quote:
Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN
LOL. what is it with you guys on a constant rinse-repeat cycle? this has been posted numerous times.
cossiga wasn't saying what you're trying to make it sound like he said. he is a rightwing conservative politician and he was mocking the italian centre left (in his support of the current administration) and throwing out those comments in mockery.
i wish you guys would bother to research outside the BS tinfoil hat sites you swallow as gospel. if you'll notice, there isn't a single non-truther site that repeats this, because the truthers are the only ones that don't understand context.
and in any case, his opinion is irrelevant. lots of people believe in god, doesn't make them right.
mmmhmm. Responding to one point doesn't make you right, either.
And Building 7's collapse 20 minutes before it happened?
Why did the President lie?
pkcRAISTLIN
quote:
Originally posted by {b.s.e.}
And Building 7's collapse 20 minutes before it happened?
seriously, this rates right up there with the dumbest theories going around. truth is the first casualty of war. instead of asking such ridiculous questions, id prefer it if you could explain why the impossibly vast conspiracy was told to the BBC?
the BBC has come out and said they made a mistake. any other conclusion is fanciful nonsense.
edit: EVERYONE knew WTC7 was coming down. it had been on fire for about 6 hours at that stage, was groaning and was visibly deformed.
quote:
Originally posted by {b.s.e.}
Why did the President lie?
he's a politician? he was in damage control? he's not very smart? take your pick! nobody ever said george wasn't a blight on the office of the president.
Trancer-X
quote:
Originally posted by ogvh5150
it's been a while but the more things change the more they stay the same. Like this post. I thought this thing was gonna die or be locked but it hasn't. Sure there a gnomes and trolls that wish it to be closed for only they can be the sheep that listens to the official story. They refuse to use those inquisitive axions and neurons that make their feeble minds work to find what Sherlock Holmes had said “When you have eliminated all which is impossible, then whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth.”
The poll numbers don't lie either.
Thanks to those for or against the official story that keep this post and it's poll alive.
It's been a while, man! Are you off from your hiatus or are you just stopping by to say hello? lol
Trancer-X
quote:
Originally posted by {b.s.e.}
mmmhmm. Responding to one point doesn't make you right, either.
And Building 7's collapse 20 minutes before it happened?
Why did the President lie?
There's a lot more to it than that, my friend!
Apparently, according to the late Barry Jennings (Deputy Director of NY Emergency Services Department),
WTC building 7's lower floors were demolished WELL BEFORE the Twin Towers ever came down.
{b.s.e.}
quote:
Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN
seriously, this rates right up there with the dumbest theories going around. truth is the first casualty of war. instead of asking such ridiculous questions, id prefer it if you could explain why the impossibly vast conspiracy was told to the BBC?
the BBC has come out and said they made a mistake. any other conclusion is fanciful nonsense.
edit: EVERYONE knew WTC7 was coming down. it had been on fire for about 6 hours at that stage, was groaning and was visibly deformed.
ing apologist, lol
i believe that pwns your stupid ass.
quote:
he's a politician? he was in damage control? he's not very smart? take your pick! nobody ever said george wasn't a blight on the office of the president.
damage control? of what? i know he's a ing idiot. the official story is that he learned about 9-11 only after the second plane hit the towers.. yet he goes on blissfully about seeing it happen on the television while he was waiting to go into the classroom. he can't keep his story straight, otherwise he'd have no problem recalling the one truth. So is the offical story lying, or is Bush lying?
{b.s.e.}
This is so futile. Why bother with these s? :wtf:
pkcRAISTLIN
especially for you BSE, and your obvious cossiga bull.
10 characteristics of conspiracy theorists
A useful guide by Donna Ferentes
7. Inability to withdraw. It's a rare day indeed when a conspiracy theorist admits that a claim they have made has turned out to be without foundation, whether it be the overall claim itself or any of the evidence produced to support it. Moreover they have a liking (see 3. above) for the technique of avoiding discussion of their claims by "swamping" - piling on a whole lot more material rather than respond to the objections sceptics make to the previous lot.
Trancer-X
quote:
REPORTER:
"Barry Jennings, you were on the 8th floor. You work for the City Housing Department. Explain to me the moment of impact."
BARRY JENNINGS:
"Well, me and Mr. Hess, the corporation counsel were on the 23rd floor. I told him, ‘We gotta get out of here.’ We started walking down the stairs. We made it to the 8th floor. Big explosion. Blew us back into the 8th floor, and I turned to Hess. I said, ‘this is it; we’re dead. We’re not gonna make it out of here.’ I took a fire extinguisher and I bust the window out. That’s when this gentleman here heard my cries for help. This gentleman right here. And he kept saying, ‘Stand by. Somebody’s coming to get you.’ They couldn’t get to us for an hour because they couldn’t find us."
REPORTER:
"You thought that was it."
JENNINGS:
"I thought we were dead. I thought that was it. I started praying to Allah. I said, ‘That’s it; we’re gone.’"
Thursday, September 18 2008 The 9/11 Interview with Michael Hess:
Evidence that NIST Lied about When He and Barry Jennings Were Rescued
by David Ray Griffin
September 17, 2008
Shortly after the first strike on the World Trade Center, which occurred at 8:46 AM on 9/11, Michael Hess, New York City's corporation counsel, and Barry Jennings, the deputy director of the Emergency Services Department of the New York City Housing Authority, headed to the Office of Emergency Management's Emergency Operating Center, which was on the 23rd floor of WTC 7, where they assumed that Mayor Rudy Giuliani would be. But when Hess and Jennings arrived, the place was empty. Jennings then telephoned someone to ask what they should do and was told that they should leave immediately. Finding that the elevators would not work, they started down the stairs. When they reached the sixth floor, however, there was a powerful explosion beneath them, which, Jennings told the makers of Loose Change Final Cut,1 caused the landing on which they were standing to give way. Making their way back up to the eighth floor, they were able to break a window and call for help. Hess later reported: "[W]e were trapped on the eighth floor with smoke, thick smoke, all around us, for about an hour and a half [before] the New York Fire Department . . . came and got us out."2
Hess made this statement while being interviewed by Frank Ucciardo of UPN 9 News "on Broadway about a block from City Hall," almost a half mile from WTC 7. This interview began before noon, most likely at 11:34. The conclusion that it began at 11:34 is based on evidence derived from a DVD containing UPN 9 programs from that morning, in which the Hess interview begins at the 57-minute mark. According to a note on the DVD itself, its video began at 10:37 AM, which would mean that the Hess interview began at 11:34. It is possible, however, that the video might have actually started at 11:00: At the 111-minute mark, the UPN 9 program switched to live coverage by CNN of a Taliban news conference, and the only reference we have been able to find to this coverage indicates that it began at 12:51.3 This would mean that the video began at 11:00 and the Hess interview, therefore, at 11:57. Nevertheless, whether the earlier or the later starting time is correct, UPN 9 News began interviewing Michael Hess before noon.
However, NIST---the National Institute of Standards and Technology---which was tasked with providing the official explanation of the collapse of the Twin Towers and WTC 7, claimed that the two men were rescued at "12:10 to 12:15 PM."4 Why might NIST have made this claim? The reason becomes evident in another NIST document's statement about Hess and Jennings, which begins:
"With the collapse of the two towers, a New York City employee and a WTC 7 building staff person became trapped inside of WTC 7. The two had gone to the OEM center on the 23rd floor and found no one there. As they went to get into an elevator to go downstairs the lights inside of WTC 7 flickered as WTC 2 collapsed. At this point, the elevator they were attempting to catch no longer worked, so they started down the staircase."5
According to NIST, therefore, Hess and Jennings, upon finding the OEM center vacated, started downstairs just after 9:59, when the second tower collapsed. It was this collapse, NIST suggested, that was responsible for the elevator's failure to work.
As we saw earlier, however, Jennings said that they had arrived at the OEM center shortly after the strike on the North Tower, hence around 9:00 AM. He added, in fact, that he had to have been on the 23rd floor "when the second plane hit" (which was at 9:03).6 Besides contradicting Jennings' testimony on that point, the NIST account went on to say:
"When they got to the 6th floor, WTC 1 [the North Tower] collapsed, the lights went out in the staircase, the sprinklers came on briefly, and the staircase filled with smoke and debris. The two men went back to the 8th floor broke out a window and called for help."7
According to NIST, therefore, what Hess and Jennings took to be an explosion in WTC 7 was really just an effect of the collapse of the North Tower. That collapse occurred at 10:28. Accordingly, if the two men were then trapped for about 90 minutes before they were rescued, this rescue must have occurred at about noon---hence NIST's claim that they were rescued at "12:10 to 12:15 PM."
NIST's timeline is clearly implausible. Claiming that Hess and Jennings started down the stairs after the collapse of the South Tower caused the elevator to fail, NIST implies that it took them 29 minutes---from 9:59 to 10:28---to descend from the 23rd floor to the 6th floor.
NIST's timeline is also directly contradicted by the testimony of Jennings, who said: "After getting to the 8th floor everything was dark . . . . [B]oth buildings were still standing. Because I looked . . . one way, looked the other way. . . . [B]oth buildings were still standing."8
The strongest evidence against NIST's timeline, however, is Hess's interview with UPN 9 News. Defenders of the official account, according to which there were no explosions in WTC 7, might challenge the truth of Jennings's testimony. But if Hess was giving an interview almost a half mile away before noon, then NIST's timeline, according to which the two men were not rescued until after noon, is objectively disproved. This is the case whether we accept the 11:34 or the 11:57 starting time for this interview.
Given the fact that the interview occurred almost a half mile from the WTC, it would probably have taken Hess at least a half hour to get there after he was rescued (he surely would have talked to firefighters and other officials about the ordeal before taking off). So if the interview began at 11:34, he and Jennings would have been rescued before 11:05. If the interview began at 11:57, they would have been rescued before 11:30.
In either case, NIST's explanation for the event that Hess and Jennings took to be a massive explosion in WTC 7 itself is disproved. If the two men were rescued before 11:05 after having been trapped, as Hess said, for about 90 minutes, the event must have occurred before 9:35. Even if they were not rescued until closer to 11:30, the event must have occurred at least by 10:00. In either case, the event could not have been the collapse of the North Tower, which did not occur until 10:28.
That said, I endorse the earlier times---11:34 for the beginning of the Hess interview, 11:05 or earlier for the rescue, and 9:35 or earlier for the explosion---for three reasons. First, the note on the DVD says that the video started at 11:34. Second, the account by Hess and Jennings suggests that they would have reached the 6th floor, where the landing was knocked out from under them, at about 9:15. Third, whereas the later times would suggest that this event occurred around 10:00, Jennings stated, as we saw, that after the explosion occurred and he and Hess made it back up to the 8th floor, the South Tower, which collapsed at 9:59, was still standing.
As I pointed out in The New Pearl Harbor Revisited, a BBC special on WTC 7 that aired July 6, 2008 ("The Conspiracy Files: 9/11--The Third Tower"), distorted Jennings' testimony. Although he evidently told the BBC interviewer the same story he had earlier told to the makers of Loose Change Final Cut, the BBC placed his testimony within the time-framework suggested by NIST. So, after playing footage in which Jennings described a massive explosion in WTC 7 (which was probably at about 9:15), the BBC says: "At 10:28, the North Tower collapses. . . . Tower 7 takes a direct hit. . . . Early evidence of explosives were just debris from a falling skyscraper."9
However, Jennings will apparently not be available to correct the record. Jennings, 53 years old, evidently died in August 2008, reportedly only a few days before NIST issued its report on WTC 7.10
In any case, UPN 9's interview of Michael Hess is now publicly available, thanks to Dylan Avery, who made a copy of it available, and Fred Burks, who posted it at The Transformation Team (click here).
NOTES
1 This interview was not included in Loose Change Final Cut at Jennings' request, after he had, he said, received threats to his job. But after Jennings participated in a BBC documentary about WTC 7 ("The Conspiracy Files: 9/11--The Third Tower"), Dylan Avery, who had conducted the interview, put it on the Internet: "Barry Jennings Uncut," Loose Change 911, July 9, 2008 (http://www.loosechange911.com/blog/?p=105). The term "uncut" in that title alludes to the fact that extracts from this interview had already been posted on the Internet. The interview is also included in a video, Fabled Enemies, produced by Jason Bermas, another member of the Loose Change team.
2 For documentation of the information provided in this article, see Chapter 1 of David Ray Griffin, The New Pearl Harbor Revisited: 9/11, the Cover-Up, and the Exposé (Northampton: Olive Branch, 2008), 45-48.
5 NIST NCSTAR 1-8, Federal Building and Fire Safety Investigation of the World Trade Center Disaster: The Emergency Response Operations (http://wtc.nist.gov/NISTNCSTAR1-8.pdf), Section 5.9.
6 Quoted in Griffin, The New Pearl Harbor Revisited, 46.
7 NIST NCSTAR 1-8: Section 5.9
8 Quoted in Griffin, The New Pearl Harbor Revisited, 46.
9 Ibid., 276-77 n184.
10 Aaron Dykes, "Key Witness to WTC 7 Explosions Dead at 53," Infowars.com, September 16, 2008 (http://www.infowars.com/?p=4602).
Originally posted by {b.s.e.}
This is so futile. Why bother with these s? :wtf:
For real dude. It's just a waste of your time and theirs.
Trancer-X
quote:
Originally posted by shaolin_Z
For real dude. It's just a waste of your time and theirs.
Not necessarily. The more that I delve into the subject the more that I keep learning about it - and I LOVE learning :p
Trancer-X
quote:
Hess made this statement while being interviewed by Frank Ucciardo of UPN 9 News "on Broadway about a block from City Hall," almost a half mile from WTC 7. This interview began before noon, most likely at 11:34. The conclusion that it began at 11:34 is based on evidence derived from a DVD containing UPN 9 programs from that morning, in which the Hess interview begins at the 57-minute mark. According to a note on the DVD itself, its video began at 10:37 AM, which would mean that the Hess interview began at 11:34. It is possible, however, that the video might have actually started at 11:00: At the 111-minute mark, the UPN 9 program switched to live coverage by CNN of a Taliban news conference, and the only reference we have been able to find to this coverage indicates that it began at 12:51.3 This would mean that the video began at 11:00 and the Hess interview, therefore, at 11:57. Nevertheless, whether the earlier or the later starting time is correct, UPN 9 News began interviewing Michael Hess before noon.
